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Possible new reinstatement method?


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[6d...]
I know I should've reinstated right after my setback, back when a single 5 mg diazepam rescue dose could've made me feel great for days, but I didn't and I'm sorry I didn't. I thought I would be digging myself in deeper into dependency, and everyone and my physicians were talking me out of it. But benzos are a strange counterintuitive drug and it doesn't work like that. So here I am now, a mess. I was warned about "reverse taper" method, where you add 1 mg / day diazepam per week as that's a shot in the dark. You can updose to stratosphere and have no resolution of symptoms. So, today I've gotten a pack of zolpidem (I guess midazolam would be better as it's binding profile is closer to diazepam, but it's 15 times more expensive). I reckon if adverse/paradoxical effect happens you want the drug to be out of your system as fast as possible, not hanging there for two months. Say if I take a midazolam tablet and withdrawal symptoms go away, then it will be safe to reinstate equivalent dose of diazepam? Thoughts and opinions?
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I say if you take it and the withdrawal symptoms go away then you should be able to safely switch to diazepam. Separate question though, aren’t you worried about worsening withdrawals from kindling ?  I realized the CoQ10 didn’t put me in a setback. It didn’t help either though. I was in a horrible wave for 14 days it wasn’t 100% back to acute but it is acute-ish. The wave still hasn’t lifted yet, but it’s starting to a bit. That’s what had me thinking about reinstating.  I don’t know how many more of these acute-ish type waves I can take. Especially since they are lasting sooooo long.
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[6d...]
If you've already decided, I would take the lowest dose and listen carefully for the symptoms.
That's the plan, but instead of titrating the dose for weeks with diazepam, just do it every 20 minutes with midazolam. If you don't get better right away, abandon the plan.
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[6d...]
I say if you take it and the withdrawal symptoms go away then you should be able to safely switch to diazepam. Separate question though, aren’t you worried about worsening withdrawals from kindling ?  I realized the CoQ10 didn’t put me in a setback. It didn’t help either though. I was in a horrible wave for 14 days it wasn’t 100% back to acute but it is acute-ish. The wave still hasn’t lifted yet, but it’s starting to a bit. That’s what had me thinking about reinstating.  I don’t know how many more of these acute-ish type waves I can take. Especially since they are lasting sooooo long.
Kindling just means you should taper slower if reinstatement works out. Let me tell you, tapering (proper) and cold-turkey/"rapid" are heaven and earth. Told you so. I took huge doses of CoQ10 when at my worst and it didn't make me worse off. Yes, reinstatement may be a gamble, but guess what? So, is waiting it out. If healing were linear, clear-cut, and assured, then I agree reinstatement would be a bad idea.
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[6d...]
When will you start?
I'm not certain I'll go with it yet. That's why I'm brain-storming here. Obviously, I don't want to make things even worse.
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You aren’t scared that if reinstatement doesn’t work out that you’ll be making the withdrawals worse?  Is it even Porto reinstate as far out as you and I are?  You’re like a month ahead of me. Wouldn’t you have to go up on dose?
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[6d...]
You aren’t scared that if reinstatement doesn’t work out that you’ll be making the withdrawals worse?  Is it even Porto reinstate as far out as you and I are?  You’re like a month ahead of me. Wouldn’t you have to go up on dose?
That's the thing. It's completely a russian rulette. Some people reinstate within the proper time frame and get paradoxical. Others double the dose and never stabilize and then when they taper they add another additional layer on top of existing withdrawals. And there are those that actually rapidly lose tolerance in cold-turkey and then reinstate on a much lower dose. There was that guy in introduction threads recently that cold-turkeyed off of 120 mg / day diazepam and reinstated IIRC four months later on 10 mg / day.
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What is IIRC???  And that is crazy!!!!!!  I hope if you do choose to reinstate that yours is that easy as well!  I have plenty of Ativan here left over because I didn’t even take it as prescribed. So I can reinstate if I want but my REAL scare is I don’t know which withdrawals I’m going through....  the Ativan, the baclofen, or the gabapentin......  they all have the same withdrawal symptoms. Also I’ve already expressed I think I’m going through a duel withdrawal. Like after 6 weeks I felt my heart rate drop ALOT!  Then again after 3 months it dropped drastically again. So I just don’t know where I’d even start! 
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[6d...]

What is IIRC???  And that is crazy!!!!!!  I hope if you do choose to reinstate that yours is that easy as well!  I have plenty of Ativan here left over because I didn’t even take it as prescribed. So I can reinstate if I want but my REAL scare is I don’t know which withdrawals I’m going through....  the Ativan, the baclofen, or the gabapentin......  they all have the same withdrawal symptoms. Also I’ve already expressed I think I’m going through a duel withdrawal. Like after 6 weeks I felt my heart rate drop ALOT!  Then again after 3 months it dropped drastically again. So I just don’t know where I’d even start!

If I Recall Correctly

Yeah, many polydrugged people on SurvivingAntidepressants report that they can differentiate waves from different drugs. But, it doesn't matter from what you're withdrawing, benzos, if they work at all, work for all. There was a guy who was on benzos to deal with antidepressant withdrawal, and had waves from antidepressant withdrawal bypassing benzos. Also, it's advised to hold for a while after reinstatement. Problem is that lorazepam is potent, you'd have to split the pills to titrate on the lowest dose that works for you. That's why this is such a mess. It would've been best if we'd done proper tapers in the first place (well, I did but it got ruined in the end, double whammy). If reinstatement works out, then there's no problem. Problem is what to do if it doesn't regardless of the dose, or worse yet, if it goes paradoxical. That's why I'm trying to think of reinstatement protocol with least danger.

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I can see possibly gabapentin and Ativan overlapping. But Baclofen works on gaba B receptors. From everything I’ve read only gabapentin works for gabapentin withdrawals. And only baclofen works baclofen withdrawals. But both gabapentin and baclofen work for benzo withdrawal. So mine is shakey. I would always come to you in advice with reinstating and how to’s. You and Diaz-e-Bam always teach me sooo much. Which reinstatement protocol are your currently thinking about trying?
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Dang Pace! I didn't realize you were so bad right now :'(

What symptoms are making you want to reinstate exactly?

And are you around 4 months off right now?

I actually tried to reinstate at 4 months myself, so no judgement, just curious!!!

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[6d...]

Dang Pace! I didn't realize you were so bad right now :'(

What symptoms are making you want to reinstate exactly?

And are you around 4 months off right now?

I actually tried to reinstate at 4 months myself, so no judgement, just curious!!!

Ear symptoms are driving me insane, though agitation/irritability sometimes makes it hard to function as well. Sometimes I have desire of self-harm and outbursts of crying anger (technically I think these are attacks of mixed episode, except I'm not bipolar) which is deeply disturbing to everyone around me. In hindsight all this suffering was needless, I ought to have reinstated right away after my setback. What was I thinking letting myself and my family go through this? I never should have listened to that damned doctor. Now I understand he never took any of my suffering seriously. He thought it was all in my head. I should've went with my original gut feeling. I knew better and still didn't trust my instincts.

I'm six months off since the last dose, seven if we count the large one (the setback) that threw me into cold-turkey withdrawals. Before that I was a bit sleep deprived and had GERD, but was otherwise completely asymptomatic.

Well, unfortunately it didn't work out for you, obviously. What happened?

 

 

I can see possibly gabapentin and Ativan overlapping. But Baclofen works on gaba B receptors. From everything I’ve read only gabapentin works for gabapentin withdrawals. And only baclofen works baclofen withdrawals. But both gabapentin and baclofen work for benzo withdrawal. So mine is shakey. I would always come to you in advice with reinstating and how to’s. You and Diaz-e-Bam always teach me sooo much. Which reinstatement protocol are your currently thinking about trying?
I din't mean exactly that they work to remove each other's withdrawals, but rather that drugs can sort of "mask" withdrawals from other drugs, and benzos "mask" almost everything, from antidepressant withdrawals to antipsychotic side-effects.
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[6d...]

I wouldn't reinstate.I would may be look for other non benzo ways to alleviate the pain..

Bexlan

I'm gathering courage to try and one-shot ear symptoms with 900 mg gabapentin. To think that not only did I not reinstate when I should've, but back then had intense pangs of guilt for taking that 5 mg diazepam rescue dose three weeks into my setback. What a fool I was. That should've led right to reinstatement. All my symptoms were cleared and I haven't felt better in a long time.
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I wouldn't reinstate.I would may be look for other non benzo ways to alleviate the pain..

Bexlan

I'm gathering courage to try and one-shot ear symptoms with 900 mg gabapentin. To think that not only did I not reinstate when I should've, but back then had intense pangs of guilt for taking that 5 mg diazepam rescue dose three weeks into my setback. What a fool I was. That should've led right to reinstatement. All my symptoms were cleared and I haven't felt better in a long time.

 

Learn from my mistake with the gabapentin!  Please taper off slowly!  I was on 900mg and my doctor took me off at 300mg at a time. And I jumped from 300mg!  It was horrible!  When you start tapering the gabapentin just do 100mg at a time and do it 100mg per month. I’ve heard people that did say that they near to no withdrawals from it!  Good luck my friend!  I hope you find some relief!

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[6d...]

Learn from my mistake with the gabapentin!  Please taper off slowly!  I was on 900mg and my doctor took me off at 300mg at a time. And I jumped from 300mg!  It was horrible!  When you start tapering the gabapentin just do 100mg at a time and do it 100mg per month. I’ve heard people that did say that they near to no withdrawals from it!  Good luck my friend!  I hope you find some relief!

I don't plan on staying on gabapentin, rather just take 900 mg in one day, and stop. Hopefully that'll prevent dependence from forming. I've heard people complain that gabapentin is hard for tapering because it has such a short half-life. Good God, I still can't believe how hard I've been hit by just two days use, especially since one 5 mg rescue dose kept me stable for days. I used to think, that since Bexlan was similarly hurt by amitriptyline and similarly took high doses as rescue doses and recovered that I'll recover too. But no, for me it wasn't like that. That's why I say to people, if you use rescue doses plan on reinstatement.
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Dang, I can feel your frustration.

I didn't realize your are 6 months off.

Is the ear stuff tinnitus? Or ear pain?

What about trying things in the natural realm? Could they be worth a shot before hitting a drug again?

 

For me when I tried to reinstate at 4 months off (now mind you, I had been on Ativan, and trazadone for 6 months, but then massively polydrugged in facility for a month with loads of stuff), but I was 4 months of all drugs, and I tried Valium for like 3 or 4 days .....ummm it was a disaster! Thought it couldn't get worse but it did. By the time I was 2 weeks out from that, the nerve pain kicked up to its most highest point, and I was left not being able to walk or lift my limbs and sobbing, crying nonstop in pain.

But if I read correctly, you said your first rescue dose actually made you feel better? See, mine did not.

Maybe we are just opposite each other?, since amitriptyline hurt you but helped me, lol

I don't know man, I think I would exhaust all other things first?

My neuro even got me a pot card for the nerve pain , because he seriously did NOT want to put more drugs in me since he saw what other docs had done to me!

Of course we all know, I ended up on low amitrip, so I don't judge anyone who's gotta do what is best for them!

Even when he gave me the amitrip, we literally started with 2.5mg , and slowly increased by 2.5 till I got to 10mg for like a month.

Sometimes I feel like when we attempt a drug or solution, we try too much or too fast for our sensitive bodies.

 

Well I know you do your research, and I wish you best of luck with whatever you decide!

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[6d...]

Dang, I can feel your frustration.

I didn't realize your are 6 months off.

Is the ear stuff tinnitus? Or ear pain?

What about trying things in the natural realm? Could they be worth a shot before hitting a drug again?

 

For me when I tried to reinstate at 4 months off (now mind you, I had been on Ativan, and trazadone for 6 months, but then massively polydrugged in facility for a month with loads of stuff), but I was 4 months of all drugs, and I tried Valium for like 3 or 4 days .....ummm it was a disaster! Thought it couldn't get worse but it did. By the time I was 2 weeks out from that, the nerve pain kicked up to its most highest point, and I was left not being able to walk or lift my limbs and sobbing, crying nonstop in pain.

But if I read correctly, you said your first rescue dose actually made you feel better? See, mine did not.

Maybe we are just opposite each other?, since amitriptyline hurt you but helped me, lol

I don't know man, I think I would exhaust all other things first?

My neuro even got me a pot card for the nerve pain , because he seriously did NOT want to put more drugs in me since he saw what other docs had done to me!

Of course we all know, I ended up on low amitrip, so I don't judge anyone who's gotta do what is best for them!

Even when he gave me the amitrip, we literally started with 2.5mg , and slowly increased by 2.5 till I got to 10mg for like a month.

Sometimes I feel like when we attempt a drug or solution, we try too much or too fast for our sensitive bodies.

 

Well I know you do your research, and I wish you best of luck with whatever you decide!

Tinnitus is low in volume, I'm more troubled by hyperacusis and inner ear pressure/pain. Yeah, it worked great for me (didn't feel better in a long time) but that was way back three weeks into cold-turkey. As I said I don't know why I didn't reinstate just there and then. Stupid, stupid, stupid! I feel I have to do something, I'm literally going insane, even though I'm doing a LOT better than in first few months.

 

 

But wouldn’t that be considered a rescue dose?

Yeah, but gabapentin isn't a benzo.
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What is IIRC???  And that is crazy!!!!!!  I hope if you do choose to reinstate that yours is that easy as well!  I have plenty of Ativan here left over because I didn’t even take it as prescribed. So I can reinstate if I want but my REAL scare is I don’t know which withdrawals I’m going through....  the Ativan, the baclofen, or the gabapentin......  they all have the same withdrawal symptoms. Also I’ve already expressed I think I’m going through a duel withdrawal. Like after 6 weeks I felt my heart rate drop ALOT!  Then again after 3 months it dropped drastically again. So I just don’t know where I’d even start!

 

You're actually doing really really well. I know you don't feel like you are but you are. the fact you are getting windows is great.

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Dang Pace! I didn't realize you were so bad right now :'(

What symptoms are making you want to reinstate exactly?

And are you around 4 months off right now?

I actually tried to reinstate at 4 months myself, so no judgement, just curious!!!

Ear symptoms are driving me insane, though agitation/irritability sometimes makes it hard to function as well. Sometimes I have desire of self-harm and outbursts of crying anger (technically I think these are attacks of mixed episode, except I'm not bipolar) which is deeply disturbing to everyone around me. In hindsight all this suffering was needless, I ought to have reinstated right away after my setback. What was I thinking letting myself and my family go through this? I never should have listened to that damned doctor. Now I understand he never took any of my suffering seriously. He thought it was all in my head. I should've went with my original gut feeling. I knew better and still didn't trust my instincts.

I'm six months off since the last dose, seven if we count the large one (the setback) that threw me into cold-turkey withdrawals. Before that I was a bit sleep deprived and had GERD, but was otherwise completely asymptomatic.

Well, unfortunately it didn't work out for you, obviously. What happened?

 

 

I can see possibly gabapentin and Ativan overlapping. But Baclofen works on gaba B receptors. From everything I’ve read only gabapentin works for gabapentin withdrawals. And only baclofen works baclofen withdrawals. But both gabapentin and baclofen work for benzo withdrawal. So mine is shakey. I would always come to you in advice with reinstating and how to’s. You and Diaz-e-Bam always teach me sooo much. Which reinstatement protocol are your currently thinking about trying?
I din't mean exactly that they work to remove each other's withdrawals, but rather that drugs can sort of "mask" withdrawals from other drugs, and benzos "mask" almost everything, from antidepressant withdrawals to antipsychotic side-effects.

 

Oh Pace. I wish I had a magic wand to take it all away for you. I totally get where you are at with the desire to self harm. shortly after I jumped I had to have a friend take away all my sharp knives. They only returned a couple of weeks ago.  Please be kind and gentle to yourself. I can read how hard you are being on yourself in your posts.  You are a smart intelligent person - you got this.  I think one of the recurring themes from your posts is that you regret not going with your gut feeling.  So go with your gut feeling now. You will get through this. Sending you a big hug from many many oceans away.  Please treat yourself like you would your own best friend - please don't be hard on yourself.  Be gentle, be kind - you are so worth it.

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[6d...]
Oh Pace. I wish I had a magic wand to take it all away for you. I totally get where you are at with the desire to self harm. shortly after I jumped I had to have a friend take away all my sharp knives. They only returned a couple of weeks ago.  Please be kind and gentle to yourself. I can read how hard you are being on yourself in your posts.  You are a smart intelligent person - you got this.  I think one of the recurring themes from your posts is that you regret not going with your gut feeling.  So go with your gut feeling now. You will get through this. Sending you a big hug from many many oceans away.  Please treat yourself like you would your own best friend - please don't be hard on yourself.  Be gentle, be kind - you are so worth it.
Thank you for you kind words, Bess. I know that you're suffering even worse than me. How do you manage to cope in addition to all the bad things that keep happening to you?
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Oh Pace. I wish I had a magic wand to take it all away for you. I totally get where you are at with the desire to self harm. shortly after I jumped I had to have a friend take away all my sharp knives. They only returned a couple of weeks ago.  Please be kind and gentle to yourself. I can read how hard you are being on yourself in your posts.  You are a smart intelligent person - you got this.  I think one of the recurring themes from your posts is that you regret not going with your gut feeling.  So go with your gut feeling now. You will get through this. Sending you a big hug from many many oceans away.  Please treat yourself like you would your own best friend - please don't be hard on yourself.  Be gentle, be kind - you are so worth it.
Thank you for you kind words, Bess. I know that you're suffering even worse than me. How do you manage to cope in addition to all the bad things that keep happening to you?

 

Anytime lovely, I’m always here cheering you on, 

 

Oh lovely, sometimes I don’t Cope at all - sometimes when I have to work & I feel

Like a walking corpse & im getting slogged I just want to thump my feet in the dirt & howl.  Today I was happy because my car only cost $1800 to get these, my phone was playing trucks when I was talking to a friend who lives in a different state, I shouted myself an expensive non-sugar fizzy drink & then I dropped it after only one slurp, I filled up the fuel in the hire car & as I was opening up the fuel cap petrol splattered out on my T.Shirt.  All in half an hour.  I try not to look at them as bad things but what I can learn from them.  I try to still treat oriole the way I would want to be treated - no matter how horrid they are.  I jyy it at try to put one foot in front of the other & not look at everything all at once if that makes sense but just look at what’s happening at the time. Sometimes I come home & just collapse in bed & watch brainless mindless stuff on Netflix, but nothing that causes anxiety or sadness etc - funny stuff mostly, stuff I never would’ve watched before the horror of Benzo’s.  I’ve learnt a lot about myself through this hell of benzo withdrawal - & you know what - I’m gonna use it all for good,  & one day you will too - you are here fir a big reason pace - life will not pass you by & you will be right in the middle of a wonderful life again when you are healed.  You just have to believe that you are indeed healing,  this is your brain working it’s way towards healing.  You use do what is it that you want to do with reinstating, listen to your gut feeling & take your time with it.  The only thing that we all know really works is time, time time & more time.  There is no rushing it. It all goes at its own pace - which is rather maddening. We want a timeline, we want linear healing.  But we don’t have it - because we are strong, stronger than strong.  Find that place inside of yourself  that knows you are healing & that you will one say he healed & cling onto that for dear life.  You can do this.

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