Please Help - Ativan to Valium Switch

Hello BenzoBuddies,

I’m new to the group. I’m overwhelmed by all of the information on tapering. I’m in tolerance withdrawal and need some help.

I’m on 2mg Ativan. 1mg am and 1mg pm. I want to switch over to Valium and do a slooo liquid taper. Since Valium comes in liquid form it sounds like that might be a way to go. What I need is a step by step process.

Questions I have are:

-  Do I dose twice a day like I’m doing with that Ativan?

-  Do I go straight to liquid or do I do part liquid and part tablet?

- How do I make my daily doses?

Thank you so much for your help!

Eric

Hello BenzoBuddies,

 

I’m new to the group. I’m overwhelmed by all of the information on tapering. I’m in tolerance withdrawal and need some help.

 

I’m on 2mg Ativan. 1mg am and 1mg pm. I want to switch over to Valium and do a slooo liquid taper. Since Valium comes in liquid form it sounds like that might be a way to go. What I need is a step by step process.

 

Questions I have are:

-  Do I dose twice a day like I’m doing with that Ativan?

-  Do I go straight to liquid or do I do part liquid and part tablet?

- How do I make my daily doses?

 

Thank you so much for your help!

 

Eric

Welcome! The amount of information can be overwhelming.

I would suggest starting out with the two doses. Combing tablets with the liquid was my choice. I was senstitve to the pharma liquid and found less is better

If you are crossing over to pharma liquid Valium there is really no need to dilute the solution.  Here is how I reduced 10% every 14 days reducing a little bit every day using a combination of tablets and 1ml=1mg pharma solution:

              Am                                                  Pm

9mg tabs +  1ml/mg liquid                9mg tabs + 1ml/mg liquid

9mg tabs + .93ml/mg liquid              9mg tabs + .93ml/mg liquid

9mg tabs + .86ml/mg liquid              9mg tabs + .86ml/mg liquid

9mg tabs + .79ml/mg liquid              9mg tabs + .79ml/mg liquid

9mg tabs + .72ml/mg liquid              9mg tabs + .72ml/mg liquid

Here is  some info on how to read syringes.

Here is a program to make your own taper plan.

If you need anymore help just ask

Thank you so much I really appreciate it. I have some questions.

So I’m in tolerance withdrawal on the 2mg Ativan. If I go to 20mg Valium (10am and 10pm), Do you think I will feel  better? The same? is 2mg of Valium stronger than 2mg of Ativan?

Which syringe do I need? 

How do you get 9mg pills? Don’t they come in 10mg?

Do you drink the Valium from the syringe? Do you put in in water?

Thanks so much,

Eric

Here’s a different option. Since you’re taking Ativan only twice a day, it’s no wonder you’re having withdrawal between doses.  Ativan is short-acting, just a few hours. You might consider splitting your daily 2mg into four .5mg doses daily. You may be able to dry cut from there without having to cross to Valium.

Just my two cents.

Thank you so much I really appreciate it. I have some questions.

 

So I’m in tolerance withdrawal on the 2mg Ativan. If I go to 20mg Valium (10am and 10pm), Do you think I will feel  better? The same? is 2mg of Valium stronger than 2mg of Ativan?

 

2mg of Valium would equal .20mg Ativan

 

Which syringe do I need? 

 

This would depend on the type and strength of the solution/suspension you use

 

How do you get 9mg pills? Don’t they come in 10mg?

 

Use 4-2mg tablets and split one in half

 

Do you drink the Valium from the syringe? Do you put in in water?

 

Yes, you can take it from the syringe or squirt it in water, juice, or whatever.

 

Thanks so much,

 

Eric

Why not try what Challis suggests dosing 4x a day instead of 2x. If that doesn't work, then look at the alternative options.

What’s strange to me is that I took 1mg in pm for 25 years with no problem. About a year ago my doctor added another 1mg in am. So why didn’t I go into tolerance withdrawal with just the 1mg for all those years? My brother and sister in low have also taken 1 mg at night for a lot of years with no problem.

It’s just strange how that works.

Eric

What’s strange to me is that I took 1mg in pm for 25 years with no problem. About a year ago my doctor added another 1mg in am. So why didn’t I go into tolerance withdrawal with just the 1mg for all those years? My brother and sister in low have also taken 1 mg at night for a lot of years with no problem.

 

It’s just strange how that works.

 

Eric

There is no rhyme or reason in the benzo withdrawal business lol

Gudruna,

I like your method. Did you have any problem getting your doctor to prescribe tablets and liquid? Did you go from Ativan to Valium?

Ty Eric

What’s strange to me is that I took 1mg in pm for 25 years with no problem. About a year ago my doctor added another 1mg in am. So why didn’t I go into tolerance withdrawal with just the 1mg for all those years? My brother and sister in low have also taken 1 mg at night for a lot of years with no problem.

 

It’s just strange how that works.

 

Eric

I keep wondering about these things and don't quite have all the answers myself. Did something happen in your life recently that might have contributed to you feeling unwell? There's a lot of variance to the bad symptoms while in tolerance. It goes from slightly unwell to pure Hell and anything in between. Had you stayed on 1mg, you may have been fine for a few more years. Or maybe you would not have been fine at all. Nobody really knows.

Personally, I got incredibly ill when I ended up on 1-3mg Ativan in December of 2014. Prior to that, I was taking 0.5mg weekly throughout the most of 2014. I wasn't feeling very well at all, but I was nowhere near as ill as I did when I started taking the ativan daily, and especially when my dose got to 2mg/day. I am sure there are people out there that can do ok for a while, but I just have a hard time seeing someone tolerating 2mg+ of Ativan per day year after year, especially considering Ativan's short half-life/quick elimination and the potential to induce some really bizarre effects and problems. This may be just anecdotal, but I'd observed more than a few people on these boards with all sorts of neurological issues and/or horrid sleep issues and/or awful panic states who'd been on daily ativan for a while.

I think a crossover to Valium may be a really good idea. Just please keep in mind that

a) if you are in the United States, there is a huge valium stigma here, and many doctors are terrified to prescribe it and even more terrified to prescribe a dose that's larger than 10mg/day. Also, mainstream mental health establishment has very little clue about Ashton protocols and valium crossovers and it's also just hard to convey what you're trying to do while you are in the throes of a cruel withdraw syndrome.

You may want to have all the contingencies figured out in advance. If your Dr. switches you to Valium, he'll most likely stop the Ativan. This is usually not a big deal if you can switch to Valium quickly, but some people (like myself) could not and end up on both, and then you have to navigate a stigma of being on 2 while you're trying to do the right thing. Also, even if you switch to 20mg Valium directly from 2mg Ativan, you may find yourself over-sedated yet still very anxious, because Valium is a strong hypnotic (sleep) but a fairly week anxiolytic (compared to Ativan).

If you'd taken Ativan mostly for sleep, the switch to Valium may be more likely to work than if you took it for anxiety/panic.

Another strategy to consider would be to perhaps slowly reduce Ativan from 2mg to 1mg or so and then go and switch from 1mg Ativan to 10mg Valium and slowly get off of Valium from that point on.

Gudruna,

 

I like your method. Did you have any problem getting your doctor to prescribe tablets and liquid? Did you go from Ativan to Valium?

Ty Eric

My NP gladly provided the tablets I needed to taper. It helped that I brought in a detailed spread sheet and was able to clearly articulate my method and plan. If you bring a spread sheet along with your plan to your provider it is very important to make it clear that the spread sheet is only a guide and that you will be doing a symptom based taper holding when/if necessary.

No, I did not go from Ativan to Valium. After the first year of Valium my NP suggested Klonopin. I switched abruptly from Valium to klonopin with no problem. After one year of Klonopin I abruptly switched back to Valium with no problem. So I guess not everyone need to do a crossover. Try it and see.