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Not valium withdrawal at all, something worse


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Hi guys,

            I feel strangely detached and almost resigned to my fate. I guess I should be posting on a cirrhosis forum now. I'm scared and feel stupid. I have been feeling lousy all year with occasional pains in my liver area, occasional nausea, lethargy, dizziness, foggy brain, difficulty breathing, depression, etc and I attributed it all to benzo wd. Now it appeared it had nothing to do with stopping the valium.

 

I was a heavy drinker and painkiller addict but stopped sometime ago. All these symptoms of liver failure are also benzo wd symptoms which is worth bearing in mind. Last Sunday I started to feel really ill after having a only a couple of drinks the day before. Nausea, abdominal pain, intense itching and couldn't eat for days. I knew something was wrong so when it didn't improve I went to my Dr who did a liver function test. The ALT was slightly elevated but she wasn't worried. She thought it could've been caused by the tylenol I had been taking daily (just 1-2). She felt my liver and couldn't find any other abnormalities and tried to give me antidepressants again. She clearly thought it was a mental issue manifesting physically but I still felt so sick. Classic symptoms of liver disease. I have had occasional twinges coming from my liver for years but nothing like this.

 

I continued feeling shocking with a strange brain fog, felt so vague. Couldn't think straight which again is common in benzo wd and hepatic encepholopathy. It was never the bloody valium it appears! I felt much worse on wednesday night so I drove to the ER. After a long wait they examined me and did a full blood count but no scans. All the blood tests were now normal and they discharged me thinking it was gastro. However two days later I still have no appetite at all which is a new development and feel spaced out and nauseas. Strange thing is I haven't been drinking much this year and can't tolerate it. The only thing which could've been damaging my liver is the small amount of tylenol I was taking daily well within the normal dose.  Its unlikely. It seems I damaged my liver years ago and its only showing up this year. Benzo wd took all the credit!

 

I'm very scared and don't know what to do next. My 15 month old son will be without a father.

 

Anyone have any advice. The Dr's won't do a biopsy because the second round of blood tests were in the normal range and I have no clinical signs of liver failure.. I feel so itchy, nauseas, lethargic and apathetic, can't eat and still have a dull ache from my liver area. I also feel so spaced out, almost stoned. My wife thinks I'm being neurotic but I've never been this sick before. Hardly had a bite to eat since last weekend.

 

What should I do? Help.

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I would quit drinking. And I would quit taking Tylenol. It is known to cause liver problems.

 

But if your liver blood tests were normal, I don't think I'd worry too much until you do both of the above and wait long enough to see if that makes a difference. Both of them should. Both of those are baaaad for the liver.

 

It you want to protect your liver, sincerely, you will stop drinking and stop taking acetaminophen.

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Gussy,

 

You do not sound like you are really sure that the diagnosis is Cirrhosis. Did they tell you that this is a sure thing? I would think that your liver enzymes would be through the roof. Tylenol is bad if you mix it with alcohol, and particularly bad if you have liver disease. If this is your actual diagnosis you will likely be following up w a gastro. They can give you a better idea of what to expect. I had something happen to me while I was in w/d and I went nuts. I was really paranoid. I let it get a lot bigger than it was. I am hoping that you will get a clearer picture and maybe will not feel so down. Good luck. :smitten:

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Thanks Onelove,

                          But is it too late already? Apparently you can have severe liver damage but normal tests. I've hardly been able to eat all week and still feel nausea and abdominal pain.

 

How do you know when you've passed the point of no return?

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Just curious, how old are you and how long and how much (and what) is your drinking history?

 

If you've had two blood tests and your labs have come back normal, I'd doubt if you have cirrhosis. Liver tests are pretty reliable. I have hepatitis C that's dormant but I have labs every six months and they've always been right on target.

 

 

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I'm only 37 but I drank fairly heavily between the ages of 20-35. Not an extreme amount but a fair bit. Worse, I used to mix codeine/tylenol together with it before I knew the dangers. I stopped doing that. The main worry is the last week I've deteriorated a lot. Its far more than a wave and now I think I've been afflicted by liver disease all year and not benzo wd.

 

The liver function test was slightly abnormal on Tuesday but when I went to the ER the next day it was normal. I feel so sick its not funny and just know somethings seriously wrong. I've never been this bad before and I have a constant dull ache from the liver area.

 

Could you have cirrhosis with no obvious clinical signs that a Dr would immediately pick up on?

 

 

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I have found that Dr. Google does not always make the best diagnoses. If you're truly worried they can so a scan of your liver. Go get checked out. The liver can regenerate. Take care of yourself and your family and all will be well. I don't mean to minimize how you feel, and how scared you are, and it's great that you are facing so many things, you can handle this and find out where you really are and take care of yourself. Be well, Gally
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Is this a self diagnosis? It seems that your tests are fine so it is highly unlikely a major illness like liver failure would go unnoticed.

 

My 15 month old son will be without a father.

 

 

This catastrophising will only make you feel sicker and is hardly likely.

 

I'm sorry you feel so fearful and I hope you will be able to put your mind at rest soon.

 

Best wishes.

 

Xana

 

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Have you been checked for gallstones?

If you are interested in cleaning the liver, there is the liver flush which flushes stones from both the gallbladder and liver at curezone.com.

However, I wouldn't recommend anyone going thru benzo withdrawal do something like a liver flush until you reach 100% recovery.

A lowcarb diet can keep gallstone attacks from causing problems.

 

Personally, I have flushed over 1200 stones from my liver and gallbladder because I suffered nausea for over 5 years.

It didn't go away until I went lowcarb, and then, I decided to do the liver flushes.

 

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Thanks guys,

                    I feel embarrassed that I've been an imposter all year on BB. Benzo wd was never a problem. It was liver disease all along. Its obvious in retrospect. Valium just got the credit.

 

I was having intermittant, vague symptoms for years like pain in the liver area, itchiness, difficulty breathing, lethargy and apathy, nausea when I ate fatty food or drank any alcohol at all but they quickly went away and I forgot about it. Just a week ago I drank alcohol again, ate fatty food and popped a couple of tylenol and all hell broke loose. 5 days have gone by and I'm getting worse. Its happened before but this time its getting worse. Liver disease usually progresses silently and by the time symptoms show its too late. One blood work earlier in the week did show elevated liver enzymes and the second one in the ER showed normal values. But I've continued to get worse. The only thing I haven't done is turn yellow. I've got another Dr's appointment this afternoon.

 

Thanks for your support even if I'm in the wrong forum. I feel like crying when I look at my son.

 

Xana I'm not catastrophising. If your liver's stuffed your dead or you get a transplant. Its that simple.

 

I never thought I'd say this but I so wish I only had benzo wd. This puts it right into perspective. There's no coming back from a bad liver. Not surprising after the years of pounding alcohol and painkillers.

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Hi Gussy: I am so sorry you're facing this. I want to pass along something that I think you should read. The renowned Buddhist Pema Chodron has spoken quite a bit about addiction and use of things to make us feel better, and this is a story about her daughter in law, who was given two months to live from cirrhosis. She survived. There is hope:

 

 

"You know when addiction gets really strong. My daughter-in-law... at the age of thirty-five, they gave her two months to live from alcohol poisoning, cirrhosis of the liver. She was here last night. She lived. She's sober. It's five years later. But, she had to really hit bottom. And, I'll tell you, she was blown up like a blimp. She was this horrible yellow-green color, and her eyes were bright orange, and she would not stop drinking. I would get her to the hospital and they would drain her fluid —bottles and bottles and bottles of fluid— and soon as they would allow her to go, she'd go home and drink again.

 

Sometimes people never pull out of it. Why do we do those things? We all do those things to that degree or lesser. Why? It's stupid. But the reason we do it is because we imbue that drink or that scratching in whatever form with comfort. In order to move away from the basic uneasiness, we find comfort in certain things, which in moderation could enhance our life, but they become imbued with addictive quality. Then what could have enhanced our life, or brought delight to our life —like a taste, or a smell, or an activity, or anything—begins to make our life into a nightmare. All we're getting is this short-term symptom relief.

 

We are willing to sometimes die to keep getting short-term symptom relief. That's what it came down to [with my daughter-in-law], short-term symptom relief even when she took those sips, even though her life was more out of control every day and she was dying. But when she got paralyzed so she couldn't move and they took her child away, then she changed. And she had some friends who were there for her through the whole thing and that was helpful too. For her AA has been a savior. It doesn't work for everyone, but for her it's been a savior. "

 

As long as you're alive Gussy, there's hope, sending you healing, Gally

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Thanks Gally. I'm not that bad but I can feel its not good at all/

 

And to think this whole year I thought I was in benzo wd. In hindsight the liver had been slowly getting worse.

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'Xana I'm not catastrophising. If your liver's stuffed your dead or you get a transplant. Its that simple.'

 

I am not meaning to sound harsh or unsympathetic. I just mean that if you have been thoroughly examined and your liver has been pronounced fine, you are not going to die from liver failure. Of course you might have some other complaint which has not been discovered yet.

 

Liver enzymes can be mildly elevated (mine have been for years) for many reasons. This is not considered dangerous or a sign of liver failure. And you said the second set of tests were fine.

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my friends hubby died very young from liver disease. his stomach was HUGE. he was skinny......

 

plz stop drinking, it killed him.

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Gussy,

 

We've experienced many of the same symptoms here the past couple of months. As far as I know my liver is fine. Why am I experiencing nearly the same symptoms as you? I hope your suspicions of liver problems are mistaken and instead it is benzo w/d heightening the sensations you experience and reaction to them. As you stated above you wished benzo w/d was your problem, perhaps it still is.

 

Glad to hear the test results are good. Please keep us posted on further tests if you wish to. I am not discouraging you in any way from pursuing this issue further, but with one test normal and another slightly elevated for any number of possible reasons it would seem to me your outlook is quite positive. With any luck this is a false alarm and your liver proves to be perfectly fine. I'm very interested and hopeful for your complete recovery, take care!

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I have fatty liver disease.the doctor found it when they found out I had thyroid cancer. I've had this for about 3 years now. My liver enzymes get really high and then they go back into the normal range. I don't get sick I do have some liver pain. I am just confused 2 why it is you think you have liver disease. If you're really concerned about it you can have your doctor do a PET scan or a CT scan these cans will show if you have any liver issues..anytime you take a Tylenol and ibuprofen medicine of any sort is going to raise your liver enzymes.
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Thanks everyone,

                            Angel the reason I think its the liver is I feel so bad with very liver specific symptoms. I've had terrible abdominal pain, nausea, itchiness and absolute exhaustion for a week now. I haven't been able to eat anything all week yet haven't lost weight my belly seems disproportionately bloated to the rest of me. Worst of all is the confusion and apathy which is common in cirrhotic patients. I thought it was DP/DR! I wish. I've never felt so bad and it makes benzo wd seem like an annoyance. I retrospect it seems that it was mere coincidence that I went off benzo's at the same time as my liver worsened. I would have damaged it years ago when I was living in Vietnam and tylenol, codeine 500/30 were available OTC. I pounded them back like there was no tommorrow and washed them down with beer. Stupid but I didn't know the dangers of tylenol. I've been good for the last year but it seems like the damage was long done.

 

Everything points towards cirrhosis and unfortunately when liver damage is very severe the liver function tests often return to normal.

 

By the way Innadaze difficulty breathing is a common symptom in liver disease and when it occurs the prognosis is bad.

 

I guess I'm feeling sorry for myself but I've got a bad feeling about this one.

 

Thanks so much for your support everyone. You just feel like your dying. I really am. Ironically Danyhighwayman is worried about his liver but chances are he's ok because he didn't abuse OTC painkillers with alcohol.

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Gussy,

 

ALT levels fluctuate normally throughout the day, it's not liver specific anyway.

 

Please don't do this to yourself, okay? 

 

Chinook

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There's only one positive if I am diagnosed with cirrhosis. I will have nothing to lose so I may as well go back on the benzo's after going through what I did to get off them.

 

Life sure has a sick sense of humour, doesn't it? :-[

 

Chinook what makes you think its not my liver? Looking back it was never benzo wd.

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Gussy,  You say you have itchiness all over.  So do I.  But I have rashes.  Do you or  do you just have the itchiness?

 

Snufi

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Just have the itchiness. Don't worry Snufi I think your liver is fine. You would have a lot more going on than just that.

 

The scariest thing is that I haven't been able to eat all week and I've actually put on weight. This is what happens in end stage cirrhosis.

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Gussy,

 

I fail to see how doctors who have evaluated the tests would just let someone with end stage cirrhosis walk out the door to die. Benzo belly could explain the eating issues and weight gain. Have read about it time and time again as a w/d symptom. My appetite and nausea come and go. Weight fluctuates. At this point I don't believe anyone sharing their common symptoms with you will help. You seem absolutely convinced with no concrete evidence.

 

Maybe you can go back and demand further liver testing so this can be ruled out or begin treatment? I hope you can find out with certainty if your liver is healthy or not.

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Hi Innadaze,

                    In Australia the ER doctors just want to check your not going to die then and there and get you out the door. With my symptoms they shouldn't have discharged me but they're busy and thats the public healthcare system. Its free and you get what you pay for. They should have done scans and maybe a biopsy.

 

I'm very scared because this time I have a real bad feeling. I had a feeling it was more than benzo wd. I also feel extremely dazed and can't think straight. I have trouble even remembering basic things and feel slowed down. I'm still very nauseus, can't eat and have pain over my liver.

 

Thanks for your support mate. I know its bad.

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It sounds like you have had things checked out pretty good but if you are still sure that it's something else it's never going to hurt to get several opinions, just keep in mind that benzo wd can mimic many other medical conditions so I wouldn't rule it out.
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