Doctor's own research tool endorses Ashton Method!!! What the what!!!

Ok everyone.  This is crazy-train.  My doctor printed and gave me "Pharmacotherapy for generalized anxiety disorder" printed from his Wolters Kluwer's "Up To Date" research tool.  This is how the UpToDate research tool is described on its website:

 

"UpToDate is an evidence-based, physician-authored clinical knowledge system which clinicians trust to make the right point-of-care decisions. UpToDate’s more than 5,100 world-renowned physician authors, editors and peer reviewers use a rigorous editorial process to synthesize the most recent medical information into trusted, evidence-based recommendations that are proven to improve patient care and quality. More than 700,000 clinicians in 158 countries and almost 90% of academic medical centers in the U.S. rely on UpToDate, and more than 30 research studies confirm UpToDate’s widespread usage and association with improved patient care and hospital performance, including reduced length of stay, adverse complications and mortality."

 

Under "Second-Line Medications" and "Benzodiazepines" it says:  "Patients who develop rapid tolerance, increase their doses against medical advice, or exhibit withdrawal symptoms between doses are NOT good candidates for chronic benzodiazepine treatment."

 

More shocking is that under the heading "Administration" it says the following:

 

"Tapering off benzodiazepines is usually done VERY SLOWLY, at approximately 10% dose reduction per one to two weeks, if circumstances allow.  The prescriber should monitor the patient for symptoms of benzodiazepine withdrawal or relapse of GAD and slow the rate of dose reduction accordingly.  Early signs of withdrawal include anxiety, dysphoria, and tremor; advanced manifestations include perceptual disturbances, psychosis, and seizures (see "Benzodiazepine poisoning and withdrawal")."

 

Unfortunately, he did not give me the section on "Benzodiazepine poisoning and withdrawal" but I will ask for it next time I see him and I'm pretty sure he'll give it to me.

 

So anyone whose doctor says that you can go off benzos in like a week or two should tell their doctor to read this and educate themselves.  Again, the reference is:

 

Research Tool:  Wolters Kluwer's "UpToDate"

Topic: Pharmacotherapy for generalized anxiety disorder

Heading: Second-Line Medications

Subheading: Benzodiazepines

Sub-subheading:  Administration, paragraph 3.

 

And they should also read, "Benzodiazepine poisoning and withdrawal".  When I get that I'll post it on a new thread.

 

I can't believe this is available to them, and they don't read it. 

 

Chaz

 

 

 

 

Hi Chaz,

 

Wow, what a find!!! I am so happy your doctor knows that info and shared it with you. How cool!

 

Are you in the US?

 

This would be great to share with other members who get that feedback from their doctors you mentioned.

 

Thanks for posting this!

 

Summer

Hi Again Chaz,

 

No need to wait to hear from your doctor what UpToDate says about Benzo poisoning and withdrawal.

 

I googled uptodate and got the link and clicked on

Products then

typed in Benzodiazepines in the Search and here is the link:

 

http://www.uptodate.com/contents/benzodiazepine-poisoning-and-withdrawal?detectedLanguage=en&source=search_result&search=benzodiazepine+withdrawal&selectedTitle=1%7E20&provider=noProvider

 

I hope this is helpful,

Summer

This is great information! Thank you!

Summermeadow,

 

I think that's just a "preview" of the whole article.  I'll try and get the whole thing. Doctor's probably pay big money to subscribe to this service.  I don't believe it's free.

Thank you Chaz!

 

I will share!

 

My doctor said two weeks.  I couldnt believe it. 

Unbelievable  This just makes me want to scream, that correct information is there if they want to have it, if they "bother" to look for it. What they have done to us is criminal and then not to properly help us... unforgivable. I am so angry right now.

 

Thank you, this post is priceless. I will be printing it off for my doc.

 

hopeful2013

I'm also shocked that the Ashton manual, case studies and research publications are unknown to doctors when everyone of them should have knowledge of this work on benzodiazepines. Straight at medical school even.

wow chaz thanks i printed the first i hope you get the other my doctor thinks benzo's are ok to take im gonna take her this she's trying to taper me to fast maybe this will help if she still refuses then im gonna have to go  thanks so much for this i really do appreciate it

thanks for posting this. i am lost for words.

Ok everyone.  This is crazy-train.  My doctor printed and gave me "Pharmacotherapy for generalized anxiety disorder" printed from his Wolters Kluwer's "Up To Date" research tool.  This is how the UpToDate research tool is described on its website:

Thanks for posting that. For all of us who have gone through withdrawal this is a bit "duh!!!", but for some of the lazy doctors we deal with it would be an epiphany...

Just to put this into perspective:

 

If you start at 20 mg of V and cut 10%, that's the same as .9 the original amount. If you continue that in 25 stages, getting down to 1.4 mg of V, that will take about 1/2 year if you cut every week, a full year if you cut every 2 weeks.

 

20*.9^25=1.435796

 

So for someone like me who was in 1 mg of Klonopin, which is about the same as 20 mg of Valium, it should at least take somewhere between 1/2 year and a full year to get the dose down low enough to jump.

 

That's how STUPID most of these doctors are.

 

Facts are facts. They are just too lazy to read the facts...

 

 

the point is, a lot of doctors are aware of the ashton manual, they know it does

exist. even in a small bloody country like austria.

the fact is the they don't even want to discuss the gabaa receptor theory.

i have spoke to many and they wont even use the word gabaa receptors.

at university they have never been lectured about it and to them its just a theory ,

its not a scientificlally proven fact.

 

i think as soon as the British government will take actions about  the

whole catastrophe, the word will be spread all over the world.

 

the fact is the they don't even want to discuss the gabaa receptor theory.

i have spoke to many and they wont even use the word gabaa receptors.

at university they have never been lectured about it and to them its just a theory ,

its not a scientificlally proven fact.

 

 

 

Actually, it is a scientifically proven fact that benzos bind to GABA-A receptors; it is not a theory but is supported by very strong data across many labs for many years and is accepted as truth. Maybe the theory you are referring to is something else?

 

the fact is the they don't even want to discuss the gabaa receptor theory.

i have spoke to many and they wont even use the word gabaa receptors.

at university they have never been lectured about it and to them its just a theory ,

its not a scientificlally proven fact.

 

 

 

Actually, it is a scientifically proven fact that benzos bind to GABA-A receptors; it is not a theory but is supported by very strong data across many labs for many years and is accepted as truth. Maybe the theory you are referring to is something else?

 

the ashton manual is recognized but not accepted as scientific fact, thats what my

ignorant doctor told me and he also stated that they had never been lectured about

it at university. (40 years ago cause he is 60 now).

he refused a discussion about gabaa-receptors and so do most of them from what i have

read here.

Thank you for clarification. If I understand you correctly, you were referring to the Ashton manual methodologies as a "theory" for safe withdrawal? Because, at the molecular level, we do know that benzos (e.g. lorazepam and others) certainly bind to GABA-A receptors. 

I should also add that (while I am not a physician), I did take a course in neuropharmacology at a major medical school (I am a neurpharmacologist) and we were taught about ligand (endogenous [GABA] and exogenous [benzo]) binding properties at GABA-A sites.

Thank you for clarification. If I understand you correctly, you were referring to the Ashton manual methodologies as a "theory" for safe withdrawal? Because, at the molecular level, we do know that benzos (e.g. lorazepam and others) certainly bind to GABA-A receptors. 

 

thats what i meant. yes .

 

I should also add that (while I am not a physician), I did take a course in neuropharmacology at a major medical school (I am a neurpharmacologist) and we were taught about ligand (endogenous [GABA] and exogenous [benzo]) binding properties at GABA-A sites.

 

i suppose you did not take the course 40 years ago. right ?

I took the course 21 years ago.

I took the course 21 years ago.

And ain't that frightening?

 

By that I mean that if something has been common knowledge for that long, but doctors are still denying it, that sort of reinforces a lot of things many of us already think about the medical profession...

I took the course 21 years ago.

And ain't that frightening?

 

By that I mean that if something has been common knowledge for that long, but doctors are still denying it, that sort of reinforces a lot of things many of us already think about the medical profession...

 

its more than frightening Gary.

Chez, thanks again for posting this, it just confirms our suspicion. its bloody criminal.