Author Topic: Remeron (Mirtazapine) Withdrawal Support Group  (Read 185693 times)

[Buddie]

Re: Remeron (Mirtazapine) Withdrawal Support Group
« Reply #50 on: May 08, 2013, 01:20:56 pm »
Hi [...]

I'm not sure what to tell you.  It might be worthwhile of starting a thread at the A/D site.

However, from what I have gleaned, any changes in medication up or down can tend to destabilise.  I think the cut you made was really quite small and even if you do updose, it may not decrease your symptoms.  They also say that it can take up to 6 weeks to stabilise between cuts, even longer.  If I were in your position, I probably would not go up and would wait to stabilise but if your symptoms are unbearable, it might be a good idea to do so. 

Maybe [...] or someone else may chime in here.

I [...] your symptoms settle soon.

[...]

Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: Remeron (Mirtazapine) Withdrawal Support Group
« Reply #51 on: May 08, 2013, 01:30:49 pm »
Thanks, [...].  :)

Your advice was my intuition - that was my gut (achy as it is) instinct. Sxs not unbearable, but unpleasant. Maybe I'm been a little fragile.  :-[ I didn't get to do a proper benzo taper, so tapering is still sort of a new mode of being for me. I am learning. Slowwwwwly...

Your support and insight is invaluable!

xx

-[...]
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: Remeron (Mirtazapine) Withdrawal Support Group
« Reply #52 on: May 08, 2013, 01:44:41 pm »
Yeah I'm getting the achy gut and worse!  I think it is typical of this drug.  I don't have any insight into tapering as I never did a proper taper with the benzos either.  It is such a [...] but it's not forever  ;)
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: Remeron (Mirtazapine) Withdrawal Support Group
« Reply #53 on: May 08, 2013, 05:00:03 pm »
Gastro has been quite bad today so I just went to the health shop and got Acidophilus Powder (a probiotic), Calma-C (calcium and magnesium drink with vitamin C) and Glutamine powder.

Also am drinking Actimel probiotic drink from supermarket (definitely helps).

I had none of these gastric symptoms when I was on the higher dose as I was mainly getting suicidal and heart related problems so as bad as the gastric stuff is, as long as I can treat it and not be incapacitated which I'm not now (although I am trying to take it quite easy right now), I am quite happy as I do know it is a normal part of the withdrawal symptoms.

Just thought I would share!

[...]
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: Remeron (Mirtazapine) Withdrawal Support Group
« Reply #54 on: May 08, 2013, 05:09:32 pm »
Hi [...], I'm so glad that you were able to nail the problem. Wow, so it wasn't just withdrawal but also the effects of remeron kicking in! It's very weird, but I also feel that I'm experiencing withdrawal AND activation from the drug at the same time. In any case, congratulations on dropping 1 mg! You might feel better and better as you keep dropping doses. I certainly didn't have any problems with reducing doses apart from minor issues, definitely nothing like benzo w/d. My problem was that I didn't know that you have to hold your last dose for a long while, that's how I ended up reinstating. But I'm sleeping a lot theses days, and I'm very grateful for it. Anyway, I'm glad that you're sharing your experience here because many people might think (as your doctor) that your problem is withdrawal and not adverse reaction to a high dose. It's very unfortunate when you get the skeptical look from the person who put you in your present situation on the first place.

[...], I'm sorry to hear that you haven't fully stabilized yet. It might be a good idea to hold until you feel better. I also read that the rule of thumb is to hold each cut for 6 weeks. I know it's frustrating. Also, have you tried alternating days? Some people can't stand just dropping a dose and prefer to alternate days, it seems it works very good for antidepressants. I will be doing it when I go down to 0.375. I learned from the experience of someone in another website, this is her story:


"In a month I will have come off mirtazapine completely and for some of that time I have been able to work and do my job pretty darn well.

I went on mirtazipine for anxiety and it did not work and I put on 1 stone in weight was drowsy all the time and generally doped out. In some ways it was actually [...] more anxiety and depression as well. Withdrawing from mirtazapine is different for every person and everyone has to go at their own pace. For me, it was extremely slowly when I got down to 7.5mg and lower. The tablets don't allow you to do this so request the mirtazapine solution that you dispense with a 1ml syringe into a little bit of water every night. Going cold turkey is a terrifying experience, the one most awful experience of my life and its also dangerous. I do not agree with people advocating taking valium during the withdrawal process because for anxious or depressed people a drug that powerful leaves you vulnerable to addiction because speaking from personal experience that is exactly what happened to me. Valium in my experience is nowhere near as hard to withdraw from than mirtazipine because it is so short term whereas the mirtazipine is a long drawn out business making it hard to lose perspective on what is a withdrawal symptom and what is your underlying problem. I kept a diary of my symptoms so I could look objectively at what I was experiencing and sort it out, but I still forget sometimes. As I said earlier about some of the time I have been able to work Im talking about the past 6 months where I have been following a plan devised by myself that works if you find the quicker withdrawals like \"half a table for a week then nothing\" or cold turkey dont work. There is a website by the organisation called CITA (google it) and they have a Back To Life handbook that you pay 13 for and it gives you a specific plan for mirtazipine withdrawal, tells you supplements to take such as the powerful detox drink Noni Juice, how to alter your diet to help decrease withdrawal symptoms. I had my vitamins tested and whereas before the process I was fine, afterwards I had a chromium deficiency making me very sensitive to sugar. If you can hack it I have found that a low carb, low sweetner, low sugar diet like the Atkins or the Dukan diet work very well as the mirtazipine plays around with your blood sugar levels and therefore makes you even more unstable. My basic way of withdrawing was this:

Ill use the drop from 0.1ml to 0ml (of syringe solution which with the 7.5mg solution equates to about 0.75mg very very tiny!!) as an example because that is what I am doing right now:

Week 1, take 0.1ml apart from wednesday when you take nothing

Week 2, take 0.1ml apart from monday and wednesday \"\"\"

Week 3, take 0.1ml apart from monday, wednesday and friday \"\"\"

Week 4, take 0.1ml apart from monday, wednesday, friday and sunday

Week 5, take 0.1ml apart from monday, tuesday, wednesday, friday and saturday (only take 1ml on thursday and sunday)

Week 6, take 0.1ml only on thursday.

week 7 , take nothing!

So each week you are cutting out one day of the week's dose which I have found really suits mirtazapine because if you just drop down a dose the withdrawal hits you really hard 2 weeks after and by 3 weeks on the dose I was horrifically depressed. If its too fast you can do the week 1 pattern for 2 weeks etc which I did for a while. I do see what they mean about mirtazapine having a short half life because it does hit you in the face at the 3 weeks marker, it is as if it just leaves the body very quickly between 2 and 3 weeks of dropping a dose. The gradual withdrawal that I ended up doing I think really suits mirtazipine because of this aspect.

The drop downs I did was, 30mg, 15mg, 7.5mg (half a tablet) (with the tablets I simply dropped the dose again when the withdrawal symptoms subsided) this bit was debilitating and I do not advocate it. Use the plan set out in the Back To Life booklet instead. When I tried to go to nothing from 7.5 then I experienced absolute horribleness. So I switched to solution and did 1ml (7.5mg), 0.9ml, 0.8ml, 0.7ml, 0.6ml etc etc down to 0.1ml which Im doing now. I got the solution from my [...] so it is not hard to obtain it in the UK, it costs the same as a regular prescription, i think it is available in America aswell but im not too sure.

Finally i will just outline my withdrawal symptoms: vivid dreams, disrupted sleep/over-sleeping (I did a test using SleepCycle, an app for the iPhone to test whether a small dose of mirtazipine could affect my sleeping and I found with the analysis tool that I had much less deep sleep and was much more easily disturbed to being fully awake during the night than when I didnt take any mirtazipine. I think this is why you oversleep on mirtazipine.) Paranoia, itching skin, body shocks (like tingles that run from the top of your head to your toes), headaches, fatigue, bruxism or teeth grinding (can make my jaw ache), depression, anxiety, nausea, burning mouth syndrome (like a numb tingling in your tongue), floating sensations when going to sleep, cravings for sugar and carbs, confusion, forgetfulness, angry outbursts, irritability, hot/cold flashes, insomnia (the most disturbing for me but on my really slow plan I dont get this problem at all), social withdrawal (probably because my emotions were so erratic i was embarassed for anyone to see me), body aching especially in my back where I hold most of my tension, sensitivity to noise and light, blurred vision.

Some more tips: People often fear it is their illness coming back when they are experiencing withdrawal symptoms, this was not true for me because as I am nearly off mirtazipine now it is the best I have felt since I started taking antidepressants. They are only supposed to be used short term but I ended up on them for 6 years. If you felt no effect with the antidepressants after a few months it is best to come off them. Dont even risk it with drinking alcohol, it makes the withdrawal even worse, your body is going through a lot and it needs as little rubbish to deal with as possible. If you feel a burst of energy as I have done during this process even if it is 9pm go for a jog. Dont just sit around waiting for it to turn into a panic attack. And finally go with the flow and remember its not real and only temporary. \"This too shall pass.\" So just do your best at real life and hibernate through it all. This drug is not easy to come off just as all antidepressants are hard to come off, it has been compared to heroin withdrawal and having researched heroin withdrawal I agree with the comparison. If you drop too suddenly and end up seeing the doctor because you are suicidal and at your wits end you must slow down and dont let them just pump you back up to 30mg, just go back up to the last dose you took before you went[...] and go slower next time. A word of warning: the majority of GPs and doctors do not understand antidepressant withdrawal and from my experience neither do psychiatrists fully, they just prescribe. However you must not blame them for their ignorance even though it is hard not to when you are in hell, you put the drugs in your mouth so YOU have to get yourself rid of them at YOUR pace. It is sadly the ways things are in the UK at the moment.

The best of luck to anyone who is on this road.

I [...] something I said in there helped you.

If it didn't nothing lost!

Kathryn."

 
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: Remeron (Mirtazapine) Withdrawal Support Group
« Reply #55 on: May 08, 2013, 05:42:48 pm »
HI [...]

Thanks for your lovely comments.  It is so helpful to have you here and it is really encouraging to know you didn't have too bad of a time.  You are going to have to keep checking in on [...] and me here even when you are long off the Rem!

I must say something about the thread you posted - I have actually seen that before - but I am not sure whether it is a good idea to alternate days because it could be very destabilising.  I think all in all it may be a quicker way to get off the drug but I am a bit sceptical about missing doses.  I think Parker alternated at the very end didn't she, it is probably okay to do it then.... I personally am not going to alternate because it may upset the apple cart!

Yes .. it's amazing that the Rem had that adverse reaction - this is something that would never have occurred to me had I not consulted the other website. 

Catch you soon

[...] xx

I
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: Remeron (Mirtazapine) Withdrawal Support Group
« Reply #56 on: May 08, 2013, 08:50:24 pm »
T. Lil,

Thank you for all the great information! MUCH appreciated. I've considered alternating, and may do so when I get further down the chain. But right now, I am all about stabilization - and I think I need to follow the recommendation you pointed out - 6 weeks minimum between cuts. Patience patience - what's that "p" word? Oh right, patience.  :)
Also, all THREE of us ([...], T. Lil, and [...]) seem to share this:
Quote
It's very weird, but I also feel that I'm experiencing withdrawal AND activation from the drug at the same time.
Absolutely T. Lil. It is horrible.

[...], I wouldn't mind a day-by-day check in if you are well and motivated to do so. Really curious how this all pans out for you w/ the 1 mg drop. I am cautiously optimistic.  :thumbsup:

I met w/ my naturopath this afternoon. Discussed the symptoms that are really nagging me: nausea and other gastro stuff, heavy headed feeling/dizziness, anxiety - a little depression. He's done the full blood work on me, so we know this is withdrawal. Specifically, serotonin unbalance in both the brain and gut. Just feels good to know he knows. He is also behind a slower taper. Follow the standard really. I get all goal-oriented and impatient. I'm learning, I'm learning....  :P

Great to hear from both of you today. I wish you both evenings of [...], good sleep, and warm feelings.

-[...]
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: Remeron (Mirtazapine) Withdrawal Support Group
« Reply #57 on: May 08, 2013, 09:24:24 pm »
Hi [...]

I will [...] to check in - you are helping me too.  I am supposed to be going away next week for a week and there won't be internet access but although I have the ticket, am not sure if I will go with my husband.  I am not sure I am going to be up to further travel and the hecticness of it all.  On the other hand, I probably should go because I shouldn't let the drug situation stop me from living and if I am going to have withdrawals then does it really matter whether I am here or there?  Am in two minds, will decide last minute.

Today Day 2, w/ds are beginning to kick in - quite bad gastric but they are under control with the supplements I think, or else it was a wave.  Am conscious of the waves - they are not constant and, to be honest, not completely incapacitating - they are hard to describe, like waves of weird whooshiness inside me where I just feel quite bad while I have them.  Plus am extremely tired.  But they pass.  I have had several of those today.  Can you relate?

I actually am quite interested myself to monitor my symptoms and how long they take to settle as that will be an indication of how far I can drop the next dose.  I would actually like to drop 1mg until I get to 4.5mg then go slow from there, and go with the symptoms anyway because if I am going to get symptoms from dropping 5% or 10% then I would prefer to go a little faster now.  I don't know.  I am not ready or brave enough to make that decision yet.  Will see how it goes.

Have a good night.

[...]
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: Remeron (Mirtazapine) Withdrawal Support Group
« Reply #58 on: May 09, 2013, 10:22:00 am »
Hi [...],

I [...] you are able to go away next week - it might be nice if you feel up to it. I'm supposed to travel tomorrow and be away for 5 days too (should still be able to check in here tho, I think). Still have not made up my mind 100% since I feel so up-and-down. Like you, I don't really wanted to be limited by the mirt withdrawal. Sometimes I'm of the mind that it is better to suffer in my familiar surroundings than afar tho. So like you, this will be a last minute decision.

So you're at day 3 now on 6.5 - you have to figure some withdrawals are going to come into play, but it sounds like as of yesterday, they were somewhat in-check. I CAN in fact relate to the waves you describe. For me, a surging whooshiness - and I am, at the same time, anxious and tired - which seems impossible, but it isn't.  :)

This morning, I awoke more calmly. Gut feels moderately better too. I'm hopeful today will be improved. I like your idea on the big cuts to 4.5 and then the slow-roll down from there. Makes sense. Like you, heck, if the suffering is going to come on whether a small cut or a large, might just as well take the big cut to get you closer to the finish line. Still, this is the time we must truly listen to our bodies.

Check in when you have the chance. Sending you positive vibes and very best wishes that things are still going ok for you!

Oh, and I meant to mention that my naturo suggested I could [...] 5-htp. You know, it is an amino acid that helps w/ serotonin. I've decided against it as the Surviving Antidepressants board did not speak highly of it. So for now, I will stick to my fish oil and magnesium and occasional theanine.

Hi T. Lil - what's the scoop?

-[...]
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: Remeron (Mirtazapine) Withdrawal Support Group
« Reply #59 on: May 09, 2013, 11:25:18 am »
Hi [...]

You are right, w/ds have started.

Am feeling pretty rough today - mainly gut related - I can't be too far from a loo either and had to cancel a hair appointment.

Having problems eating when I am like this - I have already dropped so much weight.

Will write more later.

[...] xx
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.