Valium/Diazepam Support Group

Second day with no Ativan! Tiny amount of temple pain, and I don't think I had even one stabbing pain in my ear or stomach. Woo hoo! Third day is usually the one that's tough, but it's my day off, so at least there's that.

 

I agree about Valium being more of a downer in general, but it gives the same anxiety relief as Ativan. I don't find it to be an extremely depressing thing, just lacking the uplifting quality that Ativan has. But without it, I personally don't know if I could have ever gotten off the A. I was tapering pretty slowly the first time down and it became a real nightmare. The V has made it almost symptom-free. Almost. 

 

Ativan wasn't uplifting for me, at all. It made me super depressed.

Hi

  I am fairly new here and trying to build up the courage to start my taper, i read the ashton taper plan and am thinking 1mg per day for 1-2 weeks at a time.

 

My gp is clueless and psychiatrist wants me to cut 5mg per day but isn't bothered if I stay on it, it's ridiculous, I am going to print off what I have read from the Ashton manual and show them.

 

I have been on diazepam for 17, maybe even 18 years, for the first 7 years the dose was increased now and then, it went from 6mg per day to 18mg per day then in November I had a 'breakdown', stupidly accepted a 2mg increase 4 weeks ago which just causes me to feel unsteady but of course the doctors insist it's anxiety doing that.

 

My 'breakdown' was in my opinion caused simply by tolerance withdrawal, never in my life have I spent hours on end sweating profusely, shaking, heart pounding and running to the loo 10 times in one day not to mention the dry retching.

 

Awake every hour with panic and it has me up in the early hours so now I am exhausted too, depressed and having to force myself to leave the house because suddenly I am terrified of it and when I do go I feel scared, overwhelmed, panicky and so unsteady on my feet, it's awful,clinging to my husband's arm and walking around like a robot and feeling like my legs are giving way.

 

My husband finally believes me but most people think I'm crazy and it can't be the pills, I really think it is though.

 

Now I just need to find some courage to start the taper, reading this forum gives me hope that one day things will get better, right now it's like living in hell.

Hi

  I am fairly new here and trying to build up the courage to start my taper, i read the ashton taper plan and am thinking 1mg per day for 1-2 weeks at a time.

 

My gp is clueless and psychiatrist wants me to cut 5mg per day but isn't bothered if I stay on it, it's ridiculous, I am going to print off what I have read from the Ashton manual and show them.

 

I have been on diazepam for 17, maybe even 18 years, for the first 7 years the dose was increased now and then, it went from 6mg per day to 18mg per day then in November I had a 'breakdown', stupidly accepted a 2mg increase 4 weeks ago which just causes me to feel unsteady but of course the doctors insist it's anxiety doing that.

 

My 'breakdown' was in my opinion caused simply by tolerance withdrawal, never in my life have I spent hours on end sweating profusely, shaking, heart pounding and running to the loo 10 times in one day not to mention the dry retching.

 

Awake every hour with panic and it has me up in the early hours so now I am exhausted too, depressed and having to force myself to leave the house because suddenly I am terrified of it and when I do go I feel scared, overwhelmed, panicky and so unsteady on my feet, it's awful,clinging to my husband's arm and walking around like a robot and feeling like my legs are giving way.

 

My husband finally believes me but most people think I'm crazy and it can't be the pills, I really think it is though.

 

Now I just need to find some courage to start the taper, reading this forum gives me hope that one day things will get better, right now it's like living in hell.

 

Hi Lakey,

Welcome to the thread.

My heart goes out to you. This is really very hard, isn't it?

 

You're not alone in this, we all know what you're going through here.

You're not crazy. Even though at times you feel like you're losing it. Many of us got seen as the cookoo one . People who have never been there before have no clue what physical and mental torture this is. Including doctors.  Unfortunately many of us have gone through that with our medical professionals. And in a way you're lucky :your doc will keep prescribing so you can do your own thing and taper off Safely!

 

IMO, 1 mgr cuts are too large.

Recommended is 50-10 percent every two weeks here and you're still in a high enough dose to probably cut on the larger side of things.

But I'd strongly suggest not taking that 1 mgr off at once. But cut smaller and more OFTEN.

This way it's not AS big a shock to your system.

 

For a lot of people the Ashton method is too rapid.

 

Are the sunrooms you experience now due to a cut you made recently?

 

Forcing yourself to do things you feel you can not might not be a good idea, IMO.

When you can, do it. But when it's too much... Many of us need to be a recluse for a while in order to calm down the nervous system. Too many impressions can just make it worse.

 

I understand you're scared. And overwhelmed. But you're going to be alright.

You'll find a lot of support and advice here .

 

It's so horrible when our spouse or friends and family don't believe us. Just don't doubt it: it's not in your mind, it's your physical brain. Your receptors have been pruned back and they will regenerate with time. That's all this is: your brain and body trying to find balance...trying to make sense out of it. Simply put.

 

If you haven't done so already...please read " what's happening n your brain " by Parker.

I strongly urge you to have your husband read it , too.

It explains why this is happening. And it's been a huge help and comfort to a lot of people here on the boards.

Here is the link to the post

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=66397.0

Don't hesitate to ask and post. It helps !

Hi Moodle and thankyou, actually reading some other posts I began to wonder if 1mg cuts were a bit too much, it does seem that some struggle with cutting that much so I could perhaps try 0.5mg instead.

 

I haven't made a cut yet, I am terrified and trying to build upthe courage but I need to start soon, actually it is probably a good thing that I posted here first and read some more or I may have done it too rapidly.

 

I honestly believe my symptoms are tolerance withdrawal, when they started I said to my husband that I felt as if I had been given placebo pills, we even questioned if we had stored them badly and damaged them but of course we had done nothing different so I took to google and found you could go into withdrawal whilst still taking them which of course the doctors wont believe but I am convinced.

 

I have never had symptoms like this in my life and I have had some pretty awful anxiety but this is something else, some of them have faded for now but many remain and the agoraphobia is awful, I was not agoraphobic before diazepam, then for years I needed my husband there but always felt fine and never feared going out, now suddenly it's absolutely terrifying and I don't get one good day anymore.

 

I don't want to give upon going out because I have children and already the way it restricts me is affecting their lives but I know I need to be easy on myself especially as I taper because it's going to be a difficult time.

 

I will read that post you have linked, thank you so much, it's great just to finally be amongst people who actually understand what I am going through and know that all of this is very real and caused by the pills, terrible things they are.

Lakey,

Moodle is giving you great advice. I just wanted to say that I am newer to Valium, but I have been on Benzos my entire adult life (13+ years). I want to validate that your sxs are tol wd. I don't care what any Dr says. I was sick and thought I was losing my mind. I was agoraphobic and depressed. Tol wd is horrible. For me, tapering actually relieved a lot of tol wd sxs or they lessened. I did also get new sxs. I know it's scary to taper, but if you dealt with years of tol wd you can do this. Your taper is road to freedom. I am so sorry for all you went through. As for tapering, you will figure out what speed works for you. We are all different. Start slow and go from there. You will be ok! Wishing you lots of luck!

 

XO Maya

Hi Moodle and thankyou, actually reading some other posts I began to wonder if 1mg cuts were a bit too much, it does seem that some struggle with cutting that much so I could perhaps try 0.5mg instead.

 

I haven't made a cut yet, I am terrified and trying to build upthe courage but I need to start soon, actually it is probably a good thing that I posted here first and read some more or I may have done it too rapidly.

 

I honestly believe my symptoms are tolerance withdrawal, when they started I said to my husband that I felt as if I had been given placebo pills, we even questioned if we had stored them badly and damaged them but of course we had done nothing different so I took to google and found you could go into withdrawal whilst still taking them which of course the doctors wont believe but I am convinced.

 

I have never had symptoms like this in my life and I have had some pretty awful anxiety but this is something else, some of them have faded for now but many remain and the agoraphobia is awful, I was not agoraphobic before diazepam, then for years I needed my husband there but always felt fine and never feared going out, now suddenly it's absolutely terrifying and I don't get one good day anymore.

 

I don't want to give upon going out because I have children and already the way it restricts me is affecting their lives but I know I need to be easy on myself especially as I taper because it's going to be a difficult time.

 

I will read that post you have linked, thank you so much, it's great just to finally be amongst people who actually understand what I am going through and know that all of this is very real and caused by the pills, terrible things they are.

 

Yes, I understand what you write all too well.

I have a ten year old.

I think it's good to know you're not the only one and what you're feeling is very common on here. But not in the " real " world. And it's a struggle sometimes to find a way.

 

And yes, this IS something else. Entirely .

You'll run into a lot of misunderstanding about this. But that's just the way it is. The best thing you can do for yourself is make this process tolerable by cutting sensibly and by keeping believing it's not forever. We all will remind you.

 

The agoraphobia is pretty common too. Your cns is in upheaval and lots of impressions are too stimulating.

And sadly, I'm not surprised that doctors brush it off. Unfortunelyy it's what many of us here have run in to. But as long as you get your scripts, you can do this for sure with the help of your buddies.

 

 

Thank you Maya, it is just so good to hear that I am not imagining this whole thing and it truly is what I suspected from the moment this all started, the doctors blamed my low weight, I struggled but gained it back only to see no difference of course, then they said it must be stress but I had not had anymore stress than at any other time in my life.

 

It really is an absolute nightmare and when I have had bad spells in the past I have always managed my way through them but this time nothing is helping and it's things I have never felt before too so I know it's tolerance withdrawal and if the docs refuse to accept that then so be it, I trust my own mind and body and since reaching out here, reading people's experiences and all of the resources I feel quite relieved in a way because it is horrible but now at least I understand it better.

 

Tapering is scary but I am going to do it, I think 0.5mg to start with is best,cut that then hold for a while and see how I go, thank you for the reply, it's great just to know I am not alone in this.

 

And thank you again Moodle, such wonderful advice and understanding, at last I know there is an answer to what I am going through even if it is a long and difficult one, it is far better than being fobbed off by doctors who have so little understanding of these things.

Can anyone help me start?

I finally got the script for valium. I was kind of shocked to see how low she wrote it out for. I will have to do the best I can until I can get back in to see her but I hope she doesnt mind adjusting this. I gotta do something though because I went in the store and had bad depersonalization etc- this is new and it tells me its time...

Presently on X .0312 mg 6AM, Noon, 6 PM. BEDTIME - always just took for sleep- .5312 mg and another .0312 at 2 AM.

VALIUM script she gave me 60 - 5 mg pills then the second script is for 70 - 2 mg pills w 1 refill. Im hoping she just took this off the ashton paperwork I left with her and shes going to be willing to tweak. Shes written me 1 mg xanax for many years so there is that hope. But for now I need to get started with a crossover plan. Since I take it for sleep only except now to hold down my brand new IDWDs, I would prefer to keep dosage at night...

Any help VERY much appreciated. I posted this on the sub tapers board too, thanks so much!

I've read many of Diaz-Pam's post over the past year or so, and now would like to ask our BB loyal 'champion of daily tapering'  a specific question or two (THX in advance, D-P ))!

I took a look time to c/o from Ativan to valium, ending up at 26 mg valium. Since then, I've spent about the past 6-8 mos. dropping .5 every 2 weeks; I've been at 16 mg for the past coupla months.

 

It seems I've hit a wall, since I've made 3 different attempts to continue my taper: first .5 (super bleah for 3-5 days),  a bit of a 'rest' then an attempt at .25 (not much better), and a third where I shaved maybe .125 (that went better, but after 2 weeks, a further .125 didn't).

 

I was assuming I'd go to a daily taper at between 10 and 5 mg, but it seems as if 16 is my 'wall,' so gotta accept that (I'm used to tapering discomfort, but need to be able to function). From what I've read, D-P, you did milk/vodka/liquid valium at different times.

 

I'm trying to decide whether to try whole milk, or ask my doc for liquid V; not sure if he'll go for it, and not sure what brand is available in Canada. I've already contacted an independent pharmacy I'm planning to switch my prescription to (tired of cranky pharmacists at huge drug mart-never the same person, either), and the owner seems a bit more benzo wise, and KIND.

 

I've read your extensive instructions on how to do a daily taper many times; so great of you to pay forward what flipbrain taught you, and to be such a mainstay here on the BB for so long. You've helped so many people, and are pretty patient as well  !

 

So, I don't want to be too needy, but any comments you have would be fantastic. Oh, and besides the milk vs. liquid V issue, if you have any thoughts on how much I should start off daily tapering that'd be much appreciated. I know we're all so different, but just an idea of what a moderated/slow amount would be, since I've started to struggle in the past month or 2?

 

I know I've addressed this to D-P, but if anyone else has any comments, I'm open to them for sure-just interested in D-P because of her huge contributions to this particular issue!! 

Well, this ain't no soap opera , but when you recommend your prairie cousin with a small Ativan issue join BB, and THEN he flies in for a surprise long w'end, and you share the same computer--the above is what happens!! Egad.

 

Without revealing cuz's real name, 'Odin' is my fave relative (no other relatives on here to read that!). As a really busy guy in the summer farming season, winters are slower; when a 'Flying Farmer' (that's a real organization!) buddy decided to fly to S. Ont. for the Family Day (next Monday in Ontario) holiday, cuz hopped a ride.

 

[Thanks for the NO warning, cuz, much as I loves ya! Even a day or 2 would have given me time to shovel out the spare bedroom, and cook some chili and other goodies; now, you get to choke on cat hair and eat leftovers, at least for the next 24 hours!]

 

Anyhoo, it was fun to get on BB together (and to have Odin sympathize with my 'stuck at 16' dilemma, above-must be nice to be all of a bit of Ativan in just a few months, sigh), but sharing a computer can be confusing! As in, Odin logged in, went off in search of food-good luck, sudden guest!!-and I obliviously continued to browse.

 

That worked out alright, but when I realized I posted as cuzin Oddie, even I got confused, and then really mortified. Duh!! Oddie has been LM[H]AO for the past half hour, but he is a guy and younger than me, so any dumb mistake Ms. Responsible Cuz makes is extra hilarious.

 

I hope this clears things up-and for the next few days, Oddie's not allowed on BB, except to apologize for making fun of me  !!

Cuz Bab said I could have 30 seconds to reply, so------CHILLAX, girl!! And I'll keep off your precious BB for now, at least when you're on, sheesh!!  8) p.s. where are the groceries, and hey, I'm allergic to catz!

Thank you Maya, it is just so good to hear that I am not imagining this whole thing and it truly is what I suspected from the moment this all started, the doctors blamed my low weight, I struggled but gained it back only to see no difference of course, then they said it must be stress but I had not had anymore stress than at any other time in my life.

 

It really is an absolute nightmare and when I have had bad spells in the past I have always managed my way through them but this time nothing is helping and it's things I have never felt before too so I know it's tolerance withdrawal and if the docs refuse to accept that then so be it, I trust my own mind and body and since reaching out here, reading people's experiences and all of the resources I feel quite relieved in a way because it is horrible but now at least I understand it better.

 

Tapering is scary but I am going to do it, I think 0.5mg to start with is best,cut that then hold for a while and see how I go, thank you for the reply, it's great just to know I am not alone in this.

 

And thank you again Moodle, such wonderful advice and understanding, at last I know there is an answer to what I am going through even if it is a long and difficult one, it is far better than being fobbed off by doctors who have so little understanding of these things.

 

Lakey,

I had no idea Benzos were harming me. Klonopin was the first psych med I was ever put on and I was 18. Then when it started harming me and I also had no clue they were addictive. They checked me for so many things and misdiagnosed me as many things. I was never depressed until I was on K for 6+ years on a high dose. It got to the point where I almost got ECT. At a consultation they told me that I couldn't take K and do ECT. Also that my depression was not biological and klonopin was probably causing it or at least making it a lot worse. Then I did research and I was shocked. I trusted my Drs. I also got bad anxiety, agrophobia etc. in tol wd. Also physical sxs. The worst times in tol wd were worse than anything I have ever experienced tapering. I am not saying it has been easy. I also tapered before finding BB. The waves don't last as long and aren't as bad psychologically. Also now I know it's the drug and it will pass. I have to remind myself that at times and my friends at BB remind me as well. I definitely felt relieved, too. Also now you know how to fix the problem. I wish there was a quicker and easier fix, but tol wd is no way to live. I am so glad that you wrote you trust your mind and body. IMO, that is one of (if not the most) important things for tapering. I just listen to my body and taper accordingly. I think you have a great plan to start. That's how I would start and adjust accordingly. Moodle gave you great advice. My pdoc doesn't believe in benzo withdrawal syndrome. I just get the rxs from him and then I got a lot of help on BB. My pdoc didn't help at all with my crossover etc. He thought he made no sense. I will stop babbling. You are not alone! I don't post on this thread often, but know I am here to help in any way I can. You can do this!

 

XO Maya 

 

Hi all. I'm a bit confused about tolerance withdrawal.  I've been at 15mgs for about 3 months. Initially I held to get through the holidays, then I held for medical reasons. And now. Well, I'm afraid to switch over to a daily taper and start cutting again. The truth hurts 

 

There have been days where I felt like I'm in acute wd again. Burning skin/brain (or cold skin/brain), severe muscle contractions, severe tinnitus, and worse. My appetite has disappeared.

 

I switched bottles of valium thinking I got a bad batch, but it didn't make a difference. I chalked up the increase in sxs to extreme stress and menopause/hormone  issues?

 

Could this be tolerance wd?  I'm so confused about the difference between tolerance wd and regular wd.

 

I know Lakey basically asked the same question, but I'm still confused. Sorry, my brain is on vacation

 

Praying for peace and healing to all.

Can anyone help me start?

I finally got the script for valium. I was kind of shocked to see how low she wrote it out for. I will have to do the best I can until I can get back in to see her but I hope she doesnt mind adjusting this. I gotta do something though because I went in the store and had bad depersonalization etc- this is new and it tells me its time...

Presently on X .0312 mg 6AM, Noon, 6 PM. BEDTIME - always just took for sleep- .5312 mg and another .0312 at 2 AM.

VALIUM script she gave me 60 - 5 mg pills then the second script is for 70 - 2 mg pills w 1 refill. Im hoping she just took this off the ashton paperwork I left with her and shes going to be willing to tweak. Shes written me 1 mg xanax for many years so there is that hope. But for now I need to get started with a crossover plan. Since I take it for sleep only except now to hold down my brand new IDWDs, I would prefer to keep dosage at night...

Any help VERY much appreciated. I posted this on the sub tapers board too, thanks so much!

 

I don't have a lot of experience with doing cross-overs, so I'll just bump this for you so someone else might chime in.

 

I've just noticed that you've had a few replies on the substitution section though, so that's good.

Cuz Bab said I could have 30 seconds to reply, so------CHILLAX, girl!! And I'll keep off your precious BB for now, at least when you're on, sheesh!!  8) p.s. where are the groceries, and hey, I'm allergic to catz!

 

Okay, I'm officially confused.....

Hi all. I'm a bit confused about tolerance withdrawal.  I've been at 15mgs for about 3 months. Initially I held to get through the holidays, then I held for medical reasons. And now. Well, I'm afraid to switch over to a daily taper and start cutting again. The truth hurts 

 

There have been days where I felt like I'm in acute wd again. Burning skin/brain (or cold skin/brain), severe muscle contractions, severe tinnitus, and worse. My appetite has disappeared.

 

I switched bottles of valium thinking I got a bad batch, but it didn't make a difference. I chalked up the increase in sxs to extreme stress and menopause/hormone  issues?

 

Could this be tolerance wd?  I'm so confused about the difference between tolerance wd and regular wd.

 

I know Lakey basically asked the same question, but I'm still confused. Sorry, my brain is on vacation

 

Praying for peace and healing to all.

 

The whole tolerance withdrawal thing is confusing for a lot of people, mainly because I think a lot of people use the wrong terminology.

 

Most people tapering a benzo are going to be doing a "tolerance withdrawal". All that means is that the dose of benzo you are on is no longer covering the symptoms you have, so you need to keep increasing the dose to get the same effect. Of course when you are tapering you are going in the other direction, so there won't be any actual effect being received from the benzo itself. However, this usually doesn't result in any side effects of its own. What people usually experience is a re-emergence of the original problem they had when they started the benzo (anxiety, insomnia etc), because of course we all know that benzos never "cure" anything. They only mask problems. So it is important to have other means of controlling those original symptoms.

 

There is another phenomenon called "relative withdrawal", but this is quite a rare thing, so the majority of people on BB probably aren't experiencing it. This is something that Colin has written on the subject.

 

"Relative Withdrawal refers to withdrawal effects that some people experience once they have become tolerant of their benzodiazepines. Although they are not reducing their dose, they nevertheless experience withdrawal-type symptoms. As with 'tolerance', increasing their dose might alleviate the symptoms, but they are likely to again become tolerant of the increased dose. The only good solution is to taper off at a sensible rate and allow enough time for the GABA system to recover. We should point out that only a small number of people develop Relative Withdrawal symptoms."

 

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=9706.0

Thanks Diaz-Pam for the response   My sxs are not all consistent with a recurrence of my initial anxiety and panic attacks. I  mean I do get anxious, and am agoraphobic. But the most troubling sxs are more consistent with what I experienced during c/t and afterwards. Would this be normal for someone who was c/t'd and then reinstated? You're right, the tolerance wd thing is confusing. 

 

Thank you for giving so much of your time and energy to BB.

Hi everyone!  1was on 1mg k for 4 years as needeed, just lasyear 2015 develope tolerance due to taking it 4days in a row and stop atart 4days in a row and stop.  at first i dont know whats happening to me then figured it out Im on withrawal. my doctor dont have any idea  of tapering.  any way I start tapering from .75k for a week c/o to Diazepam start at 12mg a day

 

From Oct 2015--Reduce 2 mg every month bad withrawals till i reach 6mg i was feeling ok.

Jan. 2016--drop another 2 mg--  4mg at this point very bad s/x - i was stabilise in two weeks. decided to slowdawn cut.

jan 25--3.5mg very smooth for a week.  cut another .5 every week

FEB. 1--3mg vvery bad w/s headache pressure, stab head feeling uncontrolled shaking till now, at the same time im on ANTIBIOTIC                    called TRIMITHOPRIM FOR 3 DAYS NOW because of UTI ( urine infection) still suffering insomnia no sleep now for almost 2 weeks, dont know when it will subside. i dont know if the antibiotic giving me side effect because i never stabilise this stage, normaly i stabilise in 10 day.

 

i will need help to motivate me and please give me ensight if you have any opinion what i need to do this time.

i feel burning skin as well, tinnitus brain shaking, leg cramps ang stomach cramps all over my body., hair loss as well to much.

im in pain. PLEASE HELP!!!

 

THANKS, MCM

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Can anyone help me start?

I finally got the script for valium. I was kind of shocked to see how low she wrote it out for. I will have to do the best I can until I can get back in to see her but I hope she doesnt mind adjusting this. I gotta do something though because I went in the store and had bad depersonalization etc- this is new and it tells me its time...

Presently on X .0312 mg 6AM, Noon, 6 PM. BEDTIME - always just took for sleep- .5312 mg and another .0312 at 2 AM.

VALIUM script she gave me 60 - 5 mg pills then the second script is for 70 - 2 mg pills w 1 refill. Im hoping she just took this off the ashton paperwork I left with her and shes going to be willing to tweak. Shes written me 1 mg xanax for many years so there is that hope. But for now I need to get started with a crossover plan. Since I take it for sleep only except now to hold down my brand new IDWDs, I would prefer to keep dosage at night...

Any help VERY much appreciated. I posted this on the sub tapers board too, thanks so much!

 

I don't have a lot of experience with doing cross-overs, so I'll just bump this for you so someone else might chime in.

 

I've just noticed that you've had a few replies on the substitution section though, so that's good.

Yes this board seems very high traffic so I think I need to stay over there, in the slow lane 😬

Hi all. I'm a bit confused about tolerance withdrawal.  I've been at 15mgs for about 3 months. Initially I held to get through the holidays, then I held for medical reasons. And now. Well, I'm afraid to switch over to a daily taper and start cutting again. The truth hurts 

 

There have been days where I felt like I'm in acute wd again. Burning skin/brain (or cold skin/brain), severe muscle contractions, severe tinnitus, and worse. My appetite has disappeared.

 

I switched bottles of valium thinking I got a bad batch, but it didn't make a difference. I chalked up the increase in sxs to extreme stress and menopause/hormone  issues?

 

Could this be tolerance wd?  I'm so confused about the difference between tolerance wd and regular wd.

 

I know Lakey basically asked the same question, but I'm still confused. Sorry, my brain is on vacation

 

Praying for peace and healing to all.

 

The whole tolerance withdrawal thing is confusing for a lot of people, mainly because I think a lot of people use the wrong terminology.

 

Most people tapering a benzo are going to be doing a "tolerance withdrawal". All that means is that the dose of benzo you are on is no longer covering the symptoms you have, so you need to keep increasing the dose to get the same effect. Of course when you are tapering you are going in the other direction, so there won't be any actual effect being received from the benzo itself. However, this usually doesn't result in any side effects of its own. What people usually experience is a re-emergence of the original problem they had when they started the benzo (anxiety, insomnia etc), because of course we all know that benzos never "cure" anything. They only mask problems. So it is important to have other means of controlling those original symptoms.

 

There is another phenomenon called "relative withdrawal", but this is quite a rare thing, so the majority of people on BB probably aren't experiencing it. This is something that Colin has written on the subject.

 

"Relative Withdrawal refers to withdrawal effects that some people experience once they have become tolerant of their benzodiazepines. Although they are not reducing their dose, they nevertheless experience withdrawal-type symptoms. As with 'tolerance', increasing their dose might alleviate the symptoms, but they are likely to again become tolerant of the increased dose. The only good solution is to taper off at a sensible rate and allow enough time for the GABA system to recover. We should point out that only a small number of people develop Relative Withdrawal symptoms."

 

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=9706.0

Thank you for posting this. The other factor in here for some people ( like me who was taking a short acting drug) is interdose withdrawal. I had been doing fine on an as needed dose at bedtime only then one day started getting WD symptoms in the day. I had no idea what was going on. It seemed like relative withdrawal because it was symptoms I never had before, but apparently IDWDs can be similar from what I have been told.

(I'm new to this thread - having recently crossed from Ativan to Valium, I decided I better also cross from the Ativan support thread to the Valium support thread )

 

Question about the stability of dissolved Valium... This is really a chemistry question I guess.

 

As background, I just reached the point in my Valium taper where I need to go to fractional doses. I had done 10, 9, 8, 7, 6, 5, which is all do-able by cutting pills (I have 10mg and 2mg pills, both easily cuttable in half). My most recent cut however was to 4.5mg. So I performed the ritual of dissolving the 10mg pill in 1ml vodka and diluting with 99ml water leaving me with a lovely 100ml slightly bluish mix (the pills are blue) containing the 10mg Valium dissolved in it. I drank 45ml of it and put the rest in the refrigerator. Great. So I'll continue this process for a week or so until my next cut to 4mg which I can do without dissolving anything. Then when I get to 3.5 I'll have to go back to the liquid titration thing again.

 

So my question is this: How stable is the dissolved Valium? I.e. if I let my leftover mix accumulate and sit in a plastic pitcher in the refrigerator, does the Valium in it degrade in a few weeks?

 

I'm hoping the answer is "no". In that case I'll just mix a whole batch of the liquid up front for efficiency. (Hopefully no visitor to my home will mistake it for Kool-Aid and drink it! ).

 

Thanks!

 

Chessplayer

DP  I think post 16583 was from Babi asking for help, but it got posted from Odin because Odin had logged in and didn't log out so when Babi posted the post looked like it came from Odin.  Anyway, if I'm right Babi still needs help.  Cross

 

Cuz Bab said I could have 30 seconds to reply, so------CHILLAX, girl!! And I'll keep off your precious BB for now, at least when you're on, sheesh!!  8) p.s. where are the groceries, and hey, I'm allergic to catz!

 

Okay, I'm officially confused.....

(I'm new to this thread - having recently crossed from Ativan to Valium, I decided I better also cross from the Ativan support thread to the Valium support thread )

 

Question about the stability of dissolved Valium... This is really a chemistry question I guess.

 

As background, I just reached the point in my Valium taper where I need to go to fractional doses. I had done 10, 9, 8, 7, 6, 5, which is all do-able by cutting pills (I have 10mg and 2mg pills, both easily cuttable in half). My most recent cut however was to 4.5mg. So I performed the ritual of dissolving the 10mg pill in 1ml vodka and diluting with 99ml water leaving me with a lovely 100ml slightly bluish mix (the pills are blue) containing the 10mg Valium dissolved in it. I drank 45ml of it and put the rest in the refrigerator. Great. So I'll continue this process for a week or so until my next cut to 4mg which I can do without dissolving anything. Then when I get to 3.5 I'll have to go back to the liquid titration thing again.

 

So my question is this: How stable is the dissolved Valium? I.e. if I let my leftover mix accumulate and sit in a plastic pitcher in the refrigerator, does the Valium in it degrade in a few weeks?

 

I'm hoping the answer is "no". In that case I'll just mix a whole batch of the liquid up front for efficiency. (Hopefully no visitor to my home will mistake it for Kool-Aid and drink it! ).

 

Thanks!

 

Chessplayer

  Tablet or solution, V is a very stable compound.  Roxane's Diazepam Oral Solution has a 3 year shelf life from date of mfgr.  Dissolving the dry product in an acceptable solvent (ETOH, PG, fat, etc) does alter its stability or potency.  BTW, it does not need to be stored in the refrigerator, but it should be protected from light.

Thanks for the reply, builder!

Welcome all new Valium threaders.

The reason for us all gathering here isn't so great but it's good to see the thread being so well used. This thread has saved me throughout my taper and it's been a wonderful place for mutual advice and support for so long for so many.

 

Hope you're all as well as can be under the circumstances.