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Hi All...let me jump in here and run a tangent...there are so many posts on this thread that it's difficult for me to go through them all...so forgive me if this has already been answered on the forum here...

 

As of August 1, I tapered another .25 mg of Valium, and am now down to 4 mgs (2 mgs AM, 2 mgs PM)...I started tapering in January at 7.5 mgs.  I was quite ill for the first few months of the year, but things settled to a tolerable degree by April.

 

I am exhausted...I cannot think straight...I am nauseated and/or queasy most of the day, although I do eat. I can't seem to catch my breath...even when I'm just sitting...generalized anxiety seems to be my friend right now...and I cry easily.  I have episodes of itching, and I've now started having restless leg symptoms in the early evening.  I'm starting to have short episodes of disorientation/vertigo again.  It's not as bad as it was in the beginning of the year, but I can feel it creeping back.  Meclizine does help some with the vertigo.  And I do have some short 'windows' of good moments here and there.  But overall, I just feel sickly.  Side note - I was prescribed Valium to help with vertigo from Meniere's Disease, and I've been taking it at the 7.5 (sometimes 10 mgs) daily dose for 10 years.

 

I really want to try to keep going with my taper, but part of me wonders if I should hold for another month.  I have lupus and I am currently in a flare, so that isn't helping things.  Should I bite the bullet and try to continue my taper and see what happens?  I see my rheumatologist in another month, and I might have to go on Cellcept, which is a type of chemotherapy.  I have lots of 'layers' of stuff going on, so I'm not sure what to do going forward.  My rheumatologist is the one who is supporting me fully on my taper, and she's letting me decide what works for me, so I'm grateful for that.

 

Is there anyone with chronic illness issues going through a taper right now? 

 

Thoughts?  Insults?  Complements?  Anyone?  Thanks!  :)

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libr - that sound like loads of fun and memories to cherish! I was in school when the last one came around in the late 1970's.  be careful and enjoy!!! :smitten:

Thanks kasey- the eclipse was SPECTACULAR!!  My kids loved it too.

Our eyes should be fine as I was OCD about the glasses. :)

 

 

Anyone here know how long it takes to become dependent on opioids? I posted in the Othrr Meds group too but I mostly come to this thread.... It's not for me but for my dad who injured his shoulder after a fall. He's never taken opioids (or benzo) before but I'm worried about dependency esp with my short term, low dose benzo use leading to severe dependency. He's not generally as sensitive to meds as I am but given we share half my genetic material...

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Libr - so glad you guys had fun today! As for your dad's situation, this is a simple suggestion to look into if you like. Some find that they prefer to do a safe dose of Naprosyn and tylenol combination as opposed to an opioid. Perhaps this may be a safer alternative with fewer side effects for him. Please seek medical advice about this as i am not a physician and i would not want to cause harm to anyone.  There others on here who can offer better advice as well.  :smitten:
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libr - that sound like loads of fun and memories to cherish! I was in school when the last one came around in the late 1970's.  be careful and enjoy!!! :smitten:

Thanks kasey- the eclipse was SPECTACULAR!!  My kids loved it too.

Our eyes should be fine as I was OCD about the glasses. :)

 

 

Anyone here know how long it takes to become dependent on opioids? I posted in the Othrr Meds group too but I mostly come to this thread.... It's not for me but for my dad who injured his shoulder after a fall. He's never taken opioids (or benzo) before but I'm worried about dependency esp with my short term, low dose benzo use leading to severe dependency. He's not generally as sensitive to meds as I am but given we share half my genetic material...

opiates... Dependent on dose vs actual pain levels, (and much more)

My best guess would be more than 3weeks... -less than 3 months...

-easy test... Stop use for 3 days... -if its bad, discontinue as days 3-5 are the worst..

(Advice from personal experience only)..

 

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Hi All...let me jump in here and run a tangent...there are so many posts on this thread that it's difficult for me to go through them all...so forgive me if this has already been answered on the forum here...

 

As of August 1, I tapered another .25 mg of Valium, and am now down to 4 mgs (2 mgs AM, 2 mgs PM)...I started tapering in January at 7.5 mgs.  I was quite ill for the first few months of the year, but things settled to a tolerable degree by April.

 

I am exhausted...I cannot think straight...I am nauseated and/or queasy most of the day, although I do eat. I can't seem to catch my breath...even when I'm just sitting...generalized anxiety seems to be my friend right now...and I cry easily.  I have episodes of itching, and I've now started having restless leg symptoms in the early evening.  I'm starting to have short episodes of disorientation/vertigo again.  It's not as bad as it was in the beginning of the year, but I can feel it creeping back.  Meclizine does help some with the vertigo.  And I do have some short 'windows' of good moments here and there.  But overall, I just feel sickly.  Side note - I was prescribed Valium to help with vertigo from Meniere's Disease, and I've been taking it at the 7.5 (sometimes 10 mgs) daily dose for 10 years.

 

I really want to try to keep going with my taper, but part of me wonders if I should hold for another month.  I have lupus and I am currently in a flare, so that isn't helping things.  Should I bite the bullet and try to continue my taper and see what happens?  I see my rheumatologist in another month, and I might have to go on Cellcept, which is a type of chemotherapy.  I have lots of 'layers' of stuff going on, so I'm not sure what to do going forward.  My rheumatologist is the one who is supporting me fully on my taper, and she's letting me decide what works for me, so I'm grateful for that.

 

Is there anyone with chronic illness issues going through a taper right now? 

 

Thoughts?  Insults?  Complements?  Anyone?  Thanks!  :)

BUMP..??
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libr - that sound like loads of fun and memories to cherish! I was in school when the last one came around in the late 1970's.  be careful and enjoy!!! :smitten:

Thanks kasey- the eclipse was SPECTACULAR!!  My kids loved it too.

Our eyes should be fine as I was OCD about the glasses. :)

 

 

Anyone here know how long it takes to become dependent on opioids? I posted in the Othrr Meds group too but I mostly come to this thread.... It's not for me but for my dad who injured his shoulder after a fall. He's never taken opioids (or benzo) before but I'm worried about dependency esp with my short term, low dose benzo use leading to severe dependency. He's not generally as sensitive to meds as I am but given we share half my genetic material...

He's tried Tylenol and it didn't do a thing for the pain. He can't take naprosyn or other anti-inflammatories bc they are also blood thinners and he's already on 2 blood thinners (plavix and aspirin) for his heart. He just started the Vicodin yesterday and it helped some but not a lot. He injured the biceps tendon. I don't think he would need the opioids for more than a wk or so and maybe I can have him use it just at bedtime. Even if he gets something stronger than Vicodin, this usage should be ok, right?

 

Can't- thanks for your input too.

I'm just paranoid about these meds now of course.

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About opiods; I injured my back and eventually had surgery, spending two months in terrible pain. I took a high dose of Percocet and benzos, which still did not end the pain. After the surgery I recovered and had no trouble tapering off the Percocet in about a month or less. It was the benzos that gave me hell, and when I finally found out what was wrong it took me two-and-a-half years to jump. I'm still having sx 7 weeks after jumping.

 

MirandaJane

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About opiods; I injured my back and eventually had surgery, spending two months in terrible pain. I took a high dose of Percocet and benzos, which still did not end the pain. After the surgery I recovered and had no trouble tapering off the Percocet in about a month or less. It was the benzos that gave me hell, and when I finally found out what was wrong it took me two-and-a-half years to jump. I'm still having sx 7 weeks after jumping.

 

MirandaJane

correct, The real problem with opiates is the physical damage done when on insane high doses, constantly, long term, in a situation like I was...

Even constant recreational abuse (getting high) doesnt come close... -Thats why most say getting off was "easy"  But who ends up on my doses for 6 years..?? So I dont begin to compare my total situation to others experiences... Yet still the benzos are the ones that rattled me, stopped me in my tracks...

Too many people worry unnecessarily about prescribed opiates... but if they have had the benzo experience, why wouldnt they... But some suffer pain when they needent...

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Tho I have been on the forum a while, simple question pls - ( i keep forgetting to ask) what does the word 'bump' mean? thx

It means bumping the thread or post back to the top results. :)--V

 

http://i.ehow.com/images/a04/j8/2a/should-bump-forum-thread-1.2-800X800.jpg

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Well...either I'm confused or I'm invisible...not sure which...

 

I keep checking the boards to see if anyone has responded to my serious question, but apparently I'm out here on my own...bummer.

 

I'll be looking for support on a different board...sorry, guys...I thought this place was different...

 

Bye....  :-\

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  GS Girl,  So sorry your post got lost in the shuffle.  Please don't leave, someone will come along and help you soon now that your post is on top again.  I also have other issues and am in Pain Management so other meds blur the picture for me.  If it were me, I would hold for a while and see how you feel.  Please discuss with your Dr.  Sorry you are dealing with LUpus also, it is so hard when we have other conditions to deal with.  Mine are spinal and others and pain brings me so down.  I held for a long time and it didn't really help me but most seem to do better if they hold when things start to go south.  Good luck and hope you feel better soon.
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GS so sorry that no one has answered you, at one time this thread was very active, not so much anymore, I do not come here anymore. But reading your post made me feel badly for you. I do not have any pain issues, and I am so sorry you are dealing with so much. I agree with Free to hold and let things calm down. I am certain some one will answer and may be able to guide you to another group. Please know here at BB we are here for each other, somehow your post was not read, slowing of buddies here. I hope that things get better for you. Stay Strong.  I am leaving a link, perhaps you can get more answers there.

 

                                                    http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=128947.0

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Well...either I'm confused or I'm invisible...not sure which...

 

I keep checking the boards to see if anyone has responded to my serious question, but apparently I'm out here on my own...bummer.

 

I'll be looking for support on a different board...sorry, guys...I thought this place was different...

 

Bye....  :-\

Fair Call...

 

There are many aspects to your situation that I have no understanding of... Was hoping others might have...

If Free and Begood both think holding a good thing to consider, then thats a great recommendation in my books... And I happen to agree...

Things caught up on me, and tapering just isnt liniar anyway, but holding and/or dose correcting has served me well... I taper guided by symptoms now, which seems to cater for my other complications too... I hope for you also...

 

Slowing as one gets lower often helps too...

 

You seem to have a lot on your plate, so do be gentle on yourself.. -less stress -faster recovery...

 

Glad your Dr will allow a sensible taper plan... Thats great!!

 

Keep posting, or sing out with any questions... whats normal to one is new to another..

 

My best...

 

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Hi All...let me jump in here and run a tangent...there are so many posts on this thread that it's difficult for me to go through them all...so forgive me if this has already been answered on the forum here...

 

As of August 1, I tapered another .25 mg of Valium, and am now down to 4 mgs (2 mgs AM, 2 mgs PM)...I started tapering in January at 7.5 mgs.  I was quite ill for the first few months of the year, but things settled to a tolerable degree by April.

 

I am exhausted...I cannot think straight...I am nauseated and/or queasy most of the day, although I do eat. I can't seem to catch my breath...even when I'm just sitting...generalized anxiety seems to be my friend right now...and I cry easily.  I have episodes of itching, and I've now started having restless leg symptoms in the early evening.  I'm starting to have short episodes of disorientation/vertigo again.  It's not as bad as it was in the beginning of the year, but I can feel it creeping back.  Meclizine does help some with the vertigo.  And I do have some short 'windows' of good moments here and there.  But overall, I just feel sickly.  Side note - I was prescribed Valium to help with vertigo from Meniere's Disease, and I've been taking it at the 7.5 (sometimes 10 mgs) daily dose for 10 years.

 

I really want to try to keep going with my taper, but part of me wonders if I should hold for another month.  I have lupus and I am currently in a flare, so that isn't helping things.  Should I bite the bullet and try to continue my taper and see what happens?  I see my rheumatologist in another month, and I might have to go on Cellcept, which is a type of chemotherapy.  I have lots of 'layers' of stuff going on, so I'm not sure what to do going forward.  My rheumatologist is the one who is supporting me fully on my taper, and she's letting me decide what works for me, so I'm grateful for that.

 

Is there anyone with chronic illness issues going through a taper right now? 

 

Thoughts?  Insults?  Complements?  Anyone?  Thanks!  :)

Hi GsGirl, I'm sorry your post went unanswered. I too have co-morbid conditions... fibromyalgia, chronic pain, neuropathy, etc. from a failed back surgery being some of many. Withdrawal is hard enough on the body and mind as it is without adding in pre-existing conditions. Generally speaking, a more gentle approach to tapering (i.e., a symptom-based taper) is your best bet for success. I went back and read some of your posts. Am I correct...that you've dropped .50 mgs since July 30? If so, and considering your escalating symptoms, my recommendation would be to hold until you stabilize. Biting the bullet and continuing to taper in the face of worsening symptoms may lead to needless suffering. Why the rush? Throw out the calendar and allow your body to catch up. Then resume tapering at a pace that is more comfortable for you. That's my two cents for whatever it's worth.

 

I hope you feel better soon, Left  :)

 

Hey there Cant...you will always type faster than me...

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I have just started a micro taper of diazepam and am now on day 5 (dry cutting 0.003 every 3rd day) and I have the same symptoms I have had approx 4/5 days after a cut and hold, while they aren't quite as strong they are still there, is this normal and are they likely to remain at this level all the way down given that you are effectively cutting every couple of days? I guess I had hoped, probably naively, that I wouldn't feel quite so bad using this method, or does your body need to settle into this new way of cutting the dose?  Feeling a little confused and sad. :(

 

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I have just started a micro taper of diazepam and am now on day 5 (dry cutting 0.003 every 3rd day) and I have the same symptoms I have had approx 4/5 days after a cut and hold, while they aren't quite as strong they are still there, is this normal and are they likely to remain at this level all the way down given that you are effectively cutting every couple of days? I guess I had hoped, probably naively, that I wouldn't feel quite so bad using this method, or does your body need to settle into this new way of cutting the dose?  Feeling a little confused and sad. :(

you are right... The change can be a bit unstable for some people.. Many just treat the change over as a cut, and hold on the initial dose a few weeks... some may do a slight updose to start...

Many have no problems either...

I would suggest holding... -as whenever things start to feel worse...

:)

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Hi cantfly- thanks, I might have known, none of this is easy - we seem to be on a constant learning curve, good to know the change in approach needs time and perhaps a hold, I will see what tomorrow brings. Wondering when the easy bit comes - I am smiling as I write this as I know that is a silly question! :laugh:
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I have just started a micro taper of diazepam and am now on day 5 (dry cutting 0.003 every 3rd day) and I have the same symptoms I have had approx 4/5 days after a cut and hold, while they aren't quite as strong they are still there, is this normal and are they likely to remain at this level all the way down given that you are effectively cutting every couple of days? I guess I had hoped, probably naively, that I wouldn't feel quite so bad using this method, or does your body need to settle into this new way of cutting the dose?  Feeling a little confused and sad. :(

For some of us it takes a little time to adjust to a new taper routine, whether it be cut and hold, micro-cuts or a daily micro taper (that was the case for me anyway). Or perhaps your previous cuts have caught up to you...Valium is tricky that way. A brief hold will cause no harm and may help you figure out what is what.

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Hi cantfly- thanks, I might have known, none of this is easy - we seem to be on a constant learning curve, good to know the change in approach needs time and perhaps a hold, I will see what tomorrow brings. Wondering when the easy bit comes - I am smiling as I write this as I know that is a silly question! :laugh:

Sorry Blue, I made a mistake... I was talking about liquid, as that was my experience... I did a very slack read of your post as I woke up... my bad... and I am sorry...

:(

 

But Left Behind did a much better job... and I would tend to agree...

-Good Catch LB...

:)

 

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Hey dear Benzobuddies,

 

I am quite confused about the way in which Diazepam acts on our bodies. I mean, the terminal elimination half-life of the active metabolite N-desmethyldiazepam is up to 100 hours. If one would be dosing daily, wouldn't that mean some overlap, in that the Diazepam accumulates and that eventually you'll get to a point where Diazepam is several times more concentrated in your blood than the indended dose?

 

I'm am currently on a short-acting benzo equivalent to 7.5mg of Valium. I think of substituting, but I don't really understand this aspect and I want to avoid doing more damage to my brain with a higher dose, as I am already extremly ill.

 

Sending you all my love.

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Hey dear Benzobuddies,

 

I am quite confused about the way in which Diazepam acts on our bodies. I mean, the terminal elimination half-life of the active metabolite N-desmethyldiazepam is up to 100 hours. If one would be dosing daily, wouldn't that mean some overlap, in that the Diazepam accumulates and that eventually you'll get to a point where Diazepam is several times more concentrated in your blood than the indended dose?

I'm am currently on a short-acting benzo equivalent to 7.5mg of Valium. I think of substituting, but I don't really understand this aspect and I want to avoid doing more damage to my brain with a higher dose, as I am already extremly ill.

 

Sending you all my love.

 

I won't bore you with the math, but the accumulated concentration will be approx 8 X the daily dose.

 

But that long half-life and gradual accumulation is one of the major reasons that diazepam is typically easier to taper.  Just as it gradually accumulates,  it also gradually diminishes as you lower your dose.  Diazepam is sometimes called a "self-tapering" benzo.

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Hey dear Benzobuddies,

 

I am quite confused about the way in which Diazepam acts on our bodies. I mean, the terminal elimination half-life of the active metabolite N-desmethyldiazepam is up to 100 hours. If one would be dosing daily, wouldn't that mean some overlap, in that the Diazepam accumulates and that eventually you'll get to a point where Diazepam is several times more concentrated in your blood than the indended dose?

I'm am currently on a short-acting benzo equivalent to 7.5mg of Valium. I think of substituting, but I don't really understand this aspect and I want to avoid doing more damage to my brain with a higher dose, as I am already extremly ill.

 

Sending you all my love.

 

I won't bore you with the math, but the accumulated concentration will be approx 8 X the daily dose.

 

But that long half-life and gradual accumulation is one of the major reasons that diazepam is typically easier to taper.  Just as it gradually accumulates,  it also gradually diminishes as you lower your dose.  Diazepam is sometimes called a "self-tapering" benzo.

 

So Builder ... What I'm confused about is , if we don't reduce and just keep taking the same amount of Valium every day , would it keep building up more ? Or does the 7 X amount take that into acount  ? I guess it must .

Thanks!

MiYu

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It will peak at about 8X daily dose.  And of course, that will vary some based on individual metabolism.

 

And when you taper, since your daily dose is dropping, the actual level represented by that 8X is also declining.

 

For example, if your daily dose is 5mg, then your accumulated amount might be 40mg.  But when you have tapered down to 1mg, then your accumulated amount will be approx 8mg.  The closer you get to zero, the lower the accumulated level will be.  And once you jump, your body will still gradually release the remainder.

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