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Titration Plan Suggestions Welcome


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Hi Everyone,

 

I have been directed here by the fragrant Pamster, who has been showing herself to be a wonder. I am in a mess and need to find a way out. Fortunately, I have read much more of this site now, and my expectations are more managed - I now know this will be months/years, not weeks/months.

 

In brief, my benzo history is pretty long, and despite having been bitten in la derriere previously several times, I fell the self-medicating hole again about a year ago ordering online to deal with Covid lockdown stress - what? A dumb idea.

 

I have been up and down on my dose. I reached a stupid peak last May/June, then got under control and reduced to a 2.5mg daily dose for several months while waiting for help from my doctor. I did not get that help and then reordered online in the Autumn, increased my dosage again, then got back down to 2,5mg again until I finally got a (savage & totally unworkable) 3-week taper from a GP which led me to fail again and then go for comfort doses until I was back on 10mgs daily and so on.

 

This is where I am now: I have been up and down and all over the place, but I believe I can probably most realistically stabilise on 10mg per day in the immediate term.

 

I have a total of 70 10mg pills (I have had them analysed, and they are Diazepam)

 

In addition, I have 140 2mg pills which are also confirmed as not being any form of derivative and had the batch numbers confirmed.

 

I can still order more of the 10mg pills, but the 2mg site got closed down. The 10mg pills are ovoid and difficult to cut reliably. The 2mg pills are flat biscuits and are much more manageable when it comes to pizza slicing.

 

My first question is do I have enough pills? I wonder if it might be an idea to get more of the 10mg pills as security before that set gets closed, too. It seems to be a well run, Serbian organised crime operation and somehow has managed to stay open but could potentially go at any moment. I can perhaps buy 60-120 more pills now and leave them with a trusted family member as a safety net - or perhaps I have enough already. I will not be able to get any help at all from my GP's surgery.

 

Based on previous experience a decade ago, I got through this in a few months last time. It was uncomfortable but nowhere near as dramatic as this outing. I am now 55, and the age combined with the kindling effect seems to have played a substantial part in making me much more susceptible to the dreaded sides. More fool me!

 

Anyhow, I hope anyone reading this with experience might try and offer some advice so that I can get everything properly planned and hopefully make this my final, positive drive to success.

 

 

Looking forward to reading any responses,

 

Thanks

 

Bancha

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I can help you compute if you have enough pills.

 

Please answer these questions:

 

What is your current dose per day in mg.

How fast do you want to taper?

 

Also, are you willing to buy a scale?  You can then crush the hard to cut pills and weigh out your dose using the crushed bits.

 

I recommend this scale [nobbc]https://www.amazon.com/Smart-Weigh-Precision-Milligram-Calibration/dp/B011J88S8M/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1541012152&sr=8-1&keywords=Smart+Weigh+Premium+High+Precision+Digital+Milligram+Scale+with+Case%2C+Tweezers%2C+Calibration+Weights+and+Three+Weighing+Pans%2C+50+x+0.001g[/nobbc]

 

Also, you can put your crushed bits into empty gel capsules like these:

[nobbc]https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B00PYV3L6K/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s00?ie=UTF8&th=1[/nobbc]

 

Edit: Deactivated commercial link.

 

 

 

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Many thanks, Bob.

 

Currently, I have 65 x 10 mg tabs and 140 x 2mg tabs.

 

I have just ordered 120 more x10mg tabs which I should get before the weekend.

 

Having tried to w/d too fast, I want to slow things down as I have just relapsed from my small dose and will try and do a week to two weeks (whatever it takes) to normalise at 10mg a day to get somewhere comfortable. I am most concerned about the severity of dark thoughts that can appear from cutting too fast. I am guessing the slower, the better but at the same time want this over asap.

 

Thanks fr the recommendation on the scales. I will order some.

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If you want my advice, I recommend a taper like this:

 

Reduce 0.25mg and then wait at least 10 days or until symptoms are tolerable again (whichever ever is longer).

 

Repeat until you reach zero benzos.

 

It will be hard to measure a reduction of 0.25mg.

 

Before buying the scale, have you considered a liquid taper?  The scale is only needed for a dry taper.  I like people to first try the liquid method and only if that fails or is inconvenient, do we switch to dry taper.

 

So question 1, do you want to do a liquid taper or a dry cut taper?

 

 

 

 

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I would love t try a liquid taper but am not sure how to d it reliably. I would appreciate your advice on this. I am sure the techniques are all over this board, but I have not found anything to get my head around yet.

 

I am assuming I pulverise the pills and dissolve them in some form of accurately measures solvent and take doses through a pipette.

 

I don't know if Valium is water-soluble, how much "tincture" to make in a batch and so on.

 

 

I am also unsure if I should be taking my meds in one dose in 24 hours or doing a morning and evening dose. Today is a good example. I felt good this morning as I had slept well and obviously had a raised benzo level in my system. I was not sure if I should take a morning dose or not. I decided to wait until the evening and take a single 10mg dose, but a few little stressors and my head led me to my 5mg dose. I had hoped this might alleviate my anxiety, and all I got was an overwhelming sense of tiredness and went to meditate, which resulted in me sleeping for several hours.

 

I am now in the relapse zone, and my self-discipline is low, so I just drank a coffee (I know) and then took another 10mg.

 

I can feel myself losing control again and need to get a grip and limit my daily intake to 10mg in whatever form.

 

I can cut these pills into quarters without problems and have previously, on several occasions, got to a daily 2.5 mg once daily dose which I have managed for a week to 6 weeks depending on the detox.

 

Previously my issue was getting down from the 2.5mg quarter.

 

I finally managed to secure a supply of 2mg tablets and thought that I would work my way back down and take small cuts from there. I am now failing as my last reduction was too fast, and the w/d's became intolerable.

 

I will look to see if I can find the guide to titration on here - I seem to remember a variety of suggested methods. I would certainly be grateful to receive your recommended protocol.

 

Thanks again

 

 

Bancha

 

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If you are willing to cut fast, each reduction is 1/8 of a pill, then we can try dry taper.

 

It is simple, you reduce 1/8 of a pill, hold for at least 10 days or until you feel stable (whichever is longer) and then repeat until you are at zero benzo.

 

However, if you need to reduce slower, then it gets complex and you might want to try a liquid taper.  In that case my first question is, are you ok to drink a tiny bit of alcohol to help dissolve the benzo?  It is very small amount, like 1/2 teaspoon.

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Hi Bob,

 

I have no problems with using alcohol in a therapeutic context - I don't drink but am used to tincture.

 

I am confused by the advice to cut by 1/8th in relation to your earlier suggestion to cut by 0.25 - am I missing something?

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You are not missing something.  I did give you two very different options.  A slow and a fast taper.

 

I recommended 0.25mg reductions because that matching my experience.  This is a slow taper.

 

However, you indicated you got from 10mg all the way down to 2.5 mg.  You then reinstated back to 10mg.  But the fact that you managed down to 2.5 mg made me think you might be ok for a fast taper.

 

If you could handle a faster taper, then your life would be easier by cutting using 1/8 pill splits. 

 

How fast did you get from 10mg to 2.5mg?  Also, describe what happened at each reduction in terms of symptoms.

 

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Bob, I need to give you some background on Bancha, his rapid taper gave him very scary dark thoughts, this can't happen again so in my opinion, a slow taper would be the best route to take.
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Bob, I need to give you some background on Bancha, his rapid taper gave him very scary dark thoughts, this can't happen again so in my opinion, a slow taper would be the best route to take.

Oh, that is very good information.

 

His pills are of large dose such that an initial fast taper would have been helpful in terms of effort to make his daily doses.

 

But if fast is off the table, I will guide him to a slow taper. 

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Hi Bob and Pamster,

 

I have found that over 1 year during which I have attempted a total of four tapers that each one seems to get harder. The first was really fast and from a much higher dose but I ran aground at 2.5mg as I could not get the cuts to go down because of my lack of knowledge. I was stuck on 2.5 mg for a month or so and ordered more supplies and when they arrived I relapsed.

 

The second taper was a similar story and the third too but I noticed it was getting harder. When I was getting towards the lower end I was getting tremors, blood pressure, nightmares, no sleep etc

 

 

My last taper was from a stable point at 10mg and I did go too fast and it bit me hard; I was not so much physically affected but mentally. I was most concerned by very menacing invasive thinking. I have now tried to re-stabilise on 10mg which I suspect will take a week or so.

 

I guess the best possible schedule would be from 10mg going down as quickly as I can cope with but as slowly as I need to as I don't want to rush back into feeling like my blood was on fire and my head was about to explode!

 

I think the reduction down to 5mg per day should be relatively easy, stopping off at 7.5mg for a fortnight and then jumping down to 5mg. I am thinking (I may be wrong and your advice and counsel is appreciated) this is where things start to get tougher and the real war begins.

 

I am comforted knowing that I have 120 more 10mg pills on the way (they should be with me by tomorrow) so I will have a reasonable stash of nearly 200 10mg tablets. I then have the 140 2mg tabs to move back onto. These are obviously much easier to cut reliably. I have ordered a scale as advised. I will be upgrading my pill cutter to a better model and be getting a crusher too.

 

Just some advice for today and this week if possible.

 

I got myself into a real lather at the weekend and was in a bit of anguish. I was on a twice-daily dose of 2mg morning and night. I had obviously gotten there too fast and so to deal with the intrusive and worrying thinking I took a chet dose to raise my levels.

 

When I woke yesterday (Tuesday) I felt pretty good having slept well with the assistance of some Nytol.

 

I figured that I might begin to get onto a daily 10mg platform and despite feeling ok took a 5mg half pill in the late morning, planning to take a 5mg pill before bed. What happened was that I felt incredibly tired about an hour after taking the morning 5mg and went off to meditate but found myself going back into sleep. I slept a lot in the day and when I woke was feeling lousy so I took another half and (I know how stupid this is) took another 10mg pill a few hours later.

 

Last night I slept well again and this morning I have begun the day with a 2.5mg quarter. I was thinking that I might take 4x2.5 m g throughout the day to try and avoid the feeling of mental tiredness that took over yesterday.

 

I am not sure if it would just be better t take one 10mg dose per day, at bedtime and then maintain a regime where I just dose once a day about an hour or 90 mins before bed. Or do I take a morning and evening dose or space out the doses into four throughout the day.

 

It is perhaps the Nytol that is making me feel so tired - I am feeling it now, and that's just a result of paying a few bills, dealing with correspondence and writing this far. I already want to go and meditate again right now.

 

Your advice on the timing and frequency of daily doses would be appreciated.

 

As a Benzo user in the past, I have relied on massive coffee intake to compensate for feeling sleepy. I am trying to restrict and hopefully eliminate my caffeine addiction as it is obviously not helpful to be stressing my CNS in the way I have become accustomed to.

 

Yesterday I called a number of detox facilities and it is clear that as an uninsured person I cannot really afford anything more than 2 weeks max at a facility. I am guessing I can deal with decisions in relation to the feasibility of using such a place as a safe environment for the moment the real tsunami hits in a couple of months.

 

That's it. I am going back to bed to listen to a meditation download. I am shredded already.

 

God, I feel like such an idiot for getting myself into this mess. So glad that you guys are here. Thank you

 

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I don't have taper experience so I'll need to leave you in Bob's hands but I do have addiction experience and I see red flags in your behavior.  Please understand, I'm not labeling you an addict but taking larger than needed doses in order to manage whatever you're feeling in the moment is not helpful.  Attempting to 'fix' whatever you're feeling by under or over medicating is contrary to what we like to see here.  Its important you get on a steady dose and stabilize, you can't expect to begin a successful taper until this happens so I hope you'll do this. 

 

I also feel that keeping a detox facility in your back pocket as a possibility is unrealistic.  These places rip patients off the drug too quickly and most will reinstate and do a slow taper.  These facilities simply cannot afford to house you for the months and possibly years it takes to complete withdrawal and recovery from benzo's, they promise help and healing but we know for a fact that healing takes longer than 21 or 28 days or whatever they promise to make money off of you or the insurance companies. 

 

This is your life, you can and should do it your way because only you know what you can take.  You're lucky in a way because don't have a Dr calling the shots, you have a good supply and you have us to help guide you.

 

You can do this, I can sense your strong desire to be free of this burden.

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Let us first get you stable.

 

It sounds like you believe 10mg is the right dose but you wonder if you should take it once a day or twice a day.

 

It depends on why you got on the benzo in the first place.

 

If your main problem is anxiety induced insomnia, then take all 10mg at bed (and slowly stop the Nytol).  After a few days, you will learn the benzo will help you sleep.  If you get a good night of sleep, you will have the strength to tolerate daytime symptoms (pain, heart rate, etc).

 

But if your main problem was panic attacks during the day, then you should take part or all in the morning. 

 

So what do you think is best for you?

 

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Dear Bob & Pamster, (who shall henceforth be known as Batman & Robin, or perhaps Robin Hood & Maid Marion)

 

To begin, Pamster, do not worry about calling me an addict. I am the adult child of alcoholics and qualify fully by both nature and nurture, so feel free. My treatment of this affliction is contingent on working a daily programme, which I try to do to the best of my ability. Unfortunately, I am not a saint.

 

As a quick intro to my Benzo use, I ought to explain that at age 15, on a trans-Atlantic flight where my father got so drunk he wet his seat, my mother put one of his 2mg Ativan in my mouth to help me sleep.

 

It was love at first bite, and as my dad, who was really close friends with our local GP, had been prescribed this "non-addictive" miracle drug to deal with his "nerves" (that's what anxiety used to be called then). He had previously been on handfuls of valium that used to accompany his whiskey with predictably dire results.

 

As a young adolescent, I became aware of the large boxes of 100's of these little blue wonders around the family home, and by the age of 17, I had started to pilfer them here and there. I always loved the effect but never got into a problem with them until age 22; as a young graduate, I did some travelling in Asia and Brazil, where I discovered the joys of visiting pharmacies. Again, I did not really get any form of dependency that I recall, but there was a marker in my mind.

 

By the age of 29, I was embarking on the early stages of a romance leading to my (now failed) marriage. My paramour and I took a trip to Turkey in 1996, and after a few failed attempts, I found a pharmacist willing to dispense 28 x 5mg tablets after my virtuoso performance convinced him of a man on the edge.

 

Upon returning to the UK, I took a daily dose of 5mg's for the best part of a month, and as I was in a new and enormously stressful job, I saw my performance bloom. No anxiety meant I became, with the combination of lots of espresso, super-productive.

 

From there, I began to find ways to get whatever benzo drugs I could from whichever source. First, there were the street pills; then, as the WWW was beginning to flourish, I discovered online ordering. I was getting pills from the Caribbean, India and places in-between.

 

I had developed numerous ways of tapering, so throughout my 30's, I was on and off the pills. Being young and fit, with a speedy metabolism getting off was uncomfortable but easily doable. So I did - frequently.

 

With success in my career came money and kids. I developed a taste for fine wines, and why not? I deserved them, don't you know who I had become?

 

Grandiosity and denial made fine bed-fellows, and as my marriage dissolved (in no small part contributed to by my bad habits), I found myself living alone most of the week. By this stage, c.2010, the whole online ordering process had become organised and reliable. I continued to medicate using stress as my excuse and found that the pills took away performance anxiety, so my professional life continued to prosper.

 

I would develop a mini-habit then wean off until finally I got delivered some pills I really liked called Clonazepam.  I had 90 of these little charmers, and now in my early 40's ran out abruptly. I felt fine for three days or so until I suddenly found myself unable to walk properly, and when the ambulance came, it was discovered I was in seizure.

 

The hospital discharged me that evening, and I came home and ripped the house apart until I found a few pills. The medics could not explain why I had gone into a seizure, but I knew.

 

I then ordered industrial quantities of Valium and, combined with my thirst for the juice of the grape, began to fall apart. I visited my GP, who was very understanding, and she put me on a maintenance dose of 4mg a day, which after a few months I reduced to 2mg a day until finally, I was able to walk away in relative comfort.

 

Fast forward to Spring 2020, and knowing that I could not use alcohol any longer, I found the Covid situation intolerable and was unable to work. Then I got a spam email offering me a cornucopia of sleeping meds, Tramadol and Valium at knockdown prices. Delivery in 48 hours, mailed from within the UK. What could go wrong?

 

I ordered 60 10mg Valium as I did not want to get addicted - oh, no, not I. They arrived 48 hours later, and the magic returned. I started on 10mg but so good was the respite and so magnetic my new charm that I wolfed my way through the 60 and ordered 120 to replace them within a week. I planned to use and abuse 100 and leave 20 to taper off gently. By now, I was totally out of control, working from home and living alone; I was free to chuck'em down like M&M's. And so I did.

 

It was almost exactly a year ago that I realised I was in trouble and started going to AA to address the issue.

 

Since then, the yoyo has been taking place where I taper and eventually arrive at the gates of Hell and relapse again and so on.

 

The NHS and other government addiction services have been just about useless. I have found AA to be a great help, but 99% of my fellows do not know about Benzo addiction, and despite getting some support, I have had little guidance. My main influence has been Dr Google, who has been somewhat helpful. I am grateful that she led me to Benzobuddies, at least,  as ignorance is more or less everywhere but here.

 

So, today has been interesting. I took 2.5 mg in the morning, and it carried me through the day well. I even started to feel good from about 4.00 pm - like I was a 100% regular guy.

 

I consider myself blessed to be in a position to help my friend who is dying of cancer, and I spent the afternoon and early evening dealing with her issues. This is a wonderful opportunity to do something valuable to someone else but is simultaneously tremendous for me. I don't get preoccupied with my miseries and help dear Alison with hers.

 

I left there about 90 mins ago and, feeling hungry, bought fish and chips like a true Lymie and came home to read your lovely messages.

 

I have wasted my evening meal down with .5mg of Valium, and I still feel good. I am in total remission from my intrusive thoughts, and it's all as if the whole nightmare has just gone away.

 

Trust me; I am no longer that naive and am aware of what is going on. Clearly, two previous days of boosted dosing has helped my dopamine/glutamate issues calm down, and I am in a lovely window.

 

My plan now is as follows: I think I might see if I feel the need to drop the final .25mg of today's pill before bed. I hope that tomorrow I will be feeling good still and will begin the day with a .25 mg dose at breakfast time. I will keep away from the Nytol tonight and use the good energy and clarity I am experiencing to catch up on my work, which has been left ignored for weeks.

 

I will take 10mgs of Melatonin when I am ready for bed and listen to sleep hypnosis to hopefully nod off and get a decent or near decent night.

 

I will continue with my .25 morning dose and see where I am by the early evening. I guess I will either be able to cope on a 0.5 dose as tonight, or if I have a washing machine stomach and a head like Gaza, then I will avail of the full .75.

 

Whatever happens, I will make 10mg my daily maximum if required. If I can get by on 0.75, then I shall try and set that as my bar - pending your respective approval, of course.

 

Whenever I arrive at a stable baseline, I will continue for as long as you think it sensible. I shall then begin the dreaded art of the taper.

 

I am so glad to have you both onboard.

 

I will press send now and go back and reread your replies to see if I  have missed anything out.

 

 

Thank you both once again. I take your advice, Pamster re. the rehabs being rip-off joints, but I thought it might be something to have up my sleeve for the worst final 2 weeks when I reach the stepping off point.

 

I have to accept that the 2-week idea is a fantasy - I am now a 55 year old, and my body and metabolism have changed - even if my skin is still as soft as the driven snow. I hope that it does not take 2 years, but I will have to accept whatever gets thrown at me as I want this rubbish out of my system to be fully restored to sanity.

 

My nightmare was smelling of fatalism without this site, but you guys have given me a wonderful sense of hope. So, I am sending hugs:thumbs-up:

 

 

Bancha

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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I'm relieved to hear you weren't offended by my remark, thank you for telling us more of your story.  I can see you've been managing this situation for a long time but managing probably isn't the right word, it's been managing you.  What I know from experience is that when we get the poison out of our lives, life becomes so much simpler, richer and easier.  I'm no longer exhausted by the lies I have to tell, the plans I have to make or the actions I have to take to get the drink or drug and to protect its secret.

 

You know your body well enough to understand what you need to take to achieve stability so I'll trust your process but I'm glad that in the meantime you'll be gathering your supplies and psyching yourself up for what comes next.  You can do this, I see self awareness and someone who isn't lying to himself anymore. 

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Wow, Bancha; you are a talented storyteller. Your story carries such incredible weight of tragedy and bravery. I'm sorry to hear how much you've suffered, and I'm grateful that you are still here with us and learning and growing in love.

 

Your appetite and tolerance for benzodiazepine seems akin to a superpower; I hope that you are ready to trade this temporary immunity to stress for a life of honesty and hard-earned freedom. It asks a lot of us to forgo our childhood coping strategies, but it sounds like you recognize the danger you are in. You deserve to be free of this burden.

I hope we can help you! I believe that we only truly heal together. :smitten:

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Hi Slownsteady and Pamster,

 

I have been very moved by the kindness and warmth of your replies. I am feeling good today. I had my breakfast of 0.25mg and have eaten, limited myself to one cup of Jo and am ready for my day.

 

I was just on the phone with a friend who commented the difference in my tone between today and earlier in the week - "it's like talking to a different bloke", said he.

 

I do feel like a massive weight has been lifted - I intend to prevail.

 

Thanks again,

 

 

Bancha

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Yes Bancha, thanks for the story, you are an artist.

 

There is something which is a mystery.  It might be because we live across the pond from each other.

 

But I cannot tell what is going on with your decimal points.

 

I believe you are on 10mg of Diazapam per day.  But for example, in your comment:

 

    "Whatever happens, I will make 10mg my daily maximum if required. If I can get by on 0.75, then I shall try..."

 

Did you mean to write

"get by on 7.5"?

 

 

 

 

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Hi Bob,

 

Thank you for your message. Indeed, you are correct - unlike you I am innumerate and mathematics is/was my weakest suit. I get my decimals mixed up - actually, it's mainly because I am careless and my keyboard is a bit sticky. I will try to check my numbers before posting in future. Thanks

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Thank you for clearing that up.  I understand your desire to go from 10 to 7.5mg because most likely, it is a simple cutting off 1/4 a pill.

 

Two things I would like you to consider.

 

First, going from 10mg to 7.5mg is, for most people, way too fast.  You might get by with it one time and stabilize at 7.5mg.  But after that, you should slow down.

 

Second, benzo withdrawal is not linear.  Reductions made weeks ago can slowly add up and hit you all at once.

 

Question.  Do you want to try 7.5mg?  If so, stay at that level for at least 10 days or until your symptoms are tolerable (whichever is longer).

 

But if you want to slowly reduce from 10mg, then cutting pills is hard to measure and so we can talk liquid taper or getting a scale for a dry taper.

 

How can I help you?

 

 

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Thanks, Bob,

 

I agree based on empirical experience of the non-linear nature of this beast. I have decided that the way forward for me right now is the 7.5 at bedtime and 2.5mg in the morning. I feel ok, and in fact, I feel god right now. I wonder what is in the mail?

 

I suspect that 10mg is a sensible place to start as it's a nice round number. I have a jewellery scale already but have ordered a more accurate one, as recommended.

 

I think I will ride out the 10 day period and see where I am and, if stable, then begin to follow your direction. Is the benzodrytapermath.com site your work? I have only just found this site today. I think that as I am now in a place of greater acceptance, easing up on my hurry is good news. I have just over another week to sit back and see what happens.

 

I am really not fussed about what taper I do as long as it works. The idea of making a month's worth of tincture appeals, then so does the dry taper schedule as set out in benzdrytapermath.com. I am still waiting for my 120 pills to arrive. I am wondering if this is enough, in your opinion. I wonder if it is worth having any more backup or if it is a case of drawing a line in the sand now and declaring war from this point onwards.

 

The contrast to how I am feeling now t how I was really struggling at the start of the week is so marked that I want to stay safe and make the journey as comfortable as it can be. I am simultaneously accepting that this is not all plain sailing.

 

If you don't mind me asking you directly - what would you recommend?

 

Thanks,

 

 

Bancha

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Hi Bancha,

 

Yes, benzodrytapermath.com is my work. 

 

Yes, I think I have enough information to give you advice.  HERE ARE THREE OPTIONS:

 

OPTION 1: Liquid

If you want to use liquid taper, follow something like this video

I recommend you use 1/2 teaspoon of vodka to dissolve your pill first.

 

OPTION 2:  Dry

You want to defeat this beast in two steps.

 

Step 1 - Begin your taper by crunching your 10 mg pills into bits (not to a powder) and use the bits to weigh on the scale to compute your taper.  You can put the bits into empty gel capsules and make a whole months worth in a few hours.  You will reduce a specific amount every 10 days (or whenever your symptoms become tolerable again, whichever is longer).  I will help you with the math.

 

Step 2 - When your dose gets so low the scale will no longer measure accurately, you will start using the method in benzodrytapermath.com.  That method has your crush your benzo into a powder and mix with Microcrystalline Cellulose.  The effect will bring the weight back into the region where your scale is accurate again.  In this method, each pill will be exactly 0.02 mg less in dose so each day, you will reduce 0.02 mg every day..  I will help you with the math and spreadsheet.

 

As for if you have enough pills, To complete Step 1 and Step 2, I compute you need a minimum of 1200 mg of the drug (if everything goes smooth and you don't have long holding periods).  Right now I think you only have 140 at 2mg and 70 at 10mg which only equals 980mg.  But if Step 1 goes faster than expected, then you just might be fine.

 

When you get your new scale, I will need you to measure the weight of your 10 mg pill in grams and give me that number.  To check your work, I will also ask you to give me the weight of 5 of your 10 mg pills.

 

OPTION 3: Hybrid

Another good option is to try liquid first and get as low as you can and then return to me if you start having troubles and we can do the dry method.

 

Bob

 

 

 

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Wonderful; many thanks.

 

Time to get busy.

 

I will be in touch soon - going to have a lie down

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Hi Bob,

 

I suppose this is predictable, but I have gone from feeling ok to feeling overwhelmed and frazzled. It's 8.30 pm here, and I have climbed into bed to hide in the dark. Windows and waves, eh?

 

I will review the info again, but I am feeling so incompetent that I am not sure I can manage anything. I am dealing with the desire to press the F*** It Button and take a cheat dose - same old, same old. Apologies for dumping, but I know from experience that the very function of writing is helpful. I need to keep my brain active constructively, and reading this site can be both massively reassuring and terrifying depending on the prism through which we are viewing it.

 

I have been caring for my dying friend again today, and I think it might be a good idea to take a day ff and try to care for myself a little tomorrow as my apartment is messy, reflecting my mental state.

 

I am extremely grateful for your advice and help. I have recovered my old jewellery scales and found they are accurate to 0.1g - so I guess that you will need more accuracy for my pill weight - or will this do for now?

 

I will watch the video again - it seems so easy, but I just got the feeling of being overwhelmed by it. I am not sure where the taper comes in. I saw her squirt an amount away, and I guess that is the way to remove an amount of V from the total.

 

Possibly the dry taper will suit me better - it looks like a good way for me to organise a month ahead at a time. This will reassure me. I am nervous that I might not be able to do a daily regime as she suggests - I don't know. Perhaps I will feel more open to the idea when  I am more clear-headed. It is amazing how fast a squall can come into the mind. I was feeling so "normal" - now I have reverted to a place of fear. I know this territory well as I have been here many times, but the prospect of months of increasing discomfort seems terrifying to me right now. I need perspective, which hopefully sleep will provide. I regret that being a pillhead, I could not resist taking more Nytol, hoping it might knock me out.

 

This is all very simple yet mind-bendingly complex. I would appreciate a pointer towards any talking resources such as meetings etc., you may know of. I can't tell my family what is going on, my AA fellows are (understandably) confused, and I am back to being scared.

 

I apologise for venting, but I am sure you will understand the need to get this stuff down as part of the therapeutic process. I feel so angry that the medical establishment seems to have conspired to hush all this up. I wonder how many people around the world have had lives blighted by these "miracle" drug?

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Huge pendulum swings are discouraging aren't they?  We never know from one minute to the next how we're going to feel so we're constantly off balance.

 

I wonder if you might look at the Support Groups to see if there are any discussions that might appeal to you as a way to distract yourself.  I used to read success stories when I was fearful, of course I didn't believe they were written by real people until I wrote one, these are the lies benzo's tell us.  Speaking of that, here is a thread many have contributed to. Benzo Lies That Have Been Busted

 

We don't typically suggest meetings since we do our best to protect anonymity but I've read members talk about online meetings for benzo injured people.

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