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What does vitamin C do for histamine? Dave what do you eat everyday?

 

Vitamin C supports the levels of DAO. DAO is what breaks down histamine and keeps histamine levels in check. So supplementing with vitamin C is super important in balancing that histamine response. But persons with histamine intolerance need to be careful with how they get the vitamin C. Obviously citrus is out for the most part. I get my vitamin C from berries, predominately camu camu powder.

 

I eat fresh meat. As fresh as I can be assured I get it. Poultry, beef, and some fish that I'm reasonably sure has been frozen immediately. I don't thaw these on the counter or in the refrigerator, I defrost them in the microwave and cook them promptly. if I have leftovers, they go into the freezer. And even though it is kind of a bummer to have to re-thaw and microwave them, it is worth it. Histamine levels increase crazily even in refrigerated foods that have already been cooked. The fresh chicken, beef, or fish you had Friday night may hurt you on Saturday night after the leftovers have sat in the fridge for 24 hrs. So my diet is fairly protein heavy and as fresh as possible.

 

But for carbohydrates, I like potato, quinoa, rice, and whole grain or gluten free pasta. Vegetables are predominately root vegetables like squash, yams, carrots. Leafy greens are romaine lettuce, chard, collard greens. Spinach I stay away from, it is high in histamine. Fruits are berries, melons (except watermelon), apples, etc.

 

Occasionally I break the rules. It's important to remember that we all have a certain threshold for histamine. And histamine is actually super important for our bodily processes. But there is a limit that with those of us that are sensitive to it, is really important to obey. It's like a bucket inside you that has an overfill line. If you stay under that line, you're going to feel alright. You go over that line, you're going to feel it hardcore and it takes several days of behaving for the levels to drop back below that line. Outdoor sources of histamine like pollen contribute to this. So in the winter for example, I can eat bananas a little more regularly. This time of year, it's a bad idea.

 

Anyway, I hope some of this helps. I think that histamine issues are SUPER common in people who have used, or are using, Remeron. My system has come along way in healing from it. Just like GABA receptors upregulate as the Benzo damage heals, so to do the histamine receptors.

 

Dave

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That's wonderful information Dave, i think you deservr a PhD degree in this section.lol.According to things you said and i lived firsthand both, the histamin side of remeron is being underestimated in the FB groups, SA or some otherwhere. For example, Erin Green said that she went on well with her pace, but had debilitiating headaches, but once she said she regularly took lemon sauced olives. May it be a reason of that. I remember you talked about quercetin on this forum somewhere, may i take it to alleviate some sxs at this time?headache or sth else?

 

Even i name it as wave sometime, it may be a thing stemming from last or previous days leftover. What do you think about the presence of the issues once you eat it?Last week thursday i ate fish i felt terrible friday and i felt comparably well sunday.This week i ate fish&onion combo thursday(bazaar day) and as if a lorry hit me you know and i will be cautious after that. I hope it settles down a little today.

 

Lets talk about the freshness of protein. How can i assure myself about this? In modern world, you know, for example a beef is processed somewhere and then sent to the markets 3 hours or more away with frigochain. Then, it may wait there for some days, but still in frigochain and we buy it.It is also valid for chicken. I think i need to rearrange my habits like that i should buy beef from the safe street butcher where the flow is rapid. I think you agree that. But it is too hard for chicken, as you know it is very hard to find organic chicken, so most of us buy it from the markets. Fish is a hard issue too. I live by sea. But, when i ask to seller whether it is fresh or not, the answer of course "brother, they have just come from the sea" but it may be a big lie.But one thing i learn recently is markets are safe than bazaars, because there is a frigochain, even if their products are olderfrozen.

 

Lastly, i want to ask some question about the foods which are known as banned. For example, milk is known as dangerous on benzo boards, but in the list some types of milk are free. Like that i want some advice from you for below foods if there is a safe kind of them:

 

1)Cheese

2)Yoghurt

3)Milk

4)Gluten free wheats or foods

5)Protein Bars(to balance blood sugar)

6)Raw Almond(to balance blood sugar)

7)Beans(i dont understand they are safe in the state of being fresh opposite to they are unsafe while they are being dried)

 

Forgive me, i took your time again, but your effort is 💯/💯 for us. As you see, i suffered yesterday and you again reassured me. Thanks a lot

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I really do think the histamine issues are overlooked with Remeron because so often, this drug is looked at as only a psychiatric medication. But with its affect on the histamine receptors, it really goes much further than that. I know Jack has written before about doctors who have basically quoted him Google results when advising him on medications. I know that when I was in the hospital, I told one of the psychiatrists that I thought Remeron's affect on the histamine receptors was troubling and the psychiatrist said, "What are you talking about, it doesn't have anything to do with histamine!" Wow... That is completely wrong. And these are the people we entrust our well-being to.

 

Quercetin may work for you. I have taken it on and off. It often comes mixed with Vitamin C. It is worth a try. Another natural source of quercetin would be tart cherry extract - either in capsule form, or liquid. It's so hard to recommend supplements because I know they are costly and what works for some may not work for others. Another thing that can be supplemented is DAO. That is really expensive, I have never done it, but done things instead to support DAO production like the camu camu form of Vitamin C.

 

So here is the interesting thing about how histamine affects a person who has an intolerance. Some people have an almost immediate reaction to histamine-heavy food. Flushing, difficulty breathing, dizziness, sneezing, etc. That is not how it happens for me, nor most people with Remeron use from what I have seen. With me, I tend to feel symptomatic many hours after I've eaten. I think this is because as the food is digested in my intestinal tract, the histamine is released due to insufficient DAO and that is when I feel poorly. And feeling poorly like that lasts many hours to a few days or so before starting to lift. Anxiety, headache, dizziness, depression, these were my big symptoms of histamine reactivity.

 

Freshness of animal protein. It truly is an issue. And I would imagine that depending on where you live in the world, it can different. For me, the beef and chicken I buy are from local farmers. The benefit of this is that the protein's journey from slaughter to my plate is much shorter than meats that are sold through a conventional grocery store. In terms of fish, I never buy fish that is being displayed. I always purchase cod, salmon, and other fatty fish that have been flash frozen. Shellfish are another big no-no. Shrimp, scallops, clams and oysters, all of these have massive histamine loads which is why so many people are "allergic to shellfish."

 

Here's my understanding about the foods you listed taken from the link I sent, and my own experience:

 

1)Cheese

Dave Note: "young cheese" like cream cheese, sheep cheese, goat cheese, they are generally well-tolerated. My rule is, the more a cheese smells, the more you should stay away from it. Because cheese that has that strong cheese odor is aged - and aged means histamine.

 

2)Yoghurt

Dave Note: Yoghurt can be tolerated by some people, I never did well with it personally. The strains of probiotic that are often in yoghurt can be of the high-histamine producing type.

 

3)Milk

Dave Note: Sheep milk, goat milk, and cow milk are ok, but preferred pasteurized. I could tolerate milk sometimes.

 

4)Gluten free wheats or foods

Dave Note: I did pretty well with gluten free breads, and even gluten containing breads. This is one people need to experiment with. Often times breads contain vinegar, which can be troublesome. Sour dough breads can be tricky. And obviously if someone has an underlying gluten intolerance, that can aggravate things.

 

5)Protein Bars(to balance blood sugar)

Dave Note: Be careful for those that contain soy. My real problem with protein bars is that there are SO MANY ingredients in them. The less ingredients, the better. I have at times used whey protein bars for muscle growth, but again, watch the ingredient lists.

 

6)Raw Almond(to balance blood sugar)

Dave Note: I do ok with raw almonds. They rate low on the histamine scale, so they may be ok for you. Pistachios if they are available are a good nut for those of us with histamine intolerance I have found.

 

7)Beans(i dont understand they are safe in the state of being fresh opposite to they are unsafe while they are being dried)

Dave Note: I have never done well with beans and histamine. Beans/pulses are both high in histamine AND histamine liberators, so they are generally not recommended.

 

My best advice to anyone trying to figure this out is to do an elimination diet. And it doesn't need to be a crazy long one.

 

The way I did it was this. I knew I tolerated baked chicken, rice, and carrots very well. And for a full week, I ate nothing but that. Drove my family crazy, but oh well, it needed to be done. :) Then every two days after that, I would add a new food. So maybe I would try a cheese, or beef, or pasta, or some kind of baked product. Wait two days after trying each of those. If I had no reaction, I'd add it to my list of "safe" foods. If I reacted, I'd add it to my "unsafe" list.

 

For all the aggravation of paying this kind of attention to food, I will say that it is totally worthwhile. Knowing what you can eat that won't cause you to feel poorly is amazing. Sometimes I will "cheat." I'll have that slice of pizza loaded with tomato sauce. Or I'll eat that hamburger that I don't know where the meat came from. Or I'll have that chocolate dessert. But that is rare. Like once a month. And I can get away with that.

 

I hope this helps, buddies!

 

Dave

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Of course this helps brother. You are absolutely great!

 

PS1:I ate a pot of mussels 1 month ago,thought i was passing away.

PS2:Here is the mainland of pistachios.

PS3:I hope WD of cuts arent bigger this histamin bomb times...

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Of course this helps brother. You are absolutely great!

 

PS1:I ate a pot of mussels 1 month ago,thought i was passing away.

PS2:Here is the mainland of pistachios.

PS3:I hope WD of cuts arent bigger this histamin bomb times...

 

June, it it makes you feel better it can probably go either way. I had a major problem with histamine when I first quit benzos and tapering Mirt was getting rough. I ate too much histamine on Christmas last year and spent the night throwing up. Now I am at 3 mg and I eat fish, lobster, clams, can tolerate spinach again if I don’t get too carried away. I eat eggs for breakfast everyday and am eating way too much fast food lately than I should. I am eating massive amounts of histamine lately and experience only minor discomfort. I even eat chocolate again. I am going to start getting strict with my diet again tough to help me through the low doses at the end of this taper. I expect to have a rougher fall allergy and spring allergy season as well. Just want to report that my histamine issues are improving. Last spring I ate salmon for dinner and felt like I was back in acute benzo withdrawal for a week. I could  eat salmon now with minimal issues.

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Of course this helps brother. You are absolutely great!

 

PS1:I ate a pot of mussels 1 month ago,thought i was passing away.

PS2:Here is the mainland of pistachios.

PS3:I hope WD of cuts arent bigger this histamin bomb times...

 

June, it it makes you feel better it can probably go either way. I had a major problem with histamine when I first quit benzos and tapering Mirt was getting rough. I ate too much histamine on Christmas last year and spent the night throwing up. Now I am at 3 mg and I eat fish, lobster, clams, can tolerate spinach again if I don’t get too carried away. I eat eggs for breakfast everyday and am eating way too much fast food lately than I should. I am eating massive amounts of histamine lately and experience only minor discomfort. I even eat chocolate again. I am going to start getting strict with my diet again tough to help me through the low doses at the end of this taper. I expect to have a rougher fall allergy and spring allergy season as well. Just want to report that my histamine issues are improving. Last spring I ate salmon for dinner and felt like I was back in acute benzo withdrawal for a week. I could  eat salmon now with minimal issues.

 

So,you are saying it is a term which may depend season,current dose or accumulative effect of the foods that i eat and also suppose not harmful albeit i pay attention to histamine foods. As you know, my only and big problem has been anxiety, but now i am getting terrible anxiety, depression and some other things. I found that i ate too much chicken product(especially chicken neck sold at bazaar) and foods with sunflower oil supposing that they arent harmful.

Upon WD, this histamine mess is so disgusting.I am steadily thinking in these days whether the issues are from WD or histamine related.Last week, i ate fish too, but it stayed 2 days and i found big relief with Vit C for some days then. Ňow it is day 3 and i am living terrible anxiety,depression and restless face nerves.GI issues have settled down. I think it takes some time to get back 'normal' once the routine and mast cell balance are out of order. Hope soothes soon and get back my functionality...

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I am terribly experiencing and understanding Mast Cell Activation. I am both happy understanding this and unhappy suffering after eating some foods. Everyday is a lesson of this reality. Once the histamine bucket is full of histamin agent and the gut flora is out of order after throwing beneficial mucus and so bacterias, it requires some great effort to keep calm and making some arrangements.I have been eating like a junk supposing i am conscious about that, but this stuff requires much more, you know. Thankfully, there are Dave and some of you who warn us about the things we must obey!

 

Firstly, i twiced my bazaar shops from once a week. I have been doing well at home, but this is not enough, i have stopped to eat @work because there is no guarentee about the foods whether they are fresh or not perished.I stopped crazy protein eating until my bucket is empty some.I am just eating egg yolk frequently to support my plant based new habit.I hope this and quercetin support works very well,because they worked interminently.Now i need your prayers to get these rough days.Tx all of you

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  • 3 weeks later...

Hey all,

          So today is a big day for me as I am now officially at 3 mg. I graduate to a 1 ml syringe which is my last big milestone on this journey. This allows me to change my taper a little. I had been tapering .15 mg twice a week and then holding when symptoms became too severe. This smaller syringes will allow smaller more frequent cuts. I will now be cutting .06 mg every 2 days and holding when necessary. I have cut sweets out of my diet and am bring somewhat careful with histamine levels. I guess this also means I will be jumping from .06 mg of Remeron. Does anyone know if that is low enough? I don’t know how I could measure any smaller than that but where there is a will there is a way I guess. I am nervous about the lower doses after hearing so many report great difficulty with the last few milligrams. I am crossing my fingers.

 

June, any luck with controlling histamine levels? Curious if you have been able to get any relief from your symptoms.

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June, any luck with controlling histamine levels? Curious if you have been able to get any relief from your symptoms.

 

I am glad you have some good times about your condition. Please be careful at this times, because the tapering curve says it breaks more vertical after these doses.

 

I have been doing very bad for 1 year supposing my diet is so clean. And I have had bad times for this reason apart from anxiety. Now i know if have some sxs at the same time out of blue, it is histamine problems. Especially at the times when i dont cut or small cut. I am doing every step what Dave did back then. Paying attention to feed plant based but dont neglect protein issue. I am eating fresh frozen and fresh thawed meats, fresh slaughtered meats, but if i do it, i am taking a little quercetin powder before meat meals or before histamine ranked meals. After doing that, i havent had so much problems about it.Also paying attention to keep blood sugar levels stable.

 

Oooo.Anxiety.My closest buddie.You know it hasnt stopped since starting. I remember coming here and crying 1 year ago and you made me assure and soothe about that.I cant figure out how a health problem could be such devastating and long term, i couldnt think a diabetic person has high sugar levels for such a long term, or someone has high blood pressure. I had a short term drug mess in May 19 and since then i had no peace. I know i would totally heal by now, but things were so dramatic to start this stuff. How ironic a drug to stop those days' anxiety would cause more anxiety!I cant figure out how dozens of people have healed most sxs even after strong benzos and how my only and persistent anxiety still hits me by now.

 

I found that pure Ascorbic Acid has a wonderful effect on stopping my anxiety, but it gave me huge GI issues.So then i stopped it. Now i am taking the most absorbable form of Vit C, which is Lipozomal C, its' daily dosages are 3 or 4 grams. I am combining it with No Flush Niacin 1.5 or 2 grams. Thats a famous combination which a Canadian doc Abram Hoffer used his patients to help heroin WD. I now know firsthand Vit C soothed my anxiety to a degree even if it hasnt stopped completely.Thats my condition and i am waiting it to stop anymore. Last 2 months have been a real big challenge and i hope it completes its course soon.

 

Take care

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  • 2 weeks later...

How a heavy burden on one's life!

 

I have been doing somethings to put it the right way. Taking care to feed low histamine foods. Taking away the extra stressors from my life. Doing somethings to suffer less.

 

While doing sth needed to be more functional, i was seeking DAO supplement to reduce histamine response this morning. My wife scolded me "there is one thing that you havent bought, buy it too, but when the subject is things for home, you think it many times.". I said that you still dont know how i suffered and she replied dont believe the things you read on the internet, just go to the doctor. Of course i replied they brought me into this condition bla bla bla..

 

That was just a little part of this strong debate. Higher volumes, opposing accusations. I dont know how i could explain my condtion who dont know the things we live even if she is my wife.

 

Thats the hardest part of this stuff after suffering...

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How a heavy burden on one's life!

 

I have been doing somethings to put it the right way. Taking care to feed low histamine foods. Taking away the extra stressors from my life. Doing somethings to suffer less.

 

While doing sth needed to be more functional, i was seeking DAO supplement to reduce histamine response this morning. My wife scolded me "there is one thing that you havent bought, buy it too, but when the subject is things for home, you think it many times.". I said that you still dont know how i suffered and she replied dont believe the things you read on the internet, just go to the doctor. Of course i replied they brought me into this condition bla bla bla..

 

That was just a little part of this strong debate. Higher volumes, opposing accusations. I dont know how i could explain my condtion who dont know the things we live even if she is my wife.

 

Thats the hardest part of this stuff after suffering...

 

I have gone against the grain my whole life. It is not easy at all but it is the most rewarding in the end. They don't know how hard we fight to just get out of bed and go to work in the morning. They don't know what it is like to sit down and watch a movie just to prove to yourself that you can. They just watch it, they can't feel the extreme restlessness that we feel in withdrawal and how sitting down to watch a movie to us sometimes is the equivalent of them free climbing a skyscraper. If they understood they certainly would not act the way they do or say the things they do. We push through an unimaginable hell just to put food on the table everyday. We do it so well that we allow them to think to themselves that it must not be that bad. That is a testament to our strength. The fact is that as much as they judge us in our weak states they probably would not handle it as gracefully as we have. When I say "they" I mean everyone in our lives we wish we could confide in who try to convince us if we just take a deep breath we will go back to normal. Those who have been brainwashed by doctors and drug companies to believe that there is no such thing as psychiatric medication withdrawal. They try to convince us that we need meds that we lived without for years totally fine. We will get off the medication and get better and then they will know the truth.

 

I have had to start controlling histamine levels as well now. Ragweed allergy season has been taking it's toll on me here in the US. About a month left in it. Now that I am down to 2.64 mg I have been struggling with mild nausea for a large portion of the day and quite a bit of insomnia. I had to call out of work today because I did not sleep a minute last night. I have not gotten more than 6 hours sleep in weeks which is not normal for me. My vacation a couple of weeks ago was ruined by 3 FULL DAYS of insomnia. I was so tired and sick I could not function at all. I am definitely struggling. So far not even close to what I went through in Xanax withdrawal but this seems to definitely be getting tougher as I get lower. I have not lost a single nights sleep throughout this entire taper until the last couple of weeks. The nausea is not that bad but definitely annoying. It goes away if I eat most of the time. If I eat the wrong thing it comes back. Those are my most notable symptoms at this point. I am trying not to hold until I get to 2 mg but I certainly will if I have to.

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I am very tired that she cant understand me mostly. So, when the things are too much, i am just saying "when you have headache, you could up your majezik or ibuprofen intake to 5 or 6 times daily, think about me, my weakest sx is strong headache and there are 4 or 5 sxs at the same time sometimes". That is the thing i defence myself and mostly works. lol.

 

Jack, i know you know the best and yourself the best, but i think you should slow it down a little. You have come here with minimal disturbances except some waves but i am really very very much surprised how this stuff worked in terms of histamine sxs. So if you have had these times like insomnia, please be cautious and let your body to catch up cumulatives. I dont want to breakdown your courage but i am reading many people come here without little problem and suffer greatly after 1 or 2 mgs, so please take it easy and dont consider this stuff as a thing to escape, consider it as a histamine drug to help with histamine intolerance and Mast Cell Stabilizer. I am seeing it like that, otherwise i suffer with OCD. If you ask me, you could also try Liposomal Form of Vit C for 1000 mg 3 or 4 times daily. It did nothing to my stomach opposing to pure powder. I strongly believe it has an important role to decrease both MCAS and anxiety. I am also using pure powder quercetin before meals, but i am suspicious about it due to the low absorption. If i had a chance to acquire it Lipo form here, i would definitely try. The other and big gun is DAO which has no production here. So i cant try it now.

 

Take care brother.

 

June

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  • 3 weeks later...

I just finished my long taper of Mirtezapine 5 days ago and I’m getting slammed. I slow tapered for about 19 months off 3.75Mg Mirtezapine. I went all the way down to a tiny dot of powder. I am relieved to be off from it so now to heal. I hope these withdrawal symptoms pass soon. I was wondering how Pokey is doing now since he came off.

 

:smitten:Jackie

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I am celebrsting you because of your long journey reaches to an end.Now be happy to see this finish line.I also wonder Pokey too.

 

I am struggling the ulcer,gastrit etc sxs which artificial Vit C's gave me. Goddamn supplements, too. I have been using it for 2-3 months regularly or intermittently. This rush made my ongoing anxiety to an incredible level.I am curious is there anyone who suffered acute ulcer while being on remeron. I am trying to surpress it while using olive and coconut oils before meals. My gut flora has been upside down due to this disturbence, too. Everything was going smooth due to low histamine diet, but this is too hard. I think i am living a rough period which Jack lived in Covid. I hope this would be acute and my stomach and gut will find peace after supplements terror. If you have a suggestion, please chime in.

 

Jackie, congrulations again

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Hi Jackie. What an accomplishment to be finished with Mirt! I know how incredibly hard it is to taper horrible Mirt. Hang on, the withdrawal will fade away hopefully soon.

 

Be well,

 

Becky

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I just finished my long taper of Mirtezapine 5 days ago and I’m getting slammed. I slow tapered for about 19 months off 3.75Mg Mirtezapine. I went all the way down to a tiny dot of powder. I am relieved to be off from it so now to heal. I hope these withdrawal symptoms pass soon. I was wondering how Pokey is doing now since he came off.

 

:smitten:Jackie

 

Hi Jackie,

            Happy to hear you made it to zero. I hope your symptoms pass soon. Last we heard from Pokey he was not doing well and had reinstated to 1 mg. His last post where he mentioned it he had tapered down to .8 mg. He jumped from .1 mg. If you went lower you may have better luck. My taper is supposed to end at .06 mg which is quite a bit different from where he jumped and I am hoping it affords me better luck. I am getting slammed right now myself. I am at 2.28 mg and I am not sure what happened. It may be seasonal allergy related because I got slammed with the same symptoms last October and ended up in the ER on Oct 27 of last year. As soon a first frost hit and killed the ragweed I tapered symptom free after that at the same speed until I got slammed again in March which also happens to be the first month of spring allergies around here. What sucks is that according to the weather forecast we may not see first frost for another month this year. Uggh. Right now I feel like I have a 101 fever but I am 98.1, so weird.

 

I am really crossing my fingers that you get a break soon.

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Jack and Becky,have you ever tried a low histamine diet?I think you should consider some about it which definitely will give you some relief from foods.

 

BTW,i am really struggling with ulcer which supplements gave.One of you have ever suffered it?What does it add to our gut flora,what is the mechanism underlying it?I feel more depressive and anxious after having ulcer onset. Is there a histamine friendly nondrug solution which you could suggest. I hope it soothes soon.

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Jack and Becky,have you ever tried a low histamine diet?I think you should consider some about it which definitely will give you some relief from foods.

 

BTW,i am really struggling with ulcer which supplements gave.One of you have ever suffered it?What does it add to our gut flora,what is the mechanism underlying it?I feel more depressive and anxious after having ulcer onset. Is there a histamine friendly nondrug solution which you could suggest. I hope it soothes soon.

 

Hi June,

          Yes I have tried the histamine diet. It works great. But I have been way off of it lately. I am currently starting to tighten it back up. I have had stomach problems my whole life. I have had multiple ulcers, gastritis, duodenities, esophagitis on and off over the years. I have to head out to work right now. I'll give you a bunch of pointers when I get home later, I have a lot of info for you on that topic.

 

Jack

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Jack and Becky,have you ever tried a low histamine diet?I think you should consider some about it which definitely will give you some relief from foods.

 

BTW,i am really struggling with ulcer which supplements gave.One of you have ever suffered it?What does it add to our gut flora,what is the mechanism underlying it?I feel more depressive and anxious after having ulcer onset. Is there a histamine friendly nondrug solution which you could suggest. I hope it soothes soon.

 

Hi June,

          Yes I have tried the histamine diet. It works great. But I have been way off of it lately. I am currently starting to tighten it back up. I have had stomach problems my whole life. I have had multiple ulcers, gastritis, duodenities, esophagitis on and off over the years. I have to head out to work right now. I'll give you a bunch of pointers when I get home later, I have a lot of info for you on that topic.

 

Jack

 

Hi brother,

I am happy to hear that you have some clues about it. Because,  if i had it while in not wd, it woild be painful again but not bring any extra problems like broking gut etc. This gave me hugh anxiety and sometimes depression. You know i havent suffered too much depression. But Ascorbic Acid totally sucked my digestion system and i am here with struggle. Now i am taking cold press olive oil and coconut oil before meals. Pomegranate between meals. I am thinking to take black seed oil. Lots of brocoli, cauli and cabbage in small amounts which they are supposed to cut ulcer in short term. Today, i bought a natural mixture from a naturashop, saw it contains St John Worth and then gave back. No need to add extra problems to this. I will be waiting your message. I want to be free this gastritis and ulcer without drug(and i know they destroy also)not to wish escape itself, just wishing to have a peaceful wd for Gut..

 

One more thing.Is it usual to take panic due to ulcer,gastritis etx.Tx

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Hi June. Sorry I don't have experience with ulcers. I take zero supplements/vitamins because I seem to get bad reactions every time I try one. My diet is not great and I have not tried a low histamine diet--it sounds too restrictive. I might try it at some point but now just try not too eat too much sugar. I notice lots of sugar makes w/d worse. I am going slow on my taper because I want minimum withdrawal. I still get hit though. Good luck.

 

Becky

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Hi June, Becky and Jack, thank you all for the congratulations. It does feel great to be off this med. No more weighing pills. I went through 3 scales towards the end and I got so low on my dose that my scale wouldn’t weigh anymore. Anything below 0.04grams it just wouldn’t weigh it so I ended up eyeballing it. My last month was literally a tiny speck, it felt ridiculous to keep doing it but I did anyway.

 

This medication is different then when I tapered Valium. The withdrawal is different. Valium seemed more predictable. I’m feeling better today but I know this swings wildly from day to day. I tried some Magnesium Calm the other day and I believe it sent me in a tailspin. I’m just going to put all supplements away for awhile. I can’t take C either. Messed me up also.

 

Sorry, June about the ulcer.  I can only imagine how painful that would be. Stomach issues are the worst.

 

Allergies were bad for me too, Jack but now am doing better with that. I’m in Iowa and we have had snow twice now and more coming Sunday.

 

Becky, are you still tapering Mirtezapine?

 

Thanks so much everyone. I’ll keep you posted.

 

Jackie :smitten: :smitten:

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Hi Jackie. Yes I am tapering Mirt. I'm going on about the same pace as you are, but started at 7.5 mg. Tonight I am making a cut to the 5's. Yes, avoid supplements for now as your nervous system is adjusting. I notice lately that I am reacting to different things, numbing gel at the dentist, antifungal spray for my rash, coffee, etc. Remember it's all windows and waves and it keeps getting better. Good luck Jackie, you've done the hard work.

 

Becky

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Jack and Becky,have you ever tried a low histamine diet?I think you should consider some about it which definitely will give you some relief from foods.

 

BTW,i am really struggling with ulcer which supplements gave.One of you have ever suffered it?What does it add to our gut flora,what is the mechanism underlying it?I feel more depressive and anxious after having ulcer onset. Is there a histamine friendly nondrug solution which you could suggest. I hope it soothes soon.

 

Hi June,

          Yes I have tried the histamine diet. It works great. But I have been way off of it lately. I am currently starting to tighten it back up. I have had stomach problems my whole life. I have had multiple ulcers, gastritis, duodenities, esophagitis on and off over the years. I have to head out to work right now. I'll give you a bunch of pointers when I get home later, I have a lot of info for you on that topic.

 

Jack

 

Hi brother,

I am happy to hear that you have some clues about it. Because,  if i had it while in not wd, it woild be painful again but not bring any extra problems like broking gut etc. This gave me hugh anxiety and sometimes depression. You know i havent suffered too much depression. But Ascorbic Acid totally sucked my digestion system and i am here with struggle. Now i am taking cold press olive oil and coconut oil before meals. Pomegranate between meals. I am thinking to take black seed oil. Lots of brocoli, cauli and cabbage in small amounts which they are supposed to cut ulcer in short term. Today, i bought a natural mixture from a naturashop, saw it contains St John Worth and then gave back. No need to add extra problems to this. I will be waiting your message. I want to be free this gastritis and ulcer without drug(and i know they destroy also)not to wish escape itself, just wishing to have a peaceful wd for Gut..

 

One more thing.Is it usual to take panic due to ulcer,gastritis etx.Tx

 

So, in the past when I have had an ulcer or bad gastritis with it came panic attacks and weird breathing issues. I think it has to do with irritation of the vagus nerve. So, it is tough to take care of without meds but I will give you a rundown on meds and non medication remedies and how well they work and how they may interact here.

 

Firstly, olive oil and coconut oil are in my opinion terrible options for ulcer. They are both extremely acidic. They are frequently recommended for their ability to kill H Pylori bacteria which is a leading cause of ulcer. However if your ulcer/gastritis is not caused by H Pylori like in your case where you believe the cause was irritation from acidic supplements I would steer clear of acidic oils. They are very healthy so by all means cook with them but limit their use for sure.

 

Bread. If you can tolerate bread then this is great for soaking up stomach acid and fats in the stomach that irritate the stomach lining. DO NOT eat fresh bread. Fresh bread like Italian bread or fresh rolls or bagels have active yeast and will irritate your digestive tract. This is a scenario where wonder bread is actually the healthier option for you for now. I have found that it doesn't matter much if it is whole wheat or white. Whatever you can tolerate. I know it does not go with a histamine diet so see how it goes. Many with histamine intolerance tolerate this type of bread just fine. I know I do.

 

Water. You need to drink a ton of water. If your kidneys are healthy your body can process 15 liters of water safely a day. I am not saying to drink that much but do be sure not to exceed that amount. You should drink enough water that your urine is clear at all times. Any time I have had gastritis this was the most important thing I have done. To this day when I have a gastritis attack coming on I reach for the water first. I will drink a half of liter every hour for the entire day. Yes, I make many trips to the bathroom, lol. This is also great for HISTAMINE! Drinking large amounts of water flushes out your body and removes histamine and other toxins that lead to your body's production of histamine. However, do not drink water 1 hour before or after eating large meals. It will slow down the digestion time in your stomach and cause more irritation. Water should not be ice cold. Room temperature is best and don't chug.

 

Tums. This works great for relieving pain by instantly reducing the acid in your stomach. However, it is technically a calcium supplement so be cautious if that bothers you in any way.

 

Gavison. This stuff works the best. It is the best over the counter medication for gastritis. I buy the mint flavor. However, I can not currently use it because it has large amounts of magnesium in it as the active ingredient. Having withdrawn from benzos magnesium destroys my world so no go for me. You have not withdrawn from benzos or any gaba related drugs that I recall so this may be okay for you.

 

Carafate. This is a prescription drug in the United States. I have used the pills and liquid. Pills are a waste and the liquid is expensive as hell and damn near the best stuff on the market for healing ulcers or gastritis. It basically forms a metallic coating over your entire stomach lining and serves as a temporary stomach lining while your actual lining is protected so that it can rebuild. This stuff works great but it had some weird side effects like light headedness and I don't know what mechanism causes this so that would require some homework. Also, it coats everything so well that it blocks absorption of just about everything including your Remeron dose. So you would have to follow the instructions closely on how to leave a large enough window of time between your Remeron dose and taking this stuff so that it breaks down and allows absorption. It wears off of your stomach often and is dosed every four hours or so. So you would still be able to take Mirt it would just have to be well coordinated.

 

PPI,s work great but are damn near impossible to discontinue and they do actually have some psychological side effects that many are unaware of.

 

Zantac/Pepcid AC are H2 antihistamines which reduce stomach acid. Not sure if they would interact with Mirt. Mirt is an H1 antihistamine and I do not know if there is any crossover here. Zantac continues to have recalls due to containing high levels of some sort of carcinogen so maybe go with Pepcid if you decide to try one.

 

Remember, this is an uphill battle because histamine is what tells your stomach how much acid to produce. This is why H2 antihistamines like Pepcid AC work in reducing stomach acid. You are tapering off of a drug which increases histamine levels and you have gastritis and your stomach is likely overproducing acid.

 

My go to when things are really bad as simple as they are is WATER and BREAD. That's the best non medication things I have. Soak up the grease and acid and dilute the acid and at the same time flush out the stomach.

 

 

 

 

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Thank you very much Jack.

 

I think i ll try to solve it with natural ones.I absolutely agree water and bread idea.Then, i am trying now bitter melon-a kind of cucumber(it is said that it works wonder-and i prefer it to drugs) and small amounts of ginger. Ginger is wonderful about stopping the nauseous reactions.I ll be cautious about curing it naturally as much as i can.I loved the principle that the acid makes vagus nerve disturbed and it explains why we all react with anxiety.I read a doc in Iran who cured their patients with only water.Thats amazing.Thanks for great support.Like you had lived in early times of this year,i feel myself poor but thankfully THIS TOO SHALL PASS!

 

Thanks a lot brother.

 

June

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