SLOW TAPER SUPPORT THREAD - slow and steady is your pace

This thread is dedicated to those of us doing a slow taper. I'm not really sure how to best classify a slow taper other than compared to Ashton guidelines or the taper rates you see many others going at, you feel like you are the tortise and not the hare.

 

The motto here is slow and steady - we tend to taper according to our healing rather than guidelines dictated to us or dates on a calendar.

 

This is our safe haven, a place for support where we come when we feel the need to rush or see others around us ending their tapers while we still have much time on ours. We welcome people who are considering slower tapers and share the benefits we feel they have provided us. We console one another when it seems like we are never going to get it done. This is our sanctuary when it seems like the rest of BB is passing us by.

 

Good idea! This should be an interesting thread.  I didn't start out doing a slow taper but it did end up that way. I would call mine a symptom based taper which turned out to take around 22 months and ended up alright. At this time I feel mostly healed  except for mild tinnitus. I'm asymptomatic unless I do something to flare symptoms up.

It helps me to realize I was healing on the way down. As long as I felt pretty well and could lead a normal life I never payed much attention to the length of time it took.

 

Bart

OMG.....what a great thread... going slow takes patience and support...and following your s/x and body cues makes sense....I just finished what I thought was a rather long direct taper from 1 stinkin' mighty little mg of ativan.....has taken 6 months and I am only 4 days into recovery having hopped off Dec 2.... . My taper was relatively manageable all the way down.Mid-taper wax difficult (about 6 weeks)......end taper ( about 8 weeks...Oct/Nov)  was very slow and deliberate....but pretty comfortable for the most part ..not without s/x but they were intermittent....and had some windows and mini windows....so far hopping off has been just like taper ( but I am only a few days free...we 'll see how it goes from here)

.... ....this is a good topic thread.....good luck to all of you....slow gentle steady...is smart I think...

........................cooperten

Thanks Cooperten. I hope the thread proves to be helpful.

 

I was like bart. I didn't plan on going slow. I hoped to go fast, like Ashon's rates. But within the first months of my taper it became apparent that I was going to have to stay below 7%. Too much WD there. Then after having to do almost a three month hold at 6.5% when I got hit with lag, I realized that 5% had been the only cut I'd made that allowed me to function well with less WD. And my holds had to be longer than two weeks because it takes that long for me to notice any WD. So right now I'm trying 3 weeks down from a month and it was okay for three cuts until I hit lag. But because I've been going at 5% my symptoms where almost non existent. Just a little tinge of something here or there. So this cut I have to hold a little longer from a hint of carry over of tinnitus and blurry vision and then the lag which made everything uptick, but it still is not really bad for what lag was last time or from what I have seen people call lag.

 

The way I see it is that it really is all about healing. There are people who don't think we heal during a taper, but that makes no sense to me because if that were so, then there would really be no difference between CTs and people who taper. Or even people who taper fast vs those who go slow. But when I look at the CTs, they are in really intense WD for a while after they stop. They seem to have long term waves and barely get windows. Some of them over a year out are questioning if they are having windows because they still have some rough symptoms mixed in, but I do see them as windows, only they are more subtle because the pain they feel compared to the healing that has happened makes the healing harder to notice. But they are healing.  I think the body still heals at the same rate as it would during a taper and going faster than your body heals triggers WD. It gets worse if you keep going faster. A CT lands you in full blown acute WD and now your body has to heal as it would have during a taper. So it's going to take the same amount of time as it would if you tapered according to your healing rate whether you go faster or slower or CT. Only slower allows you to have a more normal life and not suffer completely. That's my working theory anyway, and it seems to be the case as best as I can tell once you could for the individuality of each person's healing rate.

 

I look at bart as the perfect example. He tapered according to his symptoms. It ended up being a slow taper. And he's been high functioning for his taper. Now he's going to step off at a miniscule dose from a good place. I think both those things are key because the body has to heal along the way and when the dose is very low, the healing that occurred on the way there compared to if you went faster than your body could handle and had a lot of WD along the way, well, the one who goes with their healing rate will be better off WD wise. And I think the lower the dose you taper to then the better off you are when you step off. But that's a bit beyond this thread though it's definitely food for thought. But if you taper faster than your body can heal you're going to have a lot of WD. If you jump too high or do a CT your body still is going to heal at the rate it's going to heal. In the end it's a matter of whether or not want to feel better or worse during your taper. I don't believe you can cheat your healing rate by doing a fast taper and it seems like there's good evidence to back that just by looking at recovery rates of people after the stop taking the pill and if they had a lot of WD along the way or tapered according to their body's healing rate.

Great idea, I'm in!

I guess I'm in, too. It's taking me freakin' forever to get off this last 2 mg of valium.

 

My w/d f/x are so bad that I'm going to have to figure out how to split my dose to cover my symptoms. My body just needs valium more often than once in 24 hours to be able to function. I was OK at 15 mg to 4 mg then everything fell apart. I carried on with Ashton's protocol, but things have not been working. So I am going to follow Bart's and eliz's advice and rearrange my doses so I taper around my symptoms. God, something has to help. I don't want to be at this for another 15 months!!

 

Glad to have this thread.

 

Okatz

I guess I'm in, too. It's taking me freakin' forever to get off this last 2 mg of valium.

 

My w/d f/x are so bad that I'm going to have to figure out how to split my dose to cover my symptoms. My body just needs valium more often than once in 24 hours to be able to function. I was OK at 15 mg to 5 mg then everything fell apart. I carried on with Ashton's protocol, but things have not been working. So I am going to follow Bart's and eliz's advice and rearrange my doses so I taper around my symptoms. God, something has to help. I don't want to be at this for another 15 months!!

 

Glad to have this thread.

 

Okatz

 

Sorry you are having a dreadful time, Katz. I know how you feel about not wanting to be at this for another 15 months. When I think that I have years ahead of me, it's off putting.

 

It sounds like aston's recommendations were too fast for you and you got hit. Are you taking a liquid form or the pills? Twice a day might help especially if you have interdose WD going on.

Yes, I blindly followed Ashton until I got in trouble at 4 mg. From 15 to 4 was OK. Then I found this forum . . . but it didn't really dawn on me that the s/x I was having were so much worse than what everyone else had and that I really didn't need to put up with them. They are totally disabling. When I realized something was wrong, I realized it was the Ashton protocol. I'm dense. It took me awhile.

 

Then I asked for help and folks opined that I had interdose w/d. I thought I had, but my psych doc kept telling me I didn't. Grrr. I am going to talk to her today and tell her what my new plan is. She is not going to agree with me or be happy. I will be diplomatic. I want her to be on board with me as I need is for her to keep prescribing valium

 

So today I am going to updose (I did a small one yesterday and it seemed to help) and split my dose. I sure hope that helps. I am going to believe it will . . . as I feel like c**p too much of the time.

 

Okatz

Hi OMG,

  Thank you for starting this thread. It appears many of us start out following Dr. Ashton's recommendations and find them too fast. Like Okatz, I am in the last bit of V taper and am having a tough time. I need help feeling Ok about holding and tapering slowly while my gut says to run as fast as I can from benzos.

  I look forward to the support I am sure will come to this well intended thread...thanks.

Carita

Carita, what are your symptoms? And do you have times of the day that you always feel worse?

 

Okatz

Dear Okatz,

  It is hard for me to admit how difficult this has become for me....not sure what that is about. Guess I feel some shame about this situation.

  The most difficult symptoms are depression, depersonalization, derealization, anxiety, muscle pain, morning panic and insomnia. Many others also but these are the most challenging. I dose at bedtime using a vaginal cream compounded 1 mg to 1 ml lipoderm. I was prescribed benzos for pelvic pain. Prior to their use I had occasional situational anxiety and depression...what I have now is very different. Mornings are my most difficult time of day.

  What are you experiencing? How do you manage?

Warmly,

Carita

 

Carita, your symptoms sound very difficult, all right. They are a lot to put up with. No need to feel shame! We are all in benzo hell together.

 

My symptoms which come on from noon - 2p.m. (but not every day which makes me crazy because I never know when I am going to have a rotten day) are incredible nausea, cog fog so severe I can't even remember my passwords for websites, malaise or flu-like symptoms, hyperacusis to the extent that sound actually hurts my body, ear pressure . . . I guess those are enough. I try to push through and do some work, but really I'm useless. I often just go to bed and wait for the time I take my valium, because in about 2 1/2 to 3 hours I always feel better.

 

Now that I know these are i/d withdrawals, I am going to try to fix this mess.  I sure hope I am successful.

 

A question: once you are done with the benzos, what will you do for your pelvic floor condition? Do you have another painkiller? Just wondering . . .

 

Hope your afternoon is OK.

 

Best,

 

Okatz

 

 

Carita,

 

I'm so sorry you are in this hell. I hope slowing down and allowing yourself to taper at a rate that is dictated by how you heal rather than some random times and numbers helps you. I believe it will. You may find that it is best to hold for a while if you are in a bad way. Just take cutting off the table until you start feeling like you are stabilizing and the symptoms are dissipating. Then you can resume your taper more slowly than you were going and see how it works for you.

 

Honestly, I think Ashton was truly a pioneer but her taper rates are just way too fast for a good portion of people. They're more like the upper limit. I thought I would be able to do 10% every two weeks. I was warned to go lower and slower so I went with 7% my first two cuts and found it to be too much. I messed around with it because even though 5% was great, it was just too slow, but when all was said and done, I should have just stayed with the 5% because I wasted months on a hold that was not necessary. But that's how we learn.

 

I hope you feel better soon and begin to stabilize from what you are feeling.

 

 

Katz,

 

My god, that is hell! Taking doses twice a day should help a great deal. I am hoping and praying it fixes all of that.

Hi Okatz,

  Thank you for your kindness.  Your symptoms...what a challenge. The sensitivity to sound is one of mine too. You described it in a way I have not been able to. It is as if the sound triggers a systemic pain response....my entire body aches. I wear ear plugs at night and often during the day.

  It sounds like interdose withdrawal is playing a part in your pattern. I believe that is very hopeful as a change in dosing may be helpful. Keep us up to date as you trial new showing schedules. Good luck.

  I appreciate you asking about pelvic pain management. Fortunately many months of pelvic floor and hip PT helped with the level of pain. The pelvis and hips are intimately connected and it appears tightness in my hip musculature was referring to my pelvis. I still have flares and can manage them with exercises. We also share the old injury pattern...almost every scar and injury is sensitive in withdrawal. When you have lead a very active life and are 58 years old that adds up!

  Best to you Okatz. We will find our best path out of this and be well again.

With friendship,

Carita

 

 

Dear OMG,

  Thank you for the pace reminder...slow and body directed. I thought I WAS going slow! Seems my body needs a more diminutive taper. I am also recovering from a X taper...am off 6 months this week. ..I am so thankful. That could be playing a part in this challenge. I appreciate your thoughtful posts and am eager to see what your new thread brings.

With appreciation,

Carita

 

     

Carita, OMG what is an X taper?

 

Okatz

Dear Okatz,

  Xanax. I tapered over 14 months. It was a stinker...but the Valium is more challenging.

Thanks for asking...I'm awfully proud of completing the X...now on to the V!

Carita

X taper - xanax taper. I'm doing a K taper (klonopin). You're doing a V taper.

 

It sounds so weird though now that I look at it.

Count me in.  This sounds like a good thread!

 

 

 

 

Count me in.  This sounds like a good thread!

 

Me Too   - Long live the low symptom taper and may we all JUMP HEALED

Braban and birdman! I was hoping both of you would find this thread and pop in to join us!

 

Yay to the low symptom taper!

 

 

  Great Idea, OM!

 

            Even though my Benzo Taper is done, I can contribute as I did a slow taper from 1 mg. Jan-Nov.

           

  Here's to all the "Hares" out there!

 

    NFM

Hey guys. Checking in. I've hit tolerance withdrawal and am going to go 5% every three weeks until I'm off this crap. Good luck to everyone out there I'll be checking in and seeing how y'all are doing.

Hey guys. Checking in. I've hit tolerance withdrawal and am going to go 5% every three weeks until I'm off this crap. Good luck to everyone out there I'll be checking in and seeing how y'all are doing.

 

Welcome ray34iyf   Slow is good 

I hope I an sit in a corner and just listen and learn from all of you ..

Right now I am holding for over 10 weeks a cut that proved too big for me .. The suffering is immense ..

I hope to stabilize, and continue the Ativan taper very very slowly.

Thank you everyone .

Anu

 

Hang in there Anoushka, you'll stabilize. Then you can do a slow taper and gradually get off this stuff with likely minimal WD along the way.