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Remeron (Mirtazapine) Withdrawal Support Group


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I don't have experience with SRRIs, but my symptoms when I firsr quit the mirt were insomnia (really bad), morning nausea, dizziness, crying spells, diarrhea. However, I must say in that my latest (and almost successful) attempt to withdraw from the mirt I *only* experienced insomnia (very disturbing). Why are you taking it? Is it working for you? You might need to balance the pros and cons. Some people swear by the mirt, but it didn't do much for me.
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I had a bad experience with Remeron too.  It also needs to be tapered and you need to weigh the benefits of staying on it during your Benzo w/ds or getting out early and, hopefully, symptom-free.  As Tiger Lily says many seem to have benefitted and had an easy time quitting, others have not.

 

Tiger Lily are you sleeping now?

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I am taking it since it makes me sleepy in about 15 minutes after taking it.  It does work for sleep.

 

I did a lot of drinking in my 20's and became a heavy weight drinker. quit at 40 years old. Started Atvian at .5mg and it did ZERO. Dr. said  "TAKE MORE' ,,  ???  long story short it took 4 mg Ativan to put me to sleep for 8 hours and that was only the first month of use.  I do not know why I need so much, it's like I was immune to the stuff.  My body is weird that way maybe from all the drinking in my younger life.  Got up to 9mg very fast.  I did NOT get a break from the addiction however.  I am afraid that remeron my treat me the same way. Little effect and lots of addiction.  Maybe I better just quit messing with the pills I am thinking now. I think I will save the remeron for 2 or 3 nights per week only.

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Hey Birdman,

 

Try not to freak, friend. First of all, please note that I have taken Remeron on and off for a period of years. So I'm sorta a long term user, even though this time, I have only been on for about 10 months. Second, while antidepressants do have an associated withdrawal syndrome, it is said to be less severe than benzo withdrawal. I think that is worth noting. Not to say it will be a cakewalk, but... Third, I kind of like your thinking. I've known others to take the Remeron a few nights a week - say every other night. Might be a better move if you area fearing withdrawal. Go with your gut.

 

Thanks for the dialogue all. I will definitely keep everyone in the loop. Glad you are stabilizing Angel. T. Lily, sorry about the weight gain - but i've got you beat times two. :) Keep exercising, try to keep good food on hand for the cravings, and steady as you go.

 

Blessings and healing, peeps...

 

-Dave

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I had a bad experience with Remeron too.  It also needs to be tapered and you need to weigh the benefits of staying on it during your Benzo w/ds or getting out early and, hopefully, symptom-free.  As Tiger Lily says many seem to have benefitted and had an easy time quitting, others have not.

 

Tiger Lily are you sleeping now?

 

Angel, I'm sleeping A LOT right now. I wake up many times, but I'm getting 8-9 hours, and lots of dreaming. I'm happy to hear that you have stabilized!

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I am taking it since it makes me sleepy in about 15 minutes after taking it.  It does work for sleep.

 

I did a lot of drinking in my 20's and became a heavy weight drinker. quit at 40 years old. Started Atvian at .5mg and it did ZERO. Dr. said  "TAKE MORE' ,,  ???  long story short it took 4 mg Ativan to put me to sleep for 8 hours and that was only the first month of use.  I do not know why I need so much, it's like I was immune to the stuff.  My body is weird that way maybe from all the drinking in my younger life.  Got up to 9mg very fast.  I did NOT get a break from the addiction however.  I am afraid that remeron my treat me the same way. Little effect and lots of addiction.  Maybe I better just quit messing with the pills I am thinking now. I think I will save the remeron for 2 or 3 nights per week only.

 

Benzos and alcohol are cross-tolerant, so that might explain why your benzo tolerance is  high. Taking remeron every now and then seems a reasonable idea. I know that some people do that.

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Hi Buds,

 

Still not stabilized on this most recent mirt drop of mine. Current symptoms are dizziness, nausea, higher than usual anxiety and depression mixed, headache, burning arms, and weakness. Those are sort of the big ones. Not to the magnitude of benzo withdrawal, but not fun. Once I stabilize, I will be making radically smaller cuts in the future - no reason why not w/ the liquid form. Still not 100% certain if I am feeling the Remeron cut, or underlying benzo withdrawal healing still in progress. I don't think there is a way to know.

Ashton notes the symptoms of antidepressant withdrawal and her sort of rules-of-the-road for doing it. It validates the experience. I will keep you all posted... Thanks  :)

ANTIDEPRESSANT WITHDRAWAL SYMPTOMS

 

PHYSICAL SYMPTOMS

      Gastrointestinal: abdominal pain, diarrhoea, nausea, vomiting

      Influenza-like: fatigue, headache, muscle pain, weakness, sweating, chills, palpitations

      Sleep disturbance: insomnia, vivid dreams, nightmares

      Sensory disturbances: dizziness, light-headedness, vertigo,

      pins and needles, electric shock sensations

      Motor disorders: tremor, loss of balance, muscle stiffness, abnormal movements

 

PSYCHOLOGICAL SYMPTOMS

      Anxiety, agitation

      Crying spells

      Irritability

      Overactivity

      Aggression

      Depersonalisation

      Memory Problems

      Confusion

      Lowered mood

 

Guidelines for benzodiazepine users who are also taking an antidepressant and wish to withdraw from both drugs

 

Complete the benzodiazepine withdrawal before starting to taper the antidepressant.

 

Allow at least 4 weeks after stopping benzodiazepines before starting on antidepressant withdrawal.

 

Consult your doctor before starting to withdraw the antidepressant and agree on a tapering schedule.

 

Antidepressant withdrawal must be gradual to avoid withdrawal effects.

 

    Make each dose reduction as small as possible, e.g. by halving the tablets or using a liquid preparation.

 

    If smaller doses are not available, reduce by taking a tablet every other day, then every third day, etc.

 

    Allow 1-2 weeks between each dosage reduction.

 

    If withdrawal symptoms are severe (Chapter 3, Table 2) increase the dosage slightly (e.g. to the dose at your last reduction). When symptoms have settled, resume withdrawal at a slower rate.

 

With slow tapering, as outlined above, withdrawal symptoms from antidepressants are usually absent, or if they occur, are mild and short-lived.

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Hi Dave

 

This could be a reaction to both. Your CNS is still highly-sensitised to your Benzo withdrawals although I suspect Remeron is the main culprit here. It is a very nasty toxic drug. My own opinion is you may have suffered the same if you had done a 10% cut.  These will pass but, if I were you, wait till you are really stabilised before attempting to drop again.  They do say 6 weeks between drops don't they.

 

I am nowhere near ready to join you yet.  Am still in acute w/d from my C/T and trying to stabilise on 7.5 mg. 

 

I will drop by to see how you are getting along and hope you feel better soon.

 

Angel

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Hi Dave and Angel, we're together in the struggle. I dropped 0.35 mg seven days ago and then another 0.35 mg two days ago. Physically I'm doing OK so far, but I do feel weird sometimes, like dizzy, or overwhelmed by the world, like processing things at a much faster pace, I don't know how to explain it. I decided to go a bit faster as my weight is really bothering me.

I hope you stabilize soon. I'm amazed at how potent this drug is. After reinstating 1.5 mg, I was back to sleeping 9 + hours and feeling groggy. It's a nice effect, but by now I know damn well that you pay a high price for anything that comes from a pill, so I started tapering again as soon as I felt strong and rested.

Hang on in there!

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Angel, T. Lily - so much gratitude having you along for this journey. Truly. Thank you for being there. I assure you I will reciprocate.  :)

 

Angel, my suspicion is the same as yours - that is that the culprit is the Remeron and also, that pretty much any sized cut would be causing horrid feelings. I am totally on the same page w/ your advice in letting true stabilization occur and then dropping even slower, and more gradual, when the time comes. I get impatient. But this can't be a race for me. I get that. I hope you level out on the 7.5 soon. Any improvement at all?

 

T. Lily, glad you are continuing to be able to cut. I know the weight issue bothers you. But I am fairly confident, given your stated diet and lifestyle, that you will be able to drop those pounds once you depart from the Remeron for keeps. Really happy that you are making progress.

 

Again, my sincere thanks, buds...

 

-Dave

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Hi Dave

 

I think it is a good idea to wait this out and I hope you feel better soon.

 

Things are still pretty bad this end at 4 weeks on.  I think I have given my CNS a huge shock.  I have had a couple of days of partial windows but am now dealing with palpitations. GI issues, pins and needles but my worst symptom is burning feeling inside my chest.  I am still not able to eat much and have lost loads of weight. I think I am in for the long haul here.

 

 

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Hi Angel -

 

Sounds terrible.  :( Good tho that the partial windows are appearing however. I'm not getting that burning feeling in my chest, it is going to my arms and legs. And morning sweats... Whoa...

 

I'm along for the long haul. Feel free to vent whenever. Sorry you are dealing with all of this too... So thankful for your presence though.

 

-Dave

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Hi Dave

 

Since I wrote my thread, I have been consulting on another excellent Antidepressants site.  I don't think I am allowed to type the link but it is Surviving Antidepressants.  The moderator and founder of the site Alto is extremely knowledgeable and has been following my Remeron crisis.

 

I have been having extremely high blood pressure from my doctor probably reinstating me at the wrong dose after my C/T.  The site advised me to reinstate low but I was under pressure from my husband and my doctor to reinstate at 7.5mg.

 

I had to call paramedics over to our house last night as I thought I was having a heart attack.  Needless to say, they told me it was just withdrawals. 

 

I am now following Alto's advice - she told me that the dosage is having an adverse effect on me (which would explain my chest burning and pins and needles) and to lower the dose to 6.5 mg straight away.  She said it will take about 4 days to get into my bloodstream and if I am having an adverse effect, it is the only thing to do.  This is not going to get any better and I don't want to risk a heart attack.

 

I am seeing my doctor tomorrow and I don't think he is going to be very happy but I trust Alto implicitly (I have no faith in doctors any more) and will deal with it.  I am hoping he doesn't put me on any BP medicine but it may have come to this.

 

I will keep you updated.

 

Angel

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Thank you for the update, Angel.

 

PLEASE keep me in the loop. I have had the BP issues as well, but have had success in keeping them reasonable w/ magnesium and hawthorne. My naturopath knows it is the withdrawal doing it, so won't even consider treating me for a true blood pressure issue until the drug is removed from my system.

 

Thinking of you and your family.

 

Check back when you can.

 

-Dave

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Hi Dave

 

That was excellent advice of your doctor.  It's terrible what this drug can do.

 

Will keep you updated.  I will take the 6.5mg for 4 days then Alto wants me to report back.

 

Angel

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Hi Angel, I'm sorry to hear you're so sick. It's awful. I hope the person at the other forum is right and that you get better by dropping a mg. Please report.

T. Lily

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Hi Lily. I really am ill on this dosage and Alto Strata is an expert on antidepressants and hèkped hundreds of people. She has links with the medical community who turn to her for advice so I really do trust her. She was quite right about my reinstating on such a high dose when 3.75 mg would hav sufficed.

 

It's not like taking advice of a member of some forum.

 

I know this dose is too high. My blood pressure is right now 190/104 so really high for me. I never had a problem before with BP.

 

I will take the reduced dose tonight but consult with my doctor tomorrow. I don't have much faith in doctors really. They are the ones who got me onto this mess.  He was the one who doubled my dose because of anxiety when it was this drug causing the anxiety in the first place.

 

Will keep you in the loop and thanks for your wishes

 

Angel

 

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Hi Angel,

 

Been wondering how you fared w/ your first night at 6.5 mg. Hopefully all is either no worse or improved.

 

I feel like I maybe be stabilizing on the 7. It's been 15 days I think, so that falls into line with what I have experienced in other cuts. One thing is for sure, the cuts are getting more difficult to tolerate symptomatically the lower I get.

 

Anyway, if you have a sec, let me know how things are going for you. Did you see/consult your doc today? I did check out the surviving antidepressants site. Thank you for leading me there. Alto is well-respected, so I suspect her advice is sound. Like you, I trust doctors hardly at all anymore. In fact, having a N.D. (naturopathic doctor) now, I'm kind of a western medicine drop-out.  :) He's a true-blue doc - that is, he can write a script for Remeron, but wouldn't if it wasn't for withdrawal purposes.

 

-Dave

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Yes, Angel, I'm also wondering how you feel after dropping 1 mg.

 

I'm glad that you're stabilizing, Dave. Does it take you 2 weeks to stabilize? Mirtazapine-wise, it takes me about 3 weeks. But I'm not really in pain. I do have a bit of anxiety, I'm more prone to distraction and I'm having nightmares nearly every night. Sometimes I remember my dreams, sometimes I don't, but I'm waking up in terror most nights. Weird. My partner traveled for a week, so I'm stupidly scared of sleeping alone.  :-[  I'm also feeling anxious around people. My psych said that Remeron is used to treat social anxiety, therefore it's not uncommon that now that I'm withdrawing from it I feel like fleeing when I'm in social gatherings.

 

Anyway, I was just checking how everybody is doing with their w/d. Good luck to everyone.

 

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Actually, Dave, I'm curious about your naturopath. How can he prescribe? Is it because of the state where you live? Here in New York naturopaths are not recognized, so then can't prescribe medicine or even order blood tests. That's why I found my naturopathic doctor very useless, she didn't tell me anything that I didn't know already, she couldn't even help me find a compounding pharmacy, and my health insurance wouldn't cover my visits to her office. As much as I distrust conventional medicine, at least my psych was able to track a compounding pharmacy and order thyroid and blood sugar tests for me. A pity, really, because I was looking forward to going the naturopathic way.
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Hi T. Lil,

 

Yes, it's looking like 2 to 2.5 weeks is stabilization for me at this point - pretty crazy up to that point, but then it evens out - like now. I'm going to start giving at least 3 weeks (maybe even 4) to thoroughly stabilize so that I am on sure footing w/ each cut. Interesting what you noted about the social gatherings. I too have had a bit of social anxiety - and that is TOTALLY not me. Actually, I'm experiencing pretty much everything you noted. With a little depression thrown in too. And some dizziness heavy-headedness. No night terrors though. So sorry! I hope your dreams are tranquil this eve. We will be much better off when we leave the mirt behind us.

 

Yes, in Vermont, naturopaths are recognized and can not only prescribe and order blood work, but insurance recognizes them equally as physicians - so that is to say, he is covered w/ a typical co-pay. I feel wicked lucky - wicked lucky. Your psych sounds forward-thinking, and that is key. Good idea on the thyroid and sugar tests - I had the same done. Both checked out fine. It's the mirt. I bet you will find the same.

 

So, we wait to hear from Angel. I believe her profile says she is in Europe, so hopefully sleeping peacefully on 6.5 mgs tonight.

 

Thanks for checking in - let's keep walking forward.  :)

 

-Dave

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Hi guys

 

Thanks soooooooo much for checking up on me.

 

I took my first 6.5mg dose 2 nights ago.  When I took it, I did not sleep the whole night but, amazingly, the next day (yesterday, although I was absolutely exhausted) I had a much better day.  I felt the best I have felt in the past month since I reinstated on the 7.5mg.  I did have a few waves but they passed - the waves are mainly stomach cramps and I did have very minor burning a couple of times but could distract.  I did not have palpitations that I am aware of.  I felt a bit crappy in the afternoon at some point so thought I had better take a beta blocker in case my blood pressure was high - which it might have been as that is one of the side effects of this drug - but I was fine.  I am pretty sure the 7.5mg was too activating for me and I don't think I would have stabilised on it as it was having adverse effects.

 

I slept very well last night on the 6.5mg - am still having some stomach cramps but overall much better.

 

It is early days but am hoping that I will stablise and the best thing is that I have inadvertently dropped a whole dose now!

 

Yes, I did see the doctor Dave.  He could not believe I was having such problems withdrawing from Mirt and looked at me like I was mad when I told him I was taking 6.5mg as he said you can't cut the tablet so precisely and what is wrong with 7.5mg?!  He told me to stay at this dose for another week and then halve it and halve again.  He said my reaction probably proves I have an anxious personality and I need to stay on an antianxiety for life and if I don't want pharmaceutical then should go for herbal.  I just said, yeah yeah!  I know I DO NOT have an anxiety disorder and it is the drugs.

 

He is however supporting my liquid taper (although he thinks it is not necessary) and has prescribed me the soltabs which I can mix in water as he says the liquid is too expensive.  That is fine, I don't mind.  It's quite easy to prepare the liquid.

 

He has given me another prescription for beta blockers for the blood pressure but I am not going to take them regularly to be honest.  I don't like the way they make me feel and I am pretty sure that once I am off this poison my blood pressure will go back to normal.

 

I was going to leave it a few more days before I wrote any progress as these things can change but it has got off to a good start so far and will continue to update.

 

I'm sorry I have just skipped through this thread and may have missed something.  Will go back to it later.  Sorry you are both having your minor troubles but am glad to hear you may be stabilising Dave.

 

Am really touched by your concern.

 

Angel xx

 

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Angel,

 

Very glad to hear from you - and it sounds like things are ok.  :)

 

I hope you have continued success @ 6.5 mg! Your doctor sounds a little narrow-minded, but glad he seems to be going w/ your general plan nonetheless. It's your body - it's your mind. You're reclaiming it.

 

Also, I totally understand why you would wait to write a progress report here. Things are so subject to change. First hand example, yesterday I was feeling better - this morning, not so much.  :( Mornings tend to be the most difficult time of day for me anyway, but the nausea and other gastro stuff is really terrible today and the anxiety is feeling pretty up there too. Hoping for true stabilization soon.

 

OK, I have some things to do here. T. Lil will be happy to see your post too.

 

Let's keep talking.  :)

 

-Dave

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Hi Dave

 

Yes I will probably only update again in a while as symptoms may change and it has only been 2 days on the new dose.  However, I finally, after 5 weeks (including the C/T week) had an appetite today - nothing major, but just the fact I felt hungry.  Up to now I have been forcing myself to eat and I have dropped at least 10 or 12 lbs.  That, to me, is an indication that the 6.5mg may work.

 

I just met a man in the pharmacist who told me he had taken 3 years to get off a single Ativan pill by dry-cutting!  I don't know how he did it but it made me feel better about the taper period.  The pharmacist definitely agrees that slow cuts are the way to go.

 

From what I have read, the waves and windows of symptoms are pretty normal, much like benzos but not as bad, I don't think.  During benzo w/ds I was truly incapacitated and never thought they would end, but they did.  I am sure they will improve all round soon.  So stay strong and update when you can.

 

 

Best wishes

Angel

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Thanks Angel, I will continue to update - and you too please!  :)

 

I have a question you may or may not be able to give advice on. But it seems you have perused the Surviving AD board a little deeper than I. Is there anyway to know whether you should updose a tick? I mean, my sxs are nasty, uncomfortable, etc - but at what point do you say, ok, maybe I cut too big, I should up-dose a little. I wake up in the mornings (and mornings tend to be bad) wondering ok, should I up or hold - up or hold? Jeez. Any ideas?

 

I have, over the last few days - resigned myself to a long, gradual process. mucho tiempo, lento, y exitoso.

 

Check in when you can, T. Lil.

 

-Dave

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