Pineal Gland Awakened? Connection between mind and body

Hey guys,  I've been doing a lot of research lately after reading some pretty disturbing posts about DR and DP.  

 

French Philosopher Rene Descartes believed the pineal gland to be "the seat of the soul" where mind and body met.  Interesting note!

 

In the average person, the pineal gland is atrophied and dormant.  And if you ever read some of this guy's philosophy on life and God you would think he was going through benzo withdrawal.  It's bizarre as hell and I remember writing essays on his philosophy during college when I was taking philosophy as a minor and thinking to myself that this guy is on a whole new wave length of thinking.

 

Recent studies indicate that the pineal gland (The Third Eye) can be awakened by extreme pressure or concussions to the head.  After the pineal gland has been awakened, it is very hard for it to go dormant again.

 

This pineal gland is activated by Light, and it controls the various bio-rhythms of the body. It works in harmony with the hypothalamus gland which directs the body's thirst, hunger, sexual desire and the biological clock that determines our aging process. When it awakens, one feels a pressure at the base of the brain.

 

While the physiological function of the pineal gland has been unknown until recent times, mystical traditions and esoteric schools have long known this area in the middle of the brain to be the connecting link between the physical and spiritual worlds. Considered the most powerful and highest source of ethereal energy available to humans, the pineal gland has always been important in initiating supernatural powers. Development of psychic talents has been closely associated with this organ of higher vision.

 

Anyhow, I thought this was interesting and would probably explain why we all get this severe head pressure and why we all seem to be philosophizing so much about the meaning of life.  I'm going to email my philosophy professor and get his opinion on the pineal gland and how Descartes viewed it.  If we're going to have this for the time being, why not have some fun with it's mystical powers instead of being freaked out.

 

BTW:  I have no evidence of this, and am simply speculating.  So please don't take this to heart, or think I'm some new nutcase or something.  It just seems so interesting to me and if anyone has some insight please share.  And if this isn't the right forum to post this, I apologize.

 

Ziggy

Hi Ziggy,

 

I don't have an opinion or specific knowledge about Descartes his views on the purpose of the pineal gland, but this is definitely the correct forum board for such a discussion.

Has anyone gone through a whole new level of thinking while in withdrawals? Good nor Bad?  And ever had some sort of sixth sense that makes you acutely aware of everything in the world and what is going on around you, and sometime becomes disturbed because of this?  IDK maybe I'm out on a wimb but it seems like the D/T and D/R symptoms are somehow related to pressure on the pineal gland which is temporary for us. 

Hey Ziggy,

 

Yes, of course you know already  But I have gone through some major thought process changes, but thankfully they are returning to normal. I attribute it to obsessive thinking, ruminating and a overactive sense of analyzing things.

 

I always thought dp/dr was sort of an impaired cognition, awareness and perception...our personality lies in the frontal lobes so if we feel our personality is gone, then possibly there is some impairment in the part of the brain. The cerebral cortex plays a key role in memory, attention, perceptual awareness, thought, language, and consciousness, so perhaps the impairment that causes us to have trouble thinking, and the feelings of dp/dr are resultant of that.

 

 

cupcake

 

 

I believe in "Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas" there is talk of chewing on a Penial gland. 

wow, i was looking for the connection to pineal gland as they say were going to be ascending from 3d to 5d and the floride and poisons that were put in our food and water to calcify us will be stopped soon. With the world in different mode right now with planets and stars ect... I think my pineal gland was the reason i had so many issues in clonazapam withdrawal for 3 long years before it actually let up, head pressure like no other. im off maybe 5 years now and all of a sudden im having symptoms like im going thru withdrawals again. im back to the head pressure, the heart palps, jaw pain vice grip feeling over my head. I think there is a connection to the pineal gland decalcifying

My degree and MA were philosophy.

I used to meditate a lot.

 

Benzo withdrawal, in my experience, has nothing to do with ‘awakening’ the pineal gland.

 

For me DP/DR feels exactly the opposite of the openness & expansiveness you achieve with meditation

It feels like I am a tiny speck trapped deep inside my limbic system and that I have no control over the rest of my brain which feels like it is acting on its own and against my ‘will’.

 

 

Yes, I too had the feeling of my limbic system being trapped in a Rubix cube.

 

Looking back after being healed it was because my sympathetic nervous system was in because of the protracted withdrawal from benzos. What we stuff down must come back up.. and it does!  Only 10 fold! 

 

Deep treatment with ketamine, psychedelics, and Kambo helped to release me from this state.

 

Keep in mind I was 8 years off of benzos before I went down this road. 

 

After releasing my limbic system, the emotions that I hadn't felt in 8 years all came flooding back.  DBT Therapy is what helped regulate my emotions.

 

 

 

 

I would not recommend this route to anyone who hasn't been off of benzos for at least 2 years.

Yes, I too had the feeling of my limbic system being trapped in a Rubix cube.

 

Looking back after being healed it was because my sympathetic nervous system was in because of the protracted withdrawal from benzos. What we stuff down must come back up.. and it does!  Only 10 fold! 

 

Deep treatment with ketamine, psychedelics, and Kambo helped to release me from this state.

 

Keep in mind I was 8 years off of benzos before I went down this road. 

 

After releasing my limbic system, the emotions that I hadn't felt in 8 years all came flooding back.  DBT Therapy is what helped regulate my emotions.

 

 

 

 

I would not recommend this route to anyone who hasn't been off of benzos for at least 2 years.

Hey Siggy,

Have you written about Kambo anywhere..?

MiYu reported a good result among other things..

Ty

 

I don't believe I have.... possibly?  I've been away from this forum for 8 years.. and tend to pop in when I get a personal message or reply to a thread.

 

 

I am a certified entheogenic life coach who went through 12 months of training as it relates to PTSD and addiction; all while having a spiritual awakening that even Bill W talks about in AA, but we were too prude as a country to move forward with something that wasn't based in 'science' - something that has been repeatedly been proved wrong... you know how the earth was flat and then the center of the universe.

 

I've participated in interviews with USA Today on DMT with other members of my tribe who talked about various other modalities such as MDMA, psilocybin, Bufo, Iboga, Ketamine infusions, etc for healing childhood trauma... which by the way... if you are a member of this group, you'd be naive to think you aren't here for a reason.

 

The lesson is in the experience and only occurs when we remove ourselves from the victim's seat. (in time, as that's been our perception on reality for most of our lives if we become honest with ourselves)

 

From what I have gathered; it comes down to when we chose to split from our core existence, which was a genuine experience from the time of birth. However, we formed a maladaptive way to exist and still have our primary caregivers tender loving support on an emotional level by forming an illegitimate attachment with those closest to us - our family.  But it was all a lie in order to keep the peace.

 

ie: My father wanted me to go corporate much like his path.. and I did and did very well. However, I needed to be on antidepressants and other meds to stuff my emotions and chose attachment to my family vs having an authentic relationship with them and myself for that matter; because I knew or even believed in my heart that my family would never accept me if I chose a path that involved the arts. 

 

Long-term exposure for living a life that is far from genuine and authentic, WILL without a doubt, create long-term psychological damage until confronted.

 

My partner coach, whom I work with on a weekly, is a certified Kambo practitioner at a legal Ayahuasca facility in Florida; so I always bounce any potential clients off of him before proceeding.

 

I've noticed that Oxi is one of your gotos for dealing with the pain brought on by the protracted withdrawal.

 

Interestingly enough - dermorphin is what's released by your hippocampus along with several other peptides when participating in a Kambo ceremony.  Dermorphin is more than 10x more powerful than any synthetic morphine you could ever think about buying... and it's natural, as its released by your own brain and therefore not addictive.

 

Having said that... I DO NOT recommend Kambo to anyone who is still tapering or in acute withdrawals. If this is a path you choose - then I highly recommend you find an experience Kambo practitioner.

 

 

 

 

 

I don't believe I have.... possibly?  I've been away from this forum for 8 years.. and tend to pop in when I get a personal message or reply to a thread.

 

 

I am a certified entheogenic life coach who went through 12 months of training as it relates to PTSD and addiction; all while having a spiritual awakening that even Bill W talks about in AA, but we were too prude as a country to move forward with something that wasn't based in 'science' - something that has been repeatedly been proved wrong... you know how the earth was flat and then the center of the universe.

 

I've participated in interviews with USA Today on DMT with other members of my tribe who talked about various other modalities such as MDMA, psilocybin, Bufo, Iboga, Ketamine infusions, etc for healing childhood trauma... which by the way... if you are a member of this group, you'd be naive to think you aren't here for a reason.

 

The lesson is in the experience and only occurs when we remove ourselves from the victim's seat. (in time, as that's been our perception on reality for most of our lives if we become honest with ourselves)

 

From what I have gathered; it comes down to when we chose to split from our core existence, which was a genuine experience from the time of birth. However, we formed a maladaptive way to exist and still have our primary caregivers tender loving support on an emotional level by forming an illegitimate attachment with those closest to us - our family.  But it was all a lie in order to keep the peace.

 

ie: My father wanted me to go corporate much like his path.. and I did and did very well. However, I needed to be on antidepressants and other meds to stuff my emotions and chose attachment to my family vs having an authentic relationship with them and myself for that matter; because I knew or even believed in my heart that my family would never accept me if I chose a path that involved the arts. 

 

Long-term exposure for living a life that is far from genuine and authentic, WILL without a doubt, create long-term psychological damage until confronted.

 

My partner coach, whom I work with on a weekly, is a certified Kambo practitioner at a legal Ayahuasca facility in Florida; so I always bounce any potential clients off of him before proceeding.

 

I've noticed that Oxi is one of your gotos for dealing with the pain brought on by the protracted withdrawal.

 

Interestingly enough - dermorphin is what's released by your hippocampus along with several other peptides when participating in a Kambo ceremony.  Dermorphin is more than 10x more powerful than any synthetic morphine you could ever think about buying... and it's natural, as its released by your own brain and therefore not addictive.

 

Having said that... I DO NOT recommend Kambo to anyone who is still tapering or in acute withdrawals. If this is a path you choose - then I highly recommend you find an experience Kambo practitioner.

 

Why do you not recommend Kambo for people still withdrawing?  There are some practitioners I have spoken to with experience -- AND I'm trying for accurate and reasonable information to inform my decision.

thanks fora ny reply!

I don't believe I have.... possibly?  I've been away from this forum for 8 years.. and tend to pop in when I get a personal message or reply to a thread.

 

 

I am a certified entheogenic life coach who went through 12 months of training as it relates to PTSD and addiction; all while having a spiritual awakening that even Bill W talks about in AA, but we were too prude as a country to move forward with something that wasn't based in 'science' - something that has been repeatedly been proved wrong... you know how the earth was flat and then the center of the universe.

 

I've participated in interviews with USA Today on DMT with other members of my tribe who talked about various other modalities such as MDMA, psilocybin, Bufo, Iboga, Ketamine infusions, etc for healing childhood trauma... which by the way... if you are a member of this group, you'd be naive to think you aren't here for a reason.

 

The lesson is in the experience and only occurs when we remove ourselves from the victim's seat. (in time, as that's been our perception on reality for most of our lives if we become honest with ourselves)

 

From what I have gathered; it comes down to when we chose to split from our core existence, which was a genuine experience from the time of birth. However, we formed a maladaptive way to exist and still have our primary caregivers tender loving support on an emotional level by forming an illegitimate attachment with those closest to us - our family.  But it was all a lie in order to keep the peace.

 

ie: My father wanted me to go corporate much like his path.. and I did and did very well. However, I needed to be on antidepressants and other meds to stuff my emotions and chose attachment to my family vs having an authentic relationship with them and myself for that matter; because I knew or even believed in my heart that my family would never accept me if I chose a path that involved the arts. 

 

Long-term exposure for living a life that is far from genuine and authentic, WILL without a doubt, create long-term psychological damage until confronted.

 

My partner coach, whom I work with on a weekly, is a certified Kambo practitioner at a legal Ayahuasca facility in Florida; so I always bounce any potential clients off of him before proceeding.

 

I've noticed that Oxi is one of your gotos for dealing with the pain brought on by the protracted withdrawal.

 

Interestingly enough - dermorphin is what's released by your hippocampus along with several other peptides when participating in a Kambo ceremony.  Dermorphin is more than 10x more powerful than any synthetic morphine you could ever think about buying... and it's natural, as its released by your own brain and therefore not addictive.

 

Having said that... I DO NOT recommend Kambo to anyone who is still tapering or in acute withdrawals. If this is a path you choose - then I highly recommend you find an experience Kambo practitioner.

 

Kambo is dangerous and its use illegal in most jurisdictions. There is absolutely no scientific basis for its use and the claims made for it by its 'practitioners'. My only warning on this matter:

 

Guidelines & Rules Regarding the Use and Promotion of Medicines and Drugs

 

Our aim is to allow members the freedom to properly describe their full and true situation, but at the same time prevent overly florid descriptions of illicit, recreational or abusive drug use that have the potential to cause the wider membership harm or distress.

 

Since most of our members have dependency/addiction issues with benzodiazepines, and our stated mission is to help them quit, we must disallow content that discourages them from this goal, or encourages behaviour that might lead to a new dependency or addiction. Therefore:

 

• Do not promote illegal drug use. Nor should you describe drug paraphernalia, exalt positive experiences, or glorify their use. Please keep descriptions factual and dispassionate.
   
   
  
• Do not promote the abuse (or illegal or inappropriate use) of medicines.
   
   
  
• Do not promote addictive (or habit forming) substances as withdrawal adjunctives.

 

With the above points and guidance in mind, you may discuss your use of medicines and illicit drugs as they pertain to benzodiazepine use and withdrawal. Additionally, please understand that because our focus is benzodiazepine withdrawal, the collective knowledge of our membership about drugs and medicines other than benzodiazepines will be limited. You should not expect, nor engage in, detailed support-orientated discussions about drugs or medicines other than benzodiazepines.

 

The Wikipedia page:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kambo_cleanse

Has anyone gone through a whole new level of thinking while in withdrawals? Good nor Bad?  And ever had some sort of sixth sense that makes you acutely aware of everything in the world and what is going on around you, and sometime becomes disturbed because of this?  IDK maybe I'm out on a wimb but it seems like the D/T and D/R symptoms are somehow related to pressure on the pineal gland which is temporary for us.

 

Yes, I went through a profound shift in consciousness during the withdrawal process. For me, depersonalization/derealization played a key role, in that I realized as a result that my acceptance of an objective reality was in fact based on entirely subjective perceptions (thoughts, feelings, sensations, etc.), and that those perceptions were in fact readily malleable and hence, unstable and unreliable.

 

At the time, I felt that I had more or less lost myself completely. Neither my mind nor my body was functioning well. And yet, something was left. I wanted to know what it was that was left. I.e., if I'm not my thoughts, feelings, perceptions, and sensations, then what the hell am I?

 

This started me down a path that I remain on all these years later. I am not the person I was pre-withdrawal, and I'm immensely grateful for that.

 

I tried talking about this early on to a number of people, but it's near-impossible to find the words for it, and I think most people dismiss it as woo-woo nonsense, which I completely understand, since I used to do the same thing. In any case, almost everything you said resonates with me, so I thought I'd weigh in. Namaste.

Has anyone gone through a whole new level of thinking while in withdrawals? Good nor Bad?  And ever had some sort of sixth sense that makes you acutely aware of everything in the world and what is going on around you, and sometime becomes disturbed because of this?  IDK maybe I'm out on a wimb but it seems like the D/T and D/R symptoms are somehow related to pressure on the pineal gland which is temporary for us.

 

Yes, I went through a profound shift in consciousness during the withdrawal process. For me, depersonalization/derealization played a key role, in that I realized as a result that my acceptance of an objective reality was in fact based on entirely subjective perceptions (thoughts, feelings, sensations, etc.), and that those perceptions were in fact readily malleable and hence, unstable and unreliable.

 

At the time, I felt that I had more or less lost myself completely. Neither my mind nor my body was functioning well. And yet, something was left. I wanted to know what it was that was left. I.e., if I'm not my thoughts, feelings, perceptions, and sensations, then what the hell am I?

 

This started me down a path that I remain on all these years later. I am not the person I was pre-withdrawal, and I'm immensely grateful for that.

 

I tried talking about this early on to a number of people, but it's near-impossible to find the words for it, and I think most people dismiss it as woo-woo nonsense, which I completely understand, since I used to do the same thing. In any case, almost everything you said resonates with me, so I thought I'd weigh in. Namaste.

Hey, I really can relate to everything you're talking about. Have you heard of synchronicity? I have this hunch that you may be experiencing synchronicity, whether you know it yet or not. I have found a lot of validation for my experience in Daoism and to a lesser extent in Buddhism but also in exploring the world of Jungian psychology. I have changed. I feel like a channel has opened up. I feel like I am growing into myself. There's this new me and I can't always predict what sorts of reactions I might get.

 

I don't know how it happened but sometimes everything is just perfectly clear, no fog. I have a radar for people who are similarly minded. People who "get it". But I don't think it's the done thing to point this out, or emphasise it. But I don't think it's about elevating myself above others. I think it's other people who assume that if what I say is true then I must be better... I don't want to assume so I give the benefit of any doubt. I am going through something, rebuilding. Part medical emergency, part spiritual journey.

 

Anyway, I'm happy for anybody on a similar path and those are my recommendations to perhaps see some vivid perspectives on the sort of states of consciousness you're experiencing. It's alright to be happy when you feel it, even if sometimes you may get the sense that your emotions are out of step with your environment. Life is fascinating and worth looking at, inside and out. 

The 5 senses can only perceive a very small part of reality. Even theoretical scientists know this. We only see a small fraction of the light spectrum. Even science is limited by the observer being unable to perceive all there is. Also, the observer cannot know that which is incomprehensible to his current state of awareness/mind/mentality. I wonder if it was the benzo withdrawals, I also wanted to know my true nature. Thank you for saying this, this is a very positive way to look at benzo withdrawals. 

 

Thank you for your response.

 

Eckhart Tolle frequently talks about how it isn’t necessary to suffer in order to awaken, but that’s what it takes for most of us. And I have a long, unfortunate history of having to learn absolutely everything the hard way, so it’s no surprise, really, that it took benzo withdrawal to reach me. I feel like benzo withdrawal was my “dark night of the soul,” and I reckon I had to plunge that far down to get the buoyancy I needed. 

 

Tolle puts it better than I ever could: “Sometimes people need to experience acute suffering before the thinking and the awareness of the consciousness separate. People then realize there is another dimension in them that is not thinking but the ability to be aware of thinking. It is not emotion but the ability to be aware of emotion.”

 

Hey, I really can relate to everything you're talking about. Have you heard of synchronicity? I have this hunch that you may be experiencing synchronicity, whether you know it yet or not. I have found a lot of validation for my experience in Daoism and to a lesser extent in Buddhism but also in exploring the world of Jungian psychology. I have changed. I feel like a channel has opened up. I feel like I am growing into myself. There's this new me and I can't always predict what sorts of reactions I might get.

 

I don't know how it happened but sometimes everything is just perfectly clear, no fog. I have a radar for people who are similarly minded. People who "get it". But I don't think it's the done thing to point this out, or emphasise it. But I don't think it's about elevating myself above others. I think it's other people who assume that if what I say is true then I must be better... I don't want to assume so I give the benefit of any doubt. I am going through something, rebuilding. Part medical emergency, part spiritual journey.

 

Anyway, I'm happy for anybody on a similar path and those are my recommendations to perhaps see some vivid perspectives on the sort of states of consciousness you're experiencing. It's alright to be happy when you feel it, even if sometimes you may get the sense that your emotions are out of step with your environment. Life is fascinating and worth looking at, inside and out. 

 

Yes, I’ve heard of synchronicity. In fact, when I first experienced the shift, it was as if the floodgates opened on synchronicity, and it made me feel such joy—as if I was getting these little, encouraging messages throughout the day. Those lessened a lot as time went on, but they still happen. I had a few lucid dreams in the beginning, too. Have you had those?

 

The Dao resonates most strongly with me, too, though I’m learning a lot from Buddhism and Hinduism, as well. What strikes me again and again, though, is that the mystics in every religion and philosophy agree about the big stuff, and I see this as an important clue.

 

Thanks so much for taking the time to comment. 

 

Hey, I really can relate to everything you're talking about. Have you heard of synchronicity? I have this hunch that you may be experiencing synchronicity, whether you know it yet or not. I have found a lot of validation for my experience in Daoism and to a lesser extent in Buddhism but also in exploring the world of Jungian psychology. I have changed. I feel like a channel has opened up. I feel like I am growing into myself. There's this new me and I can't always predict what sorts of reactions I might get.

 

I don't know how it happened but sometimes everything is just perfectly clear, no fog. I have a radar for people who are similarly minded. People who "get it". But I don't think it's the done thing to point this out, or emphasise it. But I don't think it's about elevating myself above others. I think it's other people who assume that if what I say is true then I must be better... I don't want to assume so I give the benefit of any doubt. I am going through something, rebuilding. Part medical emergency, part spiritual journey.

 

Anyway, I'm happy for anybody on a similar path and those are my recommendations to perhaps see some vivid perspectives on the sort of states of consciousness you're experiencing. It's alright to be happy when you feel it, even if sometimes you may get the sense that your emotions are out of step with your environment. Life is fascinating and worth looking at, inside and out. 

 

Yes, I’ve heard of synchronicity. In fact, when I first experienced the shift, it was as if the floodgates opened on synchronicity, and it made me feel such joy—as if I was getting these little, encouraging messages throughout the day. Those lessened a lot as time went on, but they still happen. I had a few lucid dreams in the beginning, too. Have you had those?

 

The Dao resonates most strongly with me, too, though I’m learning a lot from Buddhism and Hinduism, as well. What strikes me again and again, though, is that the mystics in every religion and philosophy agree about the big stuff, and I see this as an important clue.

 

Thanks so much for taking the time to comment. 

This so much! I haven't gone deep into the world of mysticism but I am well familiar with the observation that great thinkers say the same thing in different ways.

 

It really is my pleasure to comment. I should say thanks for taking the time to reply, because it is really helpful to hear from somebody who has found a similar path. I'm interested in when this started for you? In hindsight, I have throughout my life experienced synchronicity but never thought much of it. The floodgates opened in early 2018 while I was doing an audit of my beliefs about myself (best way I can put it). I was sick with tolerance symptoms from the benzo and my life was falling apart. I went pretty crazy amongst it all but at that time I just about held things together. I had a lot of synchronicity but still was unaware of what it was and since it was too much. I had a mild psychosis which I somehow kept under wraps. The people around me knew I wasn't very well and hadn't been for some time. I managed to put the lid back on before anybody saw that I was falling apart. But I wasn't looking after myself well and was getting myself into bother with manic/erratic behaviour. Got into debt with impulsive decisions. Put a target on my back at work by being way too open and way too close to the bone describing things I didn't like. All the while, I was digging into my psyche, knowing the risks of what I was doing but doing it anyway. I was using substances at times, as part of the digging.

 

In hindsight, I was breaking myself down into many small chunks in so many different ways. So it was no surprise when I really did snap in early 2019. I'd had a period of depression and holing myself up, still always examining myself. The period of depression came after the mania. Then again, I became frantic and not looking after myself including not getting enough sleep. I felt like I was finding everything out all at once. It was so thrilling and exciting but I was truly a mess. My whole life fell apart, it was brutal. I lost my job and had to move back to my parents. Autism runs in my family and the lack of empathy to go round could have killed me. The only way I can still talk to my dad is because I know that if he was capable of reading the pain and understanding the complexity and severity of my condition, then he wouldn't have been able to do what he did. He's old fashioned and thought that tough love was what he was supposed to prescribe. He confused the hell out of me. I describe it like this. My old worldview was smashed into pieces like as if dropping a 3D jigsaw of the globe on the floor... then as I was picking them up, my dad was treading on my hands and trying to put pieces back together for me in entirely the wrong order.

 

Somehow, I have been able to get it back together. Life is wonderful and people are amazing.

 

I know that I am open and I am not asking anybody to be as open as this... but I am wondering if you can summarise your journey? Also, do you feel a sense of power/responsibility? I know it's weird but I find that I am seeing things clearly and can be a powerful influence on the people around me. I have always had good intuition but that has been dialled up even further and it can be a lot to handle. I assume this will settle down over time. For now, I have to manage it, which sometimes makes me feel like I am doing less than I should in service of others. I know that I need to properly dedicate myself to my health, to set a platform for the rest of my life, because then I will be in the best position to effectively help/heal people. But I still feel guilty. Then I feel guilty on the occasions when I think I am being too pushy in trying to help, too  . At the same time, I want to talk to people I know about this stuff we're talking about now, but I hold back because I caused people who know me well to become concerned with me. I am just getting to where I have opened up a little about the spiritual stuff to a good friend and a relative. It's not that I am terribly concerned with negative judgement, I just don't want to be misunderstood. I think that people who have had an experience of awakening, understand that there is no contradiction between the psychological disturbances I have had and my characterisation of this as spiritual awakening.

 

Thanks for listening. I think I am going to read some Eckhart Tolle. I have seen him speak and as you could guess, it resonates. I have been a little shy about diving deep into spiritualism/mysticism because I always want to have a good look for myself before gaining too many clues and too much of a steer from others. I tend to pick up a book when I reach a dead end, or when life seems bland and lacking synchronicity.

This so much! I haven't gone deep into the world of mysticism but I am well familiar with the observation that great thinkers say the same thing in different ways.

 

It really is my pleasure to comment. I should say thanks for taking the time to reply, because it is really helpful to hear from somebody who has found a similar path. I'm interested in when this started for you? In hindsight, I have throughout my life experienced synchronicity but never thought much of it. The floodgates opened in early 2018 while I was doing an audit of my beliefs about myself (best way I can put it). I was sick with tolerance symptoms from the benzo and my life was falling apart. I went pretty crazy amongst it all but at that time I just about held things together. I had a lot of synchronicity but still was unaware of what it was and since it was too much. I had a mild psychosis which I somehow kept under wraps. The people around me knew I wasn't very well and hadn't been for some time. I managed to put the lid back on before anybody saw that I was falling apart. But I wasn't looking after myself well and was getting myself into bother with manic/erratic behaviour. Got into debt with impulsive decisions. Put a target on my back at work by being way too open and way too close to the bone describing things I didn't like. All the while, I was digging into my psyche, knowing the risks of what I was doing but doing it anyway. I was using substances at times, as part of the digging.

 

In hindsight, I was breaking myself down into many small chunks in so many different ways. So it was no surprise when I really did snap in early 2019. I'd had a period of depression and holing myself up, still always examining myself. The period of depression came after the mania. Then again, I became frantic and not looking after myself including not getting enough sleep. I felt like I was finding everything out all at once. It was so thrilling and exciting but I was truly a mess. My whole life fell apart, it was brutal. I lost my job and had to move back to my parents. Autism runs in my family and the lack of empathy to go round could have killed me. The only way I can still talk to my dad is because I know that if he was capable of reading the pain and understanding the complexity and severity of my condition, then he wouldn't have been able to do what he did. He's old fashioned and thought that tough love was what he was supposed to prescribe. He confused the hell out of me. I describe it like this. My old worldview was smashed into pieces like as if dropping a 3D jigsaw of the globe on the floor... then as I was picking them up, my dad was treading on my hands and trying to put pieces back together for me in entirely the wrong order.

 

Somehow, I have been able to get it back together. Life is wonderful and people are amazing.

 

I know that I am open and I am not asking anybody to be as open as this... but I am wondering if you can summarise your journey? Also, do you feel a sense of power/responsibility? I know it's weird but I find that I am seeing things clearly and can be a powerful influence on the people around me. I have always had good intuition but that has been dialled up even further and it can be a lot to handle. I assume this will settle down over time. For now, I have to manage it, which sometimes makes me feel like I am doing less than I should in service of others. I know that I need to properly dedicate myself to my health, to set a platform for the rest of my life, because then I will be in the best position to effectively help/heal people. But I still feel guilty. Then I feel guilty on the occasions when I think I am being too pushy in trying to help, too  . At the same time, I want to talk to people I know about this stuff we're talking about now, but I hold back because I caused people who know me well to become concerned with me. I am just getting to where I have opened up a little about the spiritual stuff to a good friend and a relative. It's not that I am terribly concerned with negative judgement, I just don't want to be misunderstood. I think that people who have had an experience of awakening, understand that there is no contradiction between the psychological disturbances I have had and my characterisation of this as spiritual awakening.

 

Thanks for listening. I think I am going to read some Eckhart Tolle. I have seen him speak and as you could guess, it resonates. I have been a little shy about diving deep into spiritualism/mysticism because I always want to have a good look for myself before gaining too many clues and too much of a steer from others. I tend to pick up a book when I reach a dead end, or when life seems bland and lacking synchronicity.

 

You've been through a lot of turmoil and pain, but where you might have emerged from it with bitterness, you have instead emerged with love and light. That's a wonderful thing.

 

My path has similar twists and turns, and I rejected outright many attempts to set me right. Many years ago, a friend of mine got heavily into Eckhart Tolle, and she bought me several of his books. I read the first few pages of one, declared it a load of hogwash, and threw the books in the garbage. Years later, he came up again in a different context, and once again, I dismissed him as a charlatan. Years later still, in the throes of withdrawal and in the darkest place of my life, I read an article about how keeping a daily list of five things you're grateful for is more effective at alleviating depression than either medication or therapy. I was desperate enough at that point to try anything, so without a shred of faith in it, I started to keep a gratitude list. I was sure I'd run out of things to be grateful for by day three, but instead, I began to see more and more things I was grateful for. Not only did I never run out, I realized I never would, or could. That was the first big shift--not in spirit, but in thinking. That, combined with the wackiness of depersonalization/derealization, made it obvious to me in an experiential way that it wasn't what we see, but how.

 

So I read Tolle again, and this time, it was one eureka moment after another. I couldn't get enough. I started to watch his videos, along with those of Rupert Spira, Alan Watts, Adyashanti, Gangaji, Tara Brach, and so on. And at some point, it clicked. At first, I couldn't stop laughing. That was my response, lol. I woke up giggling, despite still being quite ill. The illness didn't matter to me anymore, because it all seemed like just a little story I was telling myself, anyway....

 

At first I told everyone I knew about it, but it became clear very quickly that that wasn't going anywhere. First of all, I'm sure I sounded insane (hah!), and second, it always ended with their version of tossing the Tolle books in the trash. So no, I don't feel a responsibility to influence others beyond a sort of quiet way of living my life. There aren't words for this, really, anyhow. I.e., the Tao that can be told isn't the eternal Tao.

 

 

P.S. Reading this back, it makes it sound as if I've arrived somewhere. I haven't. This is just a loose account of the beginning. It's a practice, and I'm still practicing.

I think my sense of responsibility comes from having vulnerable people around me. My older brother has autism, then my little sister came along when I was 8 years old and I just thought she was amazing. I taught her to roll, crawl and walk. I remember when I first read a pamphlet on autism and understood the implications. My parents had children young, before they ever grew up. My dad never did grow up. He has the emotional maturity of a mature teenager, perhaps, but is nevertheless very intelligent in other ways. It's not just me that sees the autism in him. I think this complicated set of affairs is what instilled me with a sense of needing to know what life is really all about. I am not saying that everybody should have these feelings of intense responsibility, I am working through them, was just curious if you could relate is all. 

 

Yes, it doesn't translate well into words. It's sort of hard wired into me to enjoy trying to find them, though. It is my nature to be open and I have accumulated friends that presumably are OK with that, although obviously the content of what I might say has changed somewhat. I think where I am headed is that I'll talk about it to anybody if it feels right. If I have a hunch. I'm not too bothered if I get some funny looks. I'm not going to try and make somebody uncomfortable and I think I know where the line is, so I'll go for it. I relate it to cognitive quirks that I have picked up. The friend that I told, we have a good bond and he'll indulge me a little if I insist it's important. So I told him about how my memory works differently and seems more accurate. I recited pi (=3.1415926535897932384626433832...  ) to 100 digits and explained to him that I didn't spend a lot of time memorising and I only did it to prove to myself that my memory is as good as I think. Then I told him a couple of anecdotes and it was quite cool because one featured the numbers 8 and 25 repeating. We paused the conversation as we were paying for food and then I pulled out my phone to check the time, as it would influence our next move. Of course, the time was 8:25pm. It was nice, because I was able to get across that this was normal and it's not like I am chasing these things. Just this is how my life goes sometimes, and I could give him a sense of scale by explaining that this occurrence was run of the mill compared to some almost magical occurrences.

 

I think things will settle more for me as I continue to heal. This extreme tendency towards divergent thinking is at least partly a product of a pathology that mimics ADHD. It's benzo withdrawal, and I have had this much worse. My attention span and ability to concentrate are gradually improving, but I am not completely there. I think this will see a blunting of the edges, which will be welcome. I was seeing chakrahs (as flashing lights) a little too frequently for comfort but not so much now. I see them when I am engaged in a spiritual practice, such as my breath work. That's fine.

 

I'm going to be honest, I am not at all satisfied that what I write comes close to the essence of the experience. However, I am not always a good judge of these matters, so maybe I get something of it across. I could have written that in so many different ways and none of them would seem satisfactory. It's because it's not a narrative. Sounds like you find it similarly elusive but without the same drive to correct it. I really do enjoy sometimes trying to explain the unexplainable. Nice to talk to you. 

I think my sense of responsibility comes from having vulnerable people around me. My older brother has autism, then my little sister came along when I was 8 years old and I just thought she was amazing. I taught her to roll, crawl and walk. I remember when I first read a pamphlet on autism and understood the implications. My parents had children young, before they ever grew up. My dad never did grow up. He has the emotional maturity of a mature teenager, perhaps, but is nevertheless very intelligent in other ways. It's not just me that sees the autism in him. I think this complicated set of affairs is what instilled me with a sense of needing to know what life is really all about. I am not saying that everybody should have these feelings of intense responsibility, I am working through them, was just curious if you could relate is all. 

 

Yes, it doesn't translate well into words. It's sort of hard wired into me to enjoy trying to find them, though. It is my nature to be open and I have accumulated friends that presumably are OK with that, although obviously the content of what I might say has changed somewhat. I think where I am headed is that I'll talk about it to anybody if it feels right. If I have a hunch. I'm not too bothered if I get some funny looks. I'm not going to try and make somebody uncomfortable and I think I know where the line is, so I'll go for it. I relate it to cognitive quirks that I have picked up. The friend that I told, we have a good bond and he'll indulge me a little if I insist it's important. So I told him about how my memory works differently and seems more accurate. I recited pi (=3.1415926535897932384626433832...  ) to 100 digits and explained to him that I didn't spend a lot of time memorising and I only did it to prove to myself that my memory is as good as I think. Then I told him a couple of anecdotes and it was quite cool because one featured the numbers 8 and 25 repeating. We paused the conversation as we were paying for food and then I pulled out my phone to check the time, as it would influence our next move. Of course, the time was 8:25pm. It was nice, because I was able to get across that this was normal and it's not like I am chasing these things. Just this is how my life goes sometimes, and I could give him a sense of scale by explaining that this occurrence was run of the mill compared to some almost magical occurrences.

 

I think things will settle more for me as I continue to heal. This extreme tendency towards divergent thinking is at least partly a product of a pathology that mimics ADHD. It's benzo withdrawal, and I have had this much worse. My attention span and ability to concentrate are gradually improving, but I am not completely there. I think this will see a blunting of the edges, which will be welcome. I was seeing chakrahs (as flashing lights) a little too frequently for comfort but not so much now. I see them when I am engaged in a spiritual practice, such as my breath work. That's fine.

 

I'm going to be honest, I am not at all satisfied that what I write comes close to the essence of the experience. However, I am not always a good judge of these matters, so maybe I get something of it across. I could have written that in so many different ways and none of them would seem satisfactory. It's because it's not a narrative. Sounds like you find it similarly elusive but without the same drive to correct it. I really do enjoy sometimes trying to explain the unexplainable. Nice to talk to you. 

 

I've always believed we have a deep, abiding responsibility to each other and to all life on the planet. But for me, for many years, this translated into a lot of distress and anxiety. I felt constantly that I should be doing something, doing more. I worried a lot. I continue to struggle with it, but I've come to see that much of what I thought I was doing to help others was actually just me upholding my own, egoic view of myself as a helper/caretaker. It was tough to realize that and admit it to myself, but it's the truth. So I have a tricky relationship with my sense of responsibility. It's all tangled up for me with some toxic coping mechanisms, I think, but I have yet to reach any firm conclusions about it.

 

Here's an interesting, 9-minute Tolle talk about responsibility if you're inclined:

 

Certainly inclined, and it helped as a matter of fact. 

 

I am already taking responsibility now and if I know myself well, I'll take responsibility in the future. What I have been struggling with is the difference between how much responsibility I should shoulder now versus what I want to take on when I can consider myself out the woods with BWS. For better and for worse, patience does not come to me naturally.

 

I'm glad you shared your progression. What you said you'd always felt, is perhaps a little newer to me. My innate sense of responsibility was hijacked by the system of work. I didn't really know what to do with my life except try and figure it out as I went along, so I got sucked into progressing in an unsuitable career and accumulating money, for want of a better plan. Now I feel that deep responsibility and while that is good, I recognise the potential for toxicity if it's not handled properly. My life and relationships are undoubtedly complex. I've thought about it a lot and I know that the things I have going on are unusual by any reasonable measure. So it's just about finding people to talk it out with, taking on the best influences. That way, I can keep a healthy perspective. I don't need to figure everything out right now and in fact I should try too hard. It always comes back to that with me. 

 

It has been nice to chat and I am glad you seem to be on a good path.

Certainly inclined, and it helped as a matter of fact. 

 

I am already taking responsibility now and if I know myself well, I'll take responsibility in the future. What I have been struggling with is the difference between how much responsibility I should shoulder now versus what I want to take on when I can consider myself out the woods with BWS. For better and for worse, patience does not come to me naturally.

 

I'm glad you shared your progression. What you said you'd always felt, is perhaps a little newer to me. My innate sense of responsibility was hijacked by the system of work. I didn't really know what to do with my life except try and figure it out as I went along, so I got sucked into progressing in an unsuitable career and accumulating money, for want of a better plan. Now I feel that deep responsibility and while that is good, I recognise the potential for toxicity if it's not handled properly. My life and relationships are undoubtedly complex. I've thought about it a lot and I know that the things I have going on are unusual by any reasonable measure. So it's just about finding people to talk it out with, taking on the best influences. That way, I can keep a healthy perspective. I don't need to figure everything out right now and in fact I should try too hard. It always comes back to that with me. 

 

It has been nice to chat and I am glad you seem to be on a good path.

 

Nice chatting with you, as well, and thanks again for taking the time.