Hello - New to Group

I'm struggling with insomnia related to ambien and ativan withdrawal. I took both meds for about 3 months after developing a panic/anxiety disorder.

My ativan usage was fairly limited - only taking it about 2 times per week (.5mg dose) on average. My Ambien dose was nightly for a while, between 5 and 10 mg, so that is likely the bigger problem.

I stopped taking these meds about 2 weeks ago, and was doing pretty good the first week - sleeping about 6 hours a night, although waking up a lot and dealing with anxiety. But horrible insomnia set in over the last week. Have had several sleepless nights including the horror of 2-3 sleepless nights in a row. I can hardly function now. Any advice for dealing with insomnia would be much appreciated.

thanks

Insomnia is a biggie for a LOT of people here.  My suggestion is to try to relax about the whole sleep thing.  Sleep could be reduced for a while.  Don't let yourself get mad or depressed or anxious or frustrated about it as the added emotion will only make your insomnia worse.

 

Accept that this is a stage of recovery and do what you can to function from a condition of less sleep.  This is a temporary condition and will improve.  However, it may take some time.  Be patient.  You won't go insane.  You'll get more sleep than you realize, but sometimes waking from 15 minutes of sleep feels worse than not sleeping.

 

I kept my laptop by the bed and gamed or worked when I found myself awake at 3 am (which was pretty often for a few months).  I'd also play soft music or listen to soft meditations all night.  I stayed away from upsetting news (which is pretty much all news these days).

 

Obviously, I tried some things to add sleep.  I took OTC sleeping meds (either diphenhydramine or doxylamine) a few times a week.  They helped a little (don't expect miracles).  I tried melatonin, but it did nothing for me after my jump (it works great now).  I added a low dose of gabapentin for a couple of months and it seemed to help a little (again, don't expect miracles).  CBD did nothing for my sleep.  THC did, but it can ramp up anxiety/paranoia and legal restrictions may be involved, depending on your location.

 

I got my best sleep when I could completely exhaust my brain of all thoughts - either by relaxation or by sheer mental exhaustion.

 

Hope this helps.

I concur with Badsocref.

 

Insomnia is one of the worst symtpoms, but it won't kill you even though it feels like it could.  It was definitely my worst symptom and I had a lot of other symptoms.

 

For me the insomnia was more of a mental battle than a phsyical one.  Sure, when I was getting 5-10 hours per week of recognizable sleep, I felt like crap, but most of the time I made myself feel worse than I needed to.  Why?  Because I thought if I didn't get 7 or 8 hours every night something bad would happen to me so I convinced myself I should feel like crap.  It turns out many times when I had a zero night or a night of no perceived sleep I actually felt better than when I got an hour or two of sleep. 

 

I learned coping skills.  How to deal with no sleep without freaking out, which only ensures you won't get much, if any, sleep.

 

You can function on very little sleep.  I remember an old post from almost 4 years ago where I said I couldn't go to work because I had not slept in 3 or 4 days in a row (which happened to me at least 10 or 12 times during WD) and Badsocref explained how I could.  He said I needed to get up and eat something and go to work and he was right.  After I did that a few times, I just kept on doing it.  There was zero chance of me nodding off behind the wheel or I would have been able to sleep. 

 

It all evened out over time.  It was all temporary.  It will be the same for you.  You'll get past this.  Just please don't consider taking any more Ativan or Ambien.  You've been off 2 weeks, so stick it out, it will slowly get better....I promise!

Thank you both for the help and encouragement. That gives me hope.I'll keep working to bust through it.

Badsocref and ThEwAy2, both of you had great replies to this post.  Yes, insomnia is a big concern with benzo withdrawl.  Thank you both for your spot on words!  Treeman99, so good to hear you are encouraged.

 

Best,

 

Kate 

Treeman: 

 

This was my worst symptom but it gets better.  Here are some quick tips:

 

I used Benadryl, Tylenol PM, and melatonin in a rotation, never using any one more than two nights in a row.

 

Only go to bed when you feel tired, not at a fixed time.

 

If you cannot fall asleep, don’t just sit and stew, get up and read.

 

Try to resist napping during the day.

 

Try to do a calming meditation or sleep relaxation audio.  I used asmr sleep videos. 

 

One other trick, try sleeping in a different bedroom.  I think new surroundings tricks your brain.  At least it fooled my withdrawal weary brain!

 

Good luck....but don’t worry you will get sleep.

Treeman,

 

Welcome to our motley crew! You've gotten some great advice here from the pros who have gone through the fire and come through the other side...just like you will one day.

 

Withdrawal presents an opportunity/invitation. Your metaphorical house is on fire. You can run around screaming "OMG, my freaking house is on fire!," and curse at all that may have contributed to the situation. Or, you can feel the flames and decide to do everything possible to put the fire out and put your house in order.

 

What does this mean? You have a huge kick in the pants now to take care of yourself. Things that your body/mind could shrug off before will have shuddering impacts now on your sleep. So now is the time to clean up your eating (perfection isn't required, but less sugar, less processed foods, less preservatives, etc), exercise, meditation, and overall stress reduction will not only help you survive wd but leave you in a much better place than you were to begin with.

 

I *hated* going through wd and the absolute hell of a crazy length of time with impossibly small amounts of sleep. But I think it has probably helped make it more likely I'll live longer. I now exercise 4-5 hours a week, eat much better, have moderate caffeine intake (after having to abstain for a year or two), I meditate more often, I have a regular gratitude practice, I'my faith is stronger, and I have healthier relationships. Your list may look different from mine but it's worth considering: what lifestyle changes you might adopt that could really help now and later? You are in the driver's seat and can choose much of how this unfolds for you. You can't choose your symptoms but you choose how you respond.

 

MT

Goodness me, two more great replies from RShack and MTfan!!  RShack, you tips are great and there are some I wouldn't think of.  MTfan, you've addressed the thing that came to me as I started my taper ...  I have to learn better ways of living that will get me through this taper and beyond because I can't rely on benzos anymore to be the "solution".  Thanks bunches to all.

 

Kate 

Thanks everyone. Those are great suggestions and i really appreciate the encouragement. I'll be working the program with meditations, better diet, exercise etc. My psych counselor recommended sleep restriction therapy. Has anyone tried that?

 

Not familiar with sleep restriction therapy...although I guess we all were on some form of it, not by choice!

Thanks everyone. Those are great suggestions and i really appreciate the encouragement. I'll be working the program with meditations, better diet, exercise etc. My psych counselor recommended sleep restriction therapy. Has anyone tried that?

 

I can almost guarantee you, it will not work during Benzo WD.  It can work for those that do not have Benzo induced insomnia.  The idea is that you only spend X amount of time in bed whether you sleep or not and slowly expand the amount of time.  That has a much better chance of working for someone with chronic insomnia.  But Benzo induced insomnia is a totally different beast that does not respond to sleep restriction.

 

If you want to know why this is happening, it has to do with your down regulated GABA and the lack of balance with Glutamate.  Both are nervous system receptors.  GABA is your body's "brake pedal" or what slows things down and makes you calm and relaxed.  Glutamate is your body's "gas pedal" or what makes you active and alert or even fight or flight.  Normally the two are in a "balancing act" so one doesn't overtake the other.  But when your GABA is temporarily taken off line by the Benzo, Glutamate rules the day and night.  That's why you might feel wired all the time, have racing thoughts and are never sleepy.  It takes some time for your body to repair the temporary damage.  No one knows how long that will be.  But your body knows exactly how to repair the damage and put your GABA and Glutamate back into balance.  However, it is a very nonlinear process...UP and DOWN, one step forward, 2 steps back for some time for most.

 

So attempting to restrict sleep, that isn't going to come anyway, is foolish.  Sleep restriction works when Glutamate isn't temporarily running your life making you wired and unable to sleep.  Until that balance returns, sleep is hard to come by short of reaching for another Rx drug, which I would highly recommend you don't do either.

TheWay:  thanks for the great explanation.  Never heard of this form of therapy before. 

Personally, I was happy to get sleep wherever and whenever I could.  If I nodded off for a couple hours on the couch watching football in the afternoon, great.  Obviously, my body was tired and wanted sleep.

 

Nothing wrong with trying some 'proper' sleep hygiene to see if it helps.  Just want to be sure that the new sleep rules don't become a significant stressor.

Very true.  I did find myself napping during the day after first jumping off.  These are just suggested tips.  Part of relieving the stress is not being too fussy aboutThings.

 

I’m amazed I can fall asleep most nights now without taking anything.  Last night I even had a couple glasses of wine and slept great.

Alcohol works on GABA receptors the same way that Benzos do.  I would highly suggest that you try to completely avoid alcohol during healing and recovery, but you need to decide what is best for you.

 

That may be why you slept well...a few glasses of wine might have the same effect as taking a Benzo?

 

 

I’ve been a moderate drinker before, during, and after.  Typically a couple of drinks a few times a week.

 

I totally understand why many avoid alcohol, but it hasn’t been a problem for me so far. 

How do you know alcohol isn't affecting your sleep?

Because most nights I fall asleep without taking anything and stay asleep for several hours.

 

I really don’t notice a difference on nights when I drink.  Plus I do not think two glasses of wine is a lot of alcohol. 

 

 

Thank you everyone once again - especially TheWay2! I especially appreciate the advice on sleep restriction. One more question: what do people think about buspirone? I still use it occasionally and wonder if it can disrupt sleep. Thanks!

Treeman99

Thanks everyone. Those are great suggestions and i really appreciate the encouragement. I'll be working the program with meditations, better diet, exercise etc. My psych counselor recommended sleep restriction therapy. Has anyone tried that?

 

Hi - I just wanted to report that I went through cognitive behavioral therapy for insomnia-

I actually started Ativan because of insomnia. I wish I knew about CBT-I before starting Ativan because I think it would have cured me! It works so well- the main foundation for CBTI is sleep restriction. There is a really good app that you can download to help with it. It gives you a planned bedtime and wake up. You have to be very diligent for it to work but I am a true believer! I still struggle with some problems from insomnia from Ativan withdrawal and I don’t know what I would do if I didn’t have this tool to help me!

 

Hi - I just wanted to report that I went through cognitive behavioral therapy for insomnia-

I actually started Ativan because of insomnia. I wish I knew about CBT-I before starting Ativan because I think it would have cured me! It works so well- the main foundation for CBTI is sleep restriction. There is a really good app that you can download to help with it. It gives you a planned bedtime and wake up. You have to be very diligent for it to work but I am a true believer! I still struggle with some problems from insomnia from Ativan withdrawal and I don’t know what I would do if I didn’t have this tool to help me!

 

Thank you Recoverer24. I will explore that CBT-I app further.

hi! when i was at my worst. i tried sleep restriction therapy and it was terrible. when the problem is that your brain is recovering from these drugs, a behavior modification program won't make the sleep come. all the advice you have been given about just relaxing, letting it all unfold as it will, being patient and most of all, being okay with not sleeping, so that you don't put pressure on yourself at night, it is all healing and you will get better. even i am getting better. i am new to the group, and i have followed this advice and it is working. good luck! keep posting your progress, we are all here for you.

I too tried sleep restriction therapy when I was almost at my worst, but all it did was bring me to my worst by depriving me of the very little sleep that I could possibly have had. After a time my therapist got so alarmed at my lack of sleep that she took me off the program. Serious withdrawal insomnia is a chemical problem, not a behavioral problem. CBTi in general and sleep restriction therapy specifically, may work for normal insomnia, but I think that few folks in the middle of withdrawal insomnia will see much results from it.