Need help getting off 1 mg of daily Clonazepam (5 years).

Hello, I’m new to Benzo Buddies. Need help getting off 1 mg of daily Clonazepam (5 years).

New doctor recommended I switch to Prozac 20mg daily. Is that enough?

How should I tapper the Clonazepam?

Thanks!!!

Hello Miraz30, Welcome to BenzoBuddies!

 

I'm glad you hear you ask how to taper, because too many try to just stop taking it like I did and that's not a good idea.  We suggest going very slowly, perhaps 5-10% of your dose every week or two, the key is to go slow to keep symptoms to a minimum.  Some people can stop taking this drug without problem but for those who do, they need support to understand what's happening to them, and that's why we're here.

 

Take a look at our  Planning Your Withdrawal (Taper Plans) board, there you can see the methods we support, and when you're ready, you can start a thread to ask our members for suggestions.

 

It will also help you to learn about benzo's and what they do to us, you can find some great information in  The Ashton Manual, it's important to be prepared for this process.

 

Prozac is an antidepressant and Clonazpam is a benzodiazepine, so while it can be helpful to have an A/D on board, one cannot take the place of the other.  You might want to do some research around the forum and elsewhere before you decide to take the Prozac.

 

Please let us know how we can help you.

 

Pamster

Thanks Pamster for reaching out!!!!!

 

I was currently trying to do cold turkey from 1mg daily of Clonazepam for 5 years. First week I tapered from 1mg to .250mg, so I was feeling good and I went Cold Turkey. What a mistake! After 120 hours (5 days) with no pills y crashed and took .250 and then went for another 40 hours without a pill and crashed again and took another .250mg. I know it's bad...

Today I haven't touched a pill. Yesterday was the day I took the .250mg.

 

What is your recommendation for a taper plan?

 

I also bought a digital scale for cut drying the clonazepam pills.

Hello and welcome, Miraz30. Based on what I’ve read here, a good first step to consider would be to stabilize your dose and dosing schedule. 

what Taper plan do you recommend? Thanks!

As Libertas has pointed out, its important to begin a taper plan from a position of stability, if it were me, I'd go back to perhaps half of the original dose to see if that will help you feel better, if it does, then it would be wise to stay there for a few days.  If not, you may want to consider going up a little bit higher in dose. 

 

While our goal is to be drug free, its important to remain functional as we do this.  The drug has changed the way your brain sends messages to just about every part of your body, so as you reduce and finally quit the drug, your brain has to recover.  This does not happen overnight and doing this quickly does not promote healing, it just increases your pain.

 

When you get stable, lets talk about your taper plan, but first think about getting on a consistent daily dose, our brain likes consistency.  I'm glad you got a scale, this will allow you to make very small cuts to your dose, we don't want to see you uncomfortable.

Hello Pamster, super thanks for replying to my message! You are an inspiration for me!

 

My C/T withdraw from ClonazPam has been going okay, my last dose was six days ago and I feel good most of the time. I've been at it for 17 days. I know that I have a long ways to go.

 

Please forgive me for not tapering and try to go Cold Turkey, but I really believe and want to get of this horrible medication.

 

I quit drinking, go to sleep on time, I'm also eating properly and lost weight (I know, this might not be right way to lose weight). The only 2 issues that are the most persistent are:

 

Insomnia and Anxiety around people. Is this normal at this stage of Cold Turkey from ClonazePam?

 

Thanks!

Well Miraz30, you sound determined so it's up to us to get on board with your choice.    We want whats best for you and in our experience cold turkey is a particularly difficult choice to make, but this is your choice to make. 

 

Clonazepam has about a 30-40 hour half life, so symptoms usually start showing up around that time, they can and most likely will continue to increase in the next few days and weeks, it sounds like you're experiencing a couple of them.  You may not get hit with the whole range of symptoms, some people can escape this process without too much pain, others like those of us here, not so lucky.

 

I know I sound like a broken record, but I have to try to impress upon you one last thing.  The drug has made changes to your brain, and the brain must heal, this takes weeks, months and even years for some of us.  Whether you remove the drug slowly or quickly doesn't matter to the brain, it will still take the time it needs to recover.  Removing the drug slowly allows us to remain functional as the brain heals, taking it away quickly just increases the pain, but not the healing.

 

Okay, I'm done lecturing.    Keep talking to us and we'll help you get through this nightmare.   

Thanks for the prompt reply!!!

One of the other reasons for me going Cold Turkey is because it's been really hard to find a psychiatrist in the new city where I moved, but I just made a phone call and found one but until 2 1/2 weeks from today .

I really want to taper down the correct way, but I don't have many options at this point. I'll keep calling around and see if I can find someone else, thanks!!!

Thanks for letting us know about your problem with finding a Dr, we've seen this a lot around here.  And if you can't see another Dr for awhile yet, the subject may be moot. I'm glad to see you're open to tapering but if this is the way it has to be, then we'll be here.  I made it through and lived to tell about it. 

 

 

Thanks Pamster!

 

You mentioned that the brain heals with time, is it while tapering or until your body does not have Clonazepam in your system?

I don't know if you've seen this, but it's written by one of our members, and to tell you the truth, it helped me to finally understand what these drugs do to us.  Here is an excerpt with the link to the full post below.  I so wish this would have been available to me when I was going through this because my benzo brain couldn't understand what Professor Ashton was saying in scientific terms. 

 

Please take a moment to read this, your brain has a big job ahead of it and the job will start when you begin to withdraw the drug, all at once, or slowly.  The slowly part just seems to hurt a little less, but the work still has to be done regardless of the method used.

 

What does a benzo do?  If a person is anxious - they may be so stressed that they cannot overcome a very traumatic event or anxious situation.  If a doctor prescribes a benzo - the benzo comes in and sorta "holds the door open" for ALL the GABA in the system to FLOOD into the nerves - even when that is not what the nerves would actually want to occur. The immediate effect is that EVERYTHING ni the body SLOWS DOWN and is inhibited. This might be helpful during surgery, for anesthesia, for a seizure disorder.  Yes - the benzo - by definition - will act on GABA and "slow everything down".  And yes - the net effect of this is that a person may feel drowsy, calm, less anxious... everything is being inhibited.    And in general, taking a benzo for "one day"  is okay. When the benzo is gone, the body just reverts back to regular operation.

HOWEVER, if a person takes a benzo day after day,  while indeed the person feels less anxious, the body begins to realize that it cannot DO the things it needs to do in this very slowed-down neuron state. It cannot make hormones. It cannot create enzymes. It cannot digest correctly. It cannot keep a heart going efficiently. It cannot get enough oxygen- and on and on. The body NEEDS to run at "normal" speed - not this "inhibited speed" all slowed down.

But what can the body do? It cannot "remove the benzo" from the system. The only choice the body has to maintain a regular speed is to do two things ..  It can TURN OFF it's own GABA receptors - thereby rendering those benzos unable to affect the GABA in the system. And it can grow MORE excitatory Glutamate receptors to counteract the slow-down.  And that's kinda exactly what happens....

 

Only - this isn't true balance either.  The body does the best it can - but over time, things begin to suffer.  The body cannot make enough serotonin in this state. Or dopamine. Some things get made in excess - and other things do not get made enough!  During this time, a person may not be aware this is all going on. He may not be able to perceive any difference. But ONE day - the person may wake up sad - or not sleeping well - or unable to remember things fully - or his vision doesn't look right....and it becomes apparent the person has "hit tolerance".  The body is taking the same amount of drug -but try as it might, it just cannot overcome what has occured. It can take weeks, months or years to hit tolerance. Some people do and some don't before trying to get off benzos.  (I did. - it took me 9 months to hit tolerance.  But it was fast.  Once I hit it, I could notsleep more than 6 hours on all that klonopin AND Ambien! I couldn't remember things last week. I was crying all the time... something was wrong.)

 

The process to reverse this takes a while.  GABA receptors have to UPregulate and effectively "reopen" or "grow back".  Glutamate receptors must DOWNregulate, or effectively "turn off" or "prune back".  And IN this mix, all the smaller monoamines (neurotransmitters like serotonin, dopamine, norepinephrine) must somehow find a way to synthesize in the mix.  Through weeks and months the body is rebuildling millions of neurons, and changing pathways, rebuilding GABA, downregulating Glutamate, rebuilding serotonin, rebuilding dopamine, rebuilding norepinephrine.  And ALL the enzymes and hormones that need to be made are attempting to be made while this is going on.  Basically- you have a building where the MAJOR streel structures are trying to be rebuilt at different times - ALL while people are coming and going in the building and attempting to work.

 

 

What is happening in your brain

Thanks Pamster!

 

I have enough Clonazepam to reinstate until the 29th when I see my new Psychiatrist. The whole purpose is to safely taper out of Clonazepam, make a plan under the Doctor’s supervision.

Like I mentioned below, I was taking 1mg per day for 5 years and never was told that it was addictive. What questions do you recommend me asking the Doctor? I never ask and that is why I’m in such a hole.

Also, which dose do recommend me to reinstate meantime I see the doctor (22 days)? Thanks!!!

I'm glad to hear you've found a new Dr and as for questions, I'd start a thread on the  Withdrawal Support (during your taper) board asking members for their input, put your question in the title, that should get you responses.  The most important question you need to ask is, will you support a slow taper by supplying me with enough pills to do this for myself?  Of course, you'll probably need to say this a little more diplomatically. 

 

As for reinstating, I don't have any first hand experience with this, but I'm told you'll want to find a stable dose, where you don't feel great but you're holding your own. 

Pamster, thanks for reaching out!

 

Here is my current situation:

On December 20/2019 I tried to go C/T on 1mg daily of Clonazepam for 7 years. I lasted 5 days and then took .25mg. Then went C/T again and crashed 3 days later and took .25mg again. I jumped for the 3rd time on January 3 and so far it’s been 17 days without Clonazepam. But in the meanwhile I’ve been taking 40mg of Prozac for a month and 3mg of Lunesta for insomnia.

I’ve been four days without Lunesta and I’m starting to feel jittery and anxious. Is this the Lunesta masking the Clonazepam w/d or also Lunesta w/d?

According to one of your posts, you mentioned that 3mg is equivalent to .5mg of Clonazepam, if that’s the case, I’ve never jumped of Benzos?

One other thing I saw in many posts is that people try to first taper out lunesta and then Clonazepam. Is there a reason for this? Isn’t easier to tapper out Lunesta? Thanks

Lunesta is a what we call a z-drug, it's called a non-benzodiazepine but it works very much like a benzo on the brain.  A z-drug is very short acting, this is so people can take it and wake up after 8 hours. 

 

According to the chart I'm looking at 15 mgs of Lunesta is equal to .5 mgs of Clonazepam, so you're taking considerably less.  I do feel however that the Lunesta has been masking your withdrawal symptoms.  It is possible to feel withdrawal from Lunesta, it mirrors benzo withdrawal but in my experience it wasn't as bad.  I didn't taper either Klonopin or Ambien and found the Ambien easy to get over, there are many people though who can't say the same.

 

Most of the posts I've seen have recommended tapering the benzo first, in fact, this is what I typically recommend just because it can be beneficial to have the z-drug on board for the hideous insomnia, but both drugs are nasty to tell you the truth.

 

Are you going to stick to no Clonazepam and no Lunesta and ride out the symptoms?

 

 

Thanks Pamster for your reply!!!

 

I’m going to take Lunesta 3mg at night for two weeks and then taper off every two weeks by .75. This will take approximately 8 weeks. Is this doable?

Its certainly doable but even if I said it wasn't, I have a feeling you wouldn't listen to me.    You quit the Clonazepam pretty much cold turkey, so you may be looking at some symptoms.

I know, I know, like I said before, the main issue is getting a psychiatrist. I’m going to see him soon, thanks!!!

Thanks Pamster and to everyone else!!!

 

So far it’s been a month since I went cold turkey and it’s been 19 days since my last dose of Clonazepam. Most days I feel physically fine, the most problems is where I get anxious around people. I always been an anxious person but not like this. It seems that I am trying to avoid people. I also feel that I’m obsessed with thinking about the w/d and negative thoughts, for example: I can’t be around people, I can’t make it, should I take Clonazepam again? What if I have hard attack, etc, etc. Is there anything I can do to stop the constant negative thoughts? thanks!

Hi Miraz,

 

I think you could benefit from talking to the wider community about what you're feeling, not many members look at the introductions board.  If you'll start a thread on the Cold Turkey, Detox & Rapid Withdrawal board asking these same questions, you'll get more responses. 

 

And, it will help a great deal if you put your history in your signature so folks don't have to look back through your posts for it, they'll be able to see at a glance what's going on. Here are the instructions.  Add your history/signature 

 

For now though, I'm going to let you know my thoughts on your situation.  You're suffering from your cold turkey from Clonazepam, everything you're feeling is 'normal', the thoughts, the fears, the anxiety all of it is what we go through.

 

You have two options at this point, go back on the drug and do a slow taper or stick with your cold turkey.  You need to understand though that tapering is not fun either, there is pain and suffering with either route, just varying degrees.

 

I've been talking to you for awhile now and I'm not sure you're the taper type, I'm not so I'm not judging you, some of us just aren't good with this stuff, I'm the leap first type think later type. 

 

I hope you'll ask for comments from our members, I can tell you're in a bad spot and indecision makes it ever worse.  Hopefully you'll figure out what you need to do, but in the meantime, look at chapter 3 of  The Ashton Manual , it always helped me to know that what I was feeling was to be expected.

 

 

Hello Pamster, It's been sometime I haven't reached out.

Here is my story so far, its been a little less than 2 years that I went cold turkey on Clonazepam and 18 months from Prozac. It's been great so far until 3 days ago. For some reason out of the blue I stared feeling anxiety. Not sure what the trigger was but it just happened.

It's happened to me before and it just last me some hours but this time its been 3 days so far.

 

The questions that I have or maybe I just want to talk to someone, is that maybe anxiety never goes away, and it's always there in the back of your mind (and front!). I tried coping with it with pills and it took a great amount of time and effort to get out of them (clonazepam 7 years and 6 months of Prozac). But I pushed through and I feel better, I regained much of my memory back and fast thinking but it left me still with anxiety.

 

I've been managing anxiety by maintaining myself busy on my own, for example. I've been cooking big meals every day, doing house work, fixing things in the house, buying and building legos (expensive hobby), anything that gets me to avoid my two children and wife. I've been married for 16 years and have two wonderful kids that I try to avoid by doing other things on my own.

 

Please don't think that I don't interact or play with them, Its just they give me anxiety or that is the way I reprogrammed by brain after the traumatic Clonazepam Withdrawal. Now I am in the process of rearranging my thoughts (trying to make them happy thoughts) and going into the process of switching my time and thoughts for my family. Instead of avoiding them, go with them, try harder to be with them, enjoy their presence while they are still there and young. They are good kids but I'm the one always trying to do something else around the house instead of playing and being with them. I really need to figure this out.

 

I just feel anxiety and self doubt that I can't be a good parent and good father in all kind of ways. I always seem to try and avoid the people that I love, not sure why. I don't think it, but I do it.

Anyway, I just wanted to reach out and let you know how I'm doing.

 

Thanks for being there, thanks for Benzo Buddies.

 

I hope you and your crew are doing great!

Thanks for adding your signature, are you dealing with other symptoms besides anxiety?  Are you still taking Lunesta, are you seeing a therapist to help sort out your feelings about your wife and kids?

 

Are you using any coping strategies for your anxiety, I don't suffer from it, I took the Klonopin for sleep but I know members who when they discontinue the benzo's have to find new ways of dealing with their chronic condition, what tools have you developed to replace the drug?

 

 

It should be illegal for an old doctor you have been seeing for years or a new doctor you are transitioning to.....to just demand that you stop benzos abruptly that you have been on for years and start taking an AD or other drugs. These doctors have absolutely no clue what the patient is experiencing. The drug companies should be ashamed too. They know what the hell is going on. You can not just stop these drugs on a dime. It is inhumane to do this to patients.

 

Welcome to BB Miraz30.

 

Thanks for your responses!

I did take Lunesta a couple of days ago and it helped but so far I have tried to avoid taking Lunesta. But I am not getting any sleep. I keep getting these racing thoughts and then my chest starts getting hot and then after that I wake up. It’s my adrenaline of “fight or flight”.

Before 6 days ago, I used to not have any issues with sleep or anxiety, not sure why I’m having them now. I need to analyze where my anxiety is coming from. I really don’t know what to do.

Any tips on how to sleep? On how to stop the adrenaline rush? Thanks