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thanks ejay,

I have been taking Ativan for sleep and occassional anxiety/panic symptoms for 2-3 years at therapeutic dosages.  I stopped abruptly (not a smart thing to do as I have discovered) and wondering if even taking therapeutic dosages for this many years, can I have some significant withdrawal symptoms?  I can't explain how I am feeling physically, i.e. not due to flu, low thyroid, depression, etc.  I just feel very bad, weird, like I am 100yrs old (thyroid is normal, not severely depressed, no flu).  I just don't know enough about low dose/therapeutic benzo withdrawal.  Just stopped a couple of weeks ago and haven't had a good day since.

 

Thanks

 

Hi Runnerset!

 

Welcome to Benzo Buddies.

I am going to post your message on 'Welcome to the Forum'. I'll reply to you there and I'll then send you a link.

There you will recieve more replies and support from others.  ;)

 

Linda

 

 

Hi,

 

Sometimes we suggest reinstating your benzo if it hasn't been long since you stopped. This depends on the dosage you were on at the time. Can you tell us what your daily dose was, and how often you took it? Only occasionally, or most nights?

Even so-called 'theraputic' doses need to be tapered off over a period of time.

Let us know!

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Hi,

I was taking anywhere from 1.5mg to 1.75mg every night for a long time.  On average I might take 1mg during the day for anxiety or panic feelings or general agitation (rapid onset - sudden emotional upset) but this might only be 3 days out of 7 and not on any regular basis - some weeks no extra during the day.  I have been taking Ativan for sleep for at least 2 years and was on Klonopin before that.  I was taking the max dose of Klonopin at one time (recommended max dose) of 2mg and still had difficulty sleeping so the reason for switching to ativan.

 

The symptoms I am having are: muscle aches, (had to use a heat bad at night for my calves), neck pain (still bad and I use a heat pad at night + Skelaxin + Ibuprofen), jaw pain (feels very tight) which I thought was TMJ but never had this much problem with it, dissociative symptoms (very bad last week), feels like I am going insane and I'll never come back, no concentration, very poor memory (scarey at times). 

 

I have to confess that I stopped Prozac about 2 months ago and I did that same stupid thing - just stopped.  Perhaps all this is a combination thing.

 

thanks and sorry to be so longwinded

runnerset

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Hi, runnerset.  :)

 

Welcome to BenzoBuddies.  You have come to the right place for information and support.

 

Everything you describe sounds like benzo withdrawal symptoms.  When did you take your last dose?  If it was within the last 2 weeks, you might want to reinstate perhaps 1 mg at night for a few weeks and then slowly taper off of that.  I just stopped Prozac as well at one time but didn't have any withdrawal symptoms so I'm pretty sure this is due to the ativan. 

 

I was on that benzo for nearly 20 years and tapered off of it this year.  I had many of the same feelings you have described but they dissipated over time. I take extra calcium/magnesium/zinc/potassium for the muscle spasms.  I still have a dicey memory but I have noticed times when my mind feels sharp again so I know my memory will improve as well. 

 

 

 

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Hi Runnerset,

 

Welcome to BenzoBuddies.

 

As Beeper suggested, you might do better to make a partial reinstatement, but this depends upon how long ago you quit. 1.5-1.75mg Ativan is a fairly sizeable dose. Certainly far too large to just stop taking without tapering for many weeks or a few months.

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Hi and Welcome!

 

I quit taking a "therapeutic" dose of Xanax and ended up in a mental hospital.  There's a whole lot of story between those two things....but that's the jest of it.  I'm sure you are experiencing benzo withdrawal!!

 

Love,

 

Jen

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Thanks for the information about withdrawal.  I really didn't know what was going on.  I did tak 0.75mg of ativan today and my jaw and head feel a little better.  I don't want to continue taking Ativan so still plan on trying to get off of it completely. I guess I should start at the 1.5 mg mark and work my way back down very slowly.  Believe it or not I am a nurse and should have known better but if it hadn't been for the information on this site I would have continued having tests to see what was wrong with me and probably slowly going insane.  My memory and concentration or nil but  I am hoping that will come back.  I don't remember my body ever being this stiff (except after a car accident I was in). 

 

Thank you again for all the input.  I feel a little safer having visited here and would welcome any suggestions or additional information about tolerance withdrawal, what others have experienced, does the sense of weirdness (feelings of unreality) go away?  will I be normal again?  will I feel good again?

 

I am sleeping but that is because I am so.o.o.o.ooo tired/fatigued and ache all over.  I don't know what I will do if the insomnia comes back because with that comes the panic attacks/nightmares but I guess I'll deal with it when it happens.  I still want to do the taper.

 

All words of encouragement and wisdom are welcome and so appreciated. :)

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Thanks for the information about withdrawal.  I really didn't know what was going on.  I did tak 0.75mg of ativan today and my jaw and head feel a little better.  I don't want to continue taking Ativan so still plan on trying to get off of it completely. I guess I should start at the 1.5 mg mark and work my way back down very slowly. 

 

Okay, stay on the 1.5mg for at least a week before starting to taper.  Do you have the .5mg pills?  You will need that strength to make the smallest dry cuts for a taper directly off of ativan. (That's how I did it.)  After you've stabilized on 1.5mg, I'd recommend cutting your .5mg tablets in 1/4 (.125mg) and reducing by that amount every 10-14 days or more.  I cut every 2 weeks because that was easier for me to remember.  I still wrote doses on a calendar, though.  My memory was really bad then.

Believe it or not I am a nurse and should have known better but if it hadn't been for the information on this site I would have continued having tests to see what was wrong with me and probably slowly going insane.  My memory and concentration or nil but  I am hoping that will come back.  I don't remember my body ever being this stiff (except after a car accident I was in). 

We have several nurses here.  You are not alone.  Most doctors, at least in the U.S., don't recognize the power of these little pills so they think prescribing them is no big deal.

Thank you again for all the input.  I feel a little safer having visited here and would welcome any suggestions or additional information about tolerance withdrawal, what others have experienced, does the sense of weirdness (feelings of unreality) go away?  will I be normal again?  will I feel good again?

Both derealization and depersonalization, technically referred to as weirdness  :laugh:, are common withdrawal (w/d) symptoms.  I didn't get them but many here did.  It does go away, along with the muscle aches, etc.  When you check some of the posts here, you will see a wide variety of unnerving symptoms; no one gets them all and they all do go away after your brain and body have fully healed.  The time frame for healing is quite variable, but we have quite a few people who have been off for a month or so and report feeling 90% back to normal. 

 

What is it about tolerance withdrawal that you'd like to know? An explanation for what's happening or...?

 

I can tell by the way you have approached this that you are going to do well tapering. You do need patience, though.  We refer to this as a marathon, not a sprint.  :thumbsup:

 

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Just dropping in to say hello and welcome you aboard to benzobuddies!

 

I see that you are a nurse...I am an RN as well...have kept my license, but am on disability. Feel free to check out my blog...it is listed as Barb aka bagbarbara. I was also a firefighter and EMT-S....sustained a brain injury in the line of duty as a FF/EMT-S in 1990 that squelched all three career paths in an instant. :( Have sustained two more brain injuries since the first. Have been on benzos for many years...should never have been prescribed with the BIs..but I didn't know that...and I'd like to think the docs that prescribed them did so unwittingly, but sometimes wonder about that. Being a nurse is a blessing and a curse for me; grateful for the knowledge/experience I have, but sometimes that same foundation causes me a great deal of angst. And I don't know about you, but patience is not one of my inherent virtues. I want to "fix" things and the sooner the better.

I know that is one of the reasons that being a firefighter/EMT-S and RN were such satisfying careers for me. 

 

I love this site...I have learned so much that isn't taught or is skimmed over in professional literature/education but far and above what I have learned, I love the people here; they are truly present for each other. Benzobuddies who offer direction, support and compassion; no criticisms, no blame, just infinite patience and encouragment. Lending a shoulder, courage and hope when needed.

 

Take care, and welcome.

 

hugs, Barb  :smitten:

 

 

 

 

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Hi Runnerset,

I also want to welcome you. You will find a wealth of info here. Look around, there are many stories of people feeling as you do. Many have also come off of this with much success. You will do fine. You are not alone and we will be here for you all the way. Good Luck to you. :thumbsup:Kel

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Hi Beeper,

Thanks so much for the information.  I truly appreciate it.  I only have the 1mg tablets but my MD can call me in a rx for 0.5mg.  He just wrote one for the 1mg but we didn't discuss any physical sx's I was having and didn't ask me how much I had cut back.  I should have brought up the subject of depersonalization cause that was really scaring me.  At the time I met with him we were working on solutions for ADD which have worsened in the past month or more (basically since I started cutting way back on the ativan) and most assuredly due to personal stressors which add to the mix.

 

Sometimes it is very hard to determine which comes first the horse or the cart.  It is very hard to feel good about what you are trying to accomplish in solving life's problems and stressors when you feel like crap and you can't wrap your head around a coherent thought or problem solve :idiot:

 

I guess I would like to find out about the difference between tolerance withdrawal vs. withdrawal.  I am sure I have a high tolerance to ativan as I have taken 2mg on occasion when I could not fall asleep on 1.5 or 1.75 (but not often).  Should I divide the dosaging during the day (like .5mg 3xday) or maybe 1 dose of 0.75 during the day and again at night?  I took 0.5mg this am because my head feels funny (tightening of the jaw, band across my head, lightheaded, balance off sometimes if I turn to fast - not inner ear problem as I had that checked out, not sinus had a CT scan done, not blood pressure cause it always stays about the same, not on any other meds except for synthroid - tsh is normal (finally!!).  If I talked about this w/my primary care MD he'd think me a hypochondriac as would my family.  I think my psychiatrist would probably agree with the taper (he always does).

 

Anything you could tell me about tolerance withdrawal would be helpful and thanks again for responding to my plea for help!    :)

 

Hi, runnerset.

 

You have a number of questions in this pm and I can't give you advice via private messages.  It's better to get multiple opinions anyway; we aren't doctors and are just speaking from personal experience which differs from person to person.  I'll post this on the thread you started yesterday so we can respond to it there.  Here's link to your thread:

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=9610.msg123051#msg123051

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Here is some information about tolerance and withdrawal:

 

"'Tolerance' occurs when your GABA (benzo) receptors have down-regulated in response to regular use of benzos. Put simply, your benzos will no longer deliver the therapeutic effects they did before you become tolerant. Only by increasing your dose might the effects of tolerance be counteracted. However, you are highly likely to become tolerant of the new dose - so starts a vicious circle of escalating benzo use. Since this is completely counter to our stated mission, in our opinion, the only sensible solution is to taper off at a sensible rate, and allow enough time for your GABA system to recover and regulate itself properly.

 

The longer you take benzodiazepines, the greater the chance that you will develop tolerance. Most people develop tolerance, and it is a gradual process. For some, this may occur and develop very rapidly, within a few weeks of their first dose. It is probably easier and wiser to taper off benzos before developing tolerance, and particularly before developing 'Tolerance Withdrawal' symptoms - we prefer the term Relative Withdrawal.

 

Relative (tolerance) Withdrawal refers to withdrawal effects that some people experience once they have become tolerant of their benzodiazepines. Although they are not reducing their dose, they nevertheless experience withdrawal-type symptoms. As with 'tolerance', increasing their dose might alleviate the symptoms, but they are likely to become tolerant of the increased dose too. The only good solution is to taper off at a sensible rate and allow enough time for the GABA system to recover. We should point out that only a small number of people develop Relative Withdrawal symptoms.

 

The difference between Tolerance and Relative Withdrawal is that Tolerance does not result in withdrawal-type effects. Tolerance purely means that the medication no longer delivers the therapeutic effects as it did before."

 

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thank you so much for the warm welcome here.  I will certainly refer this site to anyone I may encounter who is having similar issues and I know that they will find it a safe haven so to speak.  I am going to add a little more info re: that I am 51, stopped taking estrogen suddenly (mostly from the media hype about the health risks, none of which I invalidate but as we all know, everyone's body is different, our chemical makeup is uniquely ours).  My chemical makeup says "what the heck were you thinking?!!" - "get the estrogen back NOW!" and on top of that my body is saying "you really didn't think I was going to let the benzo's go that easy did you?".  

 

So some of my symptoms I can definitely identify as lack of estrogen and dummy me :idiot: didn't think to ask the MD if I should have tapered off of those over time (I have since learned that these also should be tapered) and the symptoms are not worth going without the estrogen (at least for the next several years as I am at low risk for the risks).

 

I am still trying to get the gist of navigating the site so forgive me if I send out a message the wrong way.

The other symptoms I am having are definitely not associated with going off the estrogen but since I have joined this site (and read a good deal of the the Ash(?) manual...sorry memory is not good - just read it yesterday and now can't think of her name) I understand much of what has been going on and feel a sense of relief even though I feel a little despair that it will take me a while to feel normal again.  I do sense that I will get back to who I am after reading so many testimonies here.  I have gotten some great advice so far and have nothing negative to say, everyone has been great!  ;D

 

I think that if most of us here are searching for a healthier and happier life and are supportive towards others in that quest which translates to hope for us all.  

 

If anyone has experienced or identified their symptoms as "tolerance withdrawal" and you have the time to answer I would greatly appreciate any advice, info, words of encouragement, hope etc.

 

Thank you all so much again. :)

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Should I divide the dosaging during the day (like .5mg 3xday) or maybe 1 dose of 0.75 during the day and again at night?  I took 0.5mg this am because my head feels funny (tightening of the jaw, band across my head, lightheaded, balance off sometimes if I turn to fast - not inner ear problem as I had that checked out, not sinus had a CT scan done, not blood pressure cause it always stays about the same, not on any other meds except for synthroid - tsh is normal (finally!!).  If I talked about this w/my primary care MD he'd think me a hypochondriac as would my family.  I think my psychiatrist would probably agree with the taper (he always does).

 

runnerset -

 

Ativan is a fairly short acting, short half-life benzo so you would probably benefit from splitting your dose throughout the day.  Every 8 hours (3x/day) would probably be best at the beginning.  You've probably already mentioned this but when do you take a dose and how much do you take at those times?  With this info., someone can suggest a way of shifting to 3x/day.

 

Most doctors don't know about the powerful effects of these drugs; even psychiatrist will say "it can't be withdrawal" on such a low dose (not that you are on a low dose.) That's why this forum is so very helpful IMO.

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I was taking 1.5 to 1.75 (on rare occasions I have had 2mg) at bedtime.  Also on rare occassions I would take 0.5 to 1 mg during the day (usually 0.5mg) but this was rare (maybe 1 or 2 times in a 2 week period of time).  I am sleeping ok right now (meaning no panic attacks or nightmare and my mind isn't racing as much) so I don't think I would need the higher dose at bedtime.

 

Any suggestions on how I could split this dosaging up during the day so when I do start tapering it would be easier?  I will say that my jaw and head feel the funniest during the middle of the day through early part of the evening.  In fact my jaw/neck/head hurt the most about 3pm-8pm.  I have been taking 800mg ibuprofen/1000mg tylenol (helps only a little) and the lightheadedness never seems to go away.  When I first wake up it isn't so bad.

 

I am trying to stay away from the Skelaxin (muscle relaxer) because I don't want to have to go through withdrawal with that but it is helpful as far as the muscle pain (neck,jaw).  The lightheadedness has been a problem before I started the muscle relaxer and the skelaxin doesn't seem to affect it one way or the other.

 

does anyone have a big problem with lightheadedness/feeling funny in head, i.e. like heavy air?  very hard to describe.

 

thanks

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Hey runnerset,

Welcome to Benzobuddies! I too had the head/neck/jaw pain on my 2nd taper. I was miserable for about 10 days. I had so much pressure in my head and had that lightheadedness feeling. Do your upper teeth hurt as well? Mine did! The pain was just all the way around my head. I think it was a form of tension headache. My head/jaw/neck pain was always worse in the afternoon as well. From about 2 pm until about an hour after I would take my evening dose. I would take my morning dose when I woke up, so the pain didn't start back again till around 2pm. I read other people's posts who also had head/neck/jaw pain, and saw these also on a list I have of withdrawal symptoms from benzos. Hang in there....the next time you taper, you may not have any of these problems. I didn't on my 3rd and now on my 4th taper. I have had other symptoms on these tapers, but not the horrible head stuff. Hope yours passes soon and doesn't come back on your next taper.

 

Lori

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I was taking 1.5 to 1.75 (on rare occasions I have had 2mg) at bedtime.  Also on rare occassions I would take 0.5 to 1 mg during the day (usually 0.5mg) but this was rare (maybe 1 or 2 times in a 2 week period of time).  I am sleeping ok right now (meaning no panic attacks or nightmare and my mind isn't racing as much) so I don't think I would need the higher dose at bedtime.

 

Any suggestions on how I could split this dosaging up during the day so when I do start tapering it would be easier?  I will say that my jaw and head feel the funniest during the middle of the day through early part of the evening.  In fact my jaw/neck/head hurt the most about 3pm-8pm.  I have been taking 800mg ibuprofen/1000mg tylenol (helps only a little) and the lightheadedness never seems to go away.  When I first wake up it isn't so bad.

I think working towards every 8 hours would serve you well and help head-off interdose withdrawal.  You have just the 1 mg tablets now, right?  Then you can cut them in 1/4s and shift .25mg. at a time every 2-3 days until your doses are something like .5mg morning, .5mg afternoon and .75 mg. evening, 8 hours apart. I'd probably start moving .25 mg to 12 hours after my evening dose and then keep shifting doses until you find a balance that suits you.

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Hi, Runnerset,

 

So glad you found this site and welcome.  I, too, am an RN.  Go figure......and we got hooked on the stupid benzos!!!!!  To find out about withdrawals go to 'Forum'......and on the same line you will see the 'BenzoGuide'....just click on that and it will explain withdrawals to you.  You will do fine during this process as long as you are determined.  We are here to help you.

 

Patty  xo

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HI Runnerset

 

I understand the withdrawl you are having. Went through it on my vacation (left the Ativan at home, did'nt know what was wrong with me) and last week when I decided to stop taking this drug - 'cause its addictive :-(

 

You are in the right place. Sympathetic support and experience abounds here as I've learned in the past week.

 

I split my single daily Ativan dose into 75% at my regular time and 25% at about 12 hours from my regular time. Now I'm gradually decreasing the 75% part. I felt better right off the start I think because of the split.

 

I'm sure you'll get stable and then get a taper plan going.

 

peace

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Hi Runnerset and welcome to BB.  There are many, many different withdrawal symptoms from benzo's.  Not every person will experience the same s/x as another, but lots of us have had the same symptoms.  Just keep posting with your concerns, and we will help you and support you!

 

Missy

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