Author Topic: Question about waves?  (Read 488 times)

[Buddie]

Question about waves?
« on: March 08, 2022, 01:26:11 pm »
I am 31 months off Klonopin and currently 46 days into a wave of poor sleep. I stopped using sleep meds 30 days ago.

 - I have read in some posts that a prolonged recurrence of poor sleep during the withdrawal process, known as a wave, is thought to occur when your compromised sleep system is healing.

 - I have also read in some posts that the use of sleep medications may prolong the healing process.

Is there information available on these thoughts I can read?

Thanks.


« Last Edit: March 13, 2022, 10:31:02 pm by [Buddie] »
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

What sleep meds did you stop taking 30 days ago?  Depending on what they were, that could be the cause of your current sleep issues?

Late waves are not uncommon.  I had a month long insomnia wave at 18 months off, another at 32 months off and still another 6 week long insomnia wave at 52 months off.

Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Reading about those waves is a bummer! I am so hoping to be DONE with sleep issues in the next few months. It seems to be taking forever although I know that my sleeping ANY 7-hour nights at 4.5 months off Xanax is very good. Boy that garbage screws your system up! Sheesh! I am sick of being tired during the day. I have a shit ton to do, and I have chronic fatigue. I have tried 3 times now (after getting two or three 8-hour nights) drinking coffee to help my daytime energy level ( I LOVE coffee and how it makes me feel!) but it kept me WIDE awake all night long. I guess accepting these waves is just part of the deal.

[...]
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Here's the caffeine paradox:

When a cell in your body "eats" a piece of glucose something comes out the back end and that's adenosine.  As adenosine works its way through your blood stream, it goes into one particular spot in your brain with particular receptor sites.  As these receptor sites receive or fill up with more and more adenosine, you usually get more and more sleepy.  This is your Sleep Drive.  When adenosine binds to its receptors, neural activity slows down, and you feel sleepy (this would most likely not apply during Benzo-induced insomnia)?

The molecular structure of adenosine and caffeine are only off by one molecule!  So caffeine fits perfectly into that same receptor site in your brain and blocks adenosine from attaching and making you sleepy.  That's why caffeine keeps you awake.  And that's why many get a "caffeine crash" or feel tired and sleepy after the caffeine they consumed leaves the receptor sites and adenosine comes rushing back in. Again this probably wouldn't apply during Benzo-induced insomnia?

The average half-life of caffeine in plasma of healthy individuals is about 5 hours. However, caffeine's elimination half-life may range between 1.5 and 9.5 hours depending on the person (Brachtel and Richter, 1992; Busto et al., 1989). With that said, How long does it take for say 100mg (roughly the amount in a cup of coffee) of caffeine to wear off?  Using the 5 hour half life,  that means if you consume 100 mg of caffeine, after 5 hours, you'll still have 50 mg left in your body and 25mg left another 5 hours after that.  Depending on when you consume caffeine, it could easily keep you up at night especially with a sensitive central nervous system coming off of Benzos?

But not sleeping well (or at all) usually leads to you looking for something to keep you alert, so people reach for more caffeine which can create a vicious cycle?
« Last Edit: March 08, 2022, 07:17:33 pm by [Buddie] »
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Interesting. I used to drink a Starbucks Frappacino every morning and still sleep at night, as long as I didn't drink coffee after say...2pm but, now, I can't drink it at all without it keeping me up all night. It's as if it doesn't leave the receptor sites. Years ago, my doctor said caffeine was fine for people as long as it doesn't prevent them from sleeping. I am sure down the road, we will see studies on caffeine and the long-term effects of it.
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

I've been able to drink caffeine for years now without it affecting my sleep. Most days I drink at least 60mg but some days it's around 200mg of Caffeine, but all before 1:00 pm.

Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Hi [...] and [...] :)

Your messages here always cheer me up. They are helpful and I especially recognize myself in [...]. I stopped a little later, but the development of sleep is particularly interesting for me.

Unfortunately, I also give up coffee completely. While taking Ambien I was able to drink several cups a day (also in the afternoon).
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.