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How best to get stable/taper from where I am now?

 

Hi, it is me, back like a bad penny!

 

I'd like recommendations on what to do and how to do it, pls.

 

I was/am on benzos 40 years, approx.  Pre-existing sleep probs including circadian rhythm disorder (sig).  Was tapering uneventfully off klon when took mirtazapine and my nervous system just fell apart.  Was pushed into acute, bedridden, major gut issues, sweats, awful psych and physical probs.

 

I am looking to get functional.  If cannot get functional then may as well keep coming off benzos. But have zero support and it has been over 2 1/2 years, am old, and need to et functional.  Don't know what I will do if not.

 

Dr. has said need to get stable rather than taper- but he does not know what to do with me, and says tapering does not work for everyone.

 

Currently on .03 klonopin by weight (1.71mg is .5 mg tablet).  Is that .8 mg klon?

Also on .13 valium by weight (1.69 g is 2 mg tab).Is that 1.75 mg valium?

Also on 2/3 of an ambien.

 

Could I just stop the klonopin, or valium?

I had crossed onto all valium but was so depressed was suggested I might cross back, but I only made it halfway, and here I am.

 

My main prob is sleep.  But now have agoraphobia and driving phobia (I had some of that before but not like this).

 

I cannot take antidepressants.  I can only rarely take antihistamines as they dry me out terribly.  Thus is a problem to sleep, and if I do not get some, I know cannot get off these meds.

 

Not much luck, but a little help, with supplements or thc.

 

That I went into acute on introduction, then stop of mirtazapine I realize is not usual, and has made me a really hard case.  Hoping for some guidance.

 

thx

 

 

 

 

 

 

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How best to get stable/taper from where I am now?

 

Hi, it is me, back like a bad penny!

 

I'd like recommendations on what to do and how to do it, pls.

 

I was/am on benzos 40 years, approx.  Pre-existing sleep probs including circadian rhythm disorder (sig).  Was tapering uneventfully off klon when took mirtazapine and my nervous system just fell apart.  Was pushed into acute, bedridden, major gut issues, sweats, awful psych and physical probs.

 

I am looking to get functional.  If cannot get functional then may as well keep coming off benzos. But have zero support and it has been over 2 1/2 years, am old, and need to et functional.  Don't know what I will do if not.

 

Dr. has said need to get stable rather than taper- but he does not know what to do with me, and says tapering does not work for everyone.

 

Currently on .03 klonopin by weight (1.71mg is .5 mg tablet).  Is that .8 mg klon?

Also on .13 valium by weight (1.69 g is 2 mg tab).Is that 1.75 mg valium?

Also on 2/3 of an ambien.

 

Could I just stop the klonopin, or valium?

I had crossed onto all valium but was so depressed was suggested I might cross back, but I only made it halfway, and here I am.

 

My main prob is sleep.  But now have agoraphobia and driving phobia (I had some of that before but not like this).

 

I cannot take antidepressants.  I can only rarely take antihistamines as they dry me out terribly.  Thus is a problem to sleep, and if I do not get some, I know cannot get off these meds.

 

Not much luck, but a little help, with supplements or thc.

 

That I went into acute on introduction, then stop of mirtazapine I realize is not usual, and has made me a really hard case.  Hoping for some guidance.

 

thx

 

Are you dry tapering? Sounds like you may be. My 1mg klonopin pill weighs around .171g.. Are you saying yours .50 weighs 1.71mg? Did you mean .171g? Are you taking .03g in weight of klonopin?

 

Same question for the valium, I do not have any valium but you are saying it weighs 1.69g  for 2mg and you are taking .13g in weight? Did you mean .169 ?

 

want to confirm the weight of what you're taking before I try and give any input that could be wrong

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How best to get stable/taper from where I am now?

 

Hi, it is me, back like a bad penny!

 

Currently on .03 klonopin by weight (1.71mg is .5 mg tablet).  Is that .8 mg klon?

Also on .13 valium by weight (1.69 g is 2 mg tab).Is that 1.75 mg valium?

Also on 2/3 of an ambien.

 

 

I don't think anyone thinks that you are a bad penny.  It's just that the way you describe your mix of medications makes it hard to understand the amounts that you are taking.

 

I am not sure how you would be on .8 mg of Klonopin when you are cutting from a .5 mg tablet.

 

I am not trying to criticize you, just hoping that you can clarify it better so that the people here might be able to assist you.

 

Do you mean that you are on .8mg of Klonopin and 1.75 mg of Valium?

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How best to get stable/taper from where I am now?

 

Hi, it is me, back like a bad penny!

 

I'd like recommendations on what to do and how to do it, pls.

 

I was/am on benzos 40 years, approx.  Pre-existing sleep probs including circadian rhythm disorder (sig).  Was tapering uneventfully off klon when took mirtazapine and my nervous system just fell apart.  Was pushed into acute, bedridden, major gut issues, sweats, awful psych and physical probs.

 

I am looking to get functional.  If cannot get functional then may as well keep coming off benzos. But have zero support and it has been over 2 1/2 years, am old, and need to et functional.  Don't know what I will do if not.

 

Dr. has said need to get stable rather than taper- but he does not know what to do with me, and says tapering does not work for everyone.

 

Currently on .03 klonopin by weight (1.71mg is .5 mg tablet).  Is that .8 mg klon?

Also on .13 valium by weight (1.69 g is 2 mg tab).Is that 1.75 mg valium?

Also on 2/3 of an ambien.

 

Could I just stop the klonopin, or valium?

I had crossed onto all valium but was so depressed was suggested I might cross back, but I only made it halfway, and here I am.

 

My main prob is sleep.  But now have agoraphobia and driving phobia (I had some of that before but not like this).

 

I cannot take antidepressants.  I can only rarely take antihistamines as they dry me out terribly.  Thus is a problem to sleep, and if I do not get some, I know cannot get off these meds.

 

Not much luck, but a little help, with supplements or thc.

 

That I went into acute on introduction, then stop of mirtazapine I realize is not usual, and has made me a really hard case.  Hoping for some guidance.

 

thx

 

Are you dry tapering? Sounds like you may be. My 1mg klonopin pill weighs around .171g.. Are you saying yours .50 weighs 1.71mg? Did you mean .171g? Are you taking .03g in weight of klonopin?

 

Same question for the valium, I do not have any valium but you are saying it weighs 1.69g  for 2mg and you are taking .13g in weight? Did you mean .169 ?

 

want to confirm the weight of what you're taking before I try and give any input that could be wrong

 

Wowsers,

 

Yes, dry taper.  And yes you are right.

 

>>Did you mean .171g? Are you taking .03g in weight of klonopin?

 

Same question for the valium, I do not have any valium but you are saying it weighs 1.69g  for 2mg and you are taking .13g in weight? Did you mean .169 ?<<

 

So entire pill weighs .171;  and .169. 

 

Guess otherwise they would be huge, huh?

 

Thanks!

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How best to get stable/taper from where I am now?

 

Hi, it is me, back like a bad penny!

 

Currently on .03 klonopin by weight (1.71mg is .5 mg tablet).  Is that .8 mg klon?

Also on .13 valium by weight (1.69 g is 2 mg tab).Is that 1.75 mg valium?

Also on 2/3 of an ambien.

 

 

I don't think anyone thinks that you are a bad penny.  It's just that the way you describe your mix of medications makes it hard to understand the amounts that you are taking.

 

I am not sure how you would be on .8 mg of Klonopin when you are cutting from a .5 mg tablet.

 

I am not trying to criticize you, just hoping that you can clarify it better so that the people here might be able to assist you.

 

Do you mean that you are on .8mg of Klonopin and 1.75 mg of Valium?

 

Yes, am thinking this is .8 mg of klon and 1.75 of valium, or maybe less??

 

Wowser is right... the tabs are .171 or .169 total weight and am taking most of the 2 mg valium, and little corner of the .5 clon., if that makes sense...  now my calculation of the amount of mg I am taking each day I may have miscalculated.

 

I think *I* am the 'confuseduser" here, hehe.

 

Good name!

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BarbaraAve, Here is the information that I think we need.  If you could fill in the blanks it would be very helpful. 

 

I am taking a valium pill that is listed as being ____ milligrams.  A full pill weighs  _____ grams/or whatever method of weight you are using. 

I am taking  ____ grams/or whatever method of weight you are using a day.

 

I am taking an Ativan pill that is listed as being ____ milligrams.  A full pill weighs  ____ grams/or whatever method of weight you are using.

I am taking  ____ grams/or whatever method of weight you are using a day.

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Yeah the weight of what you’re taking is important because .03 grams of .169 would be .03/.169 =.1775% and multiplying that by the .50 dose would be .09 or so mg of K.. which would be .09mg klonopin... Rough estimate to 1.3mg of Valium.. many people jump at .03 or so of klonopin . So you would be almost there..

 

The Valium .13/.169 = 1.54mg of Valium. Would be your dose. I believe that is what your situation is . Let me know if that sounds correct.

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I believe many people jump off around .5mg of diazepam.. if you had problems crossing over, you may want to try and get off one or the other first. But it looks like, it I’m correct your doses are low and you don’t have a very long way in term of dosage goes to finish  :thumbsup: but I am

Not really familiar with crossing over so maybe someone else can have a better input . I think the substitution taper forums talk a little more in the cross over aspects. May have some insight on it!

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... many people jump at .3 or so of klonopin ...

Hmm ... that sounds high to me.  The suggestions I’ve seen here on BB for a jump dose for Klonopin/clonazepam range from 0.05mg to 0.025mg and even lower (e.g. one Buddie jumped at 0.001mg).  I believe Jim Hawk used 0.025mg as the jump dose in his online taper tool.

 

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... many people jump at .3 or so of klonopin ...

Hmm ... that sounds high to me.  The suggestions I’ve seen here on BB for a jump dose for Klonopin/clonazepam range from 0.05mg to 0.025mg and even lower (e.g. one Buddie jumped at 0.001mg).  I believe Jim Hawk used 0.025mg as the jump dose in his online taper tool.

 

You  are correct . I meant .03. I’ll modify so it doesn’t show ! Good catch

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... many people jump at .3 or so of klonopin ...

Hmm ... that sounds high to me.  The suggestions I’ve seen here on BB for a jump dose for Klonopin/clonazepam range from 0.05mg to 0.025mg and even lower (e.g. one Buddie jumped at 0.001mg).  I believe Jim Hawk used 0.025mg as the jump dose in his online taper tool.

You  are correct . I meant .03. I’ll modify so it doesn’t show ! Good catch

Thanks for the clarification and the edit!

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>>Yeah the weight of what you’re taking is important because .03 grams of .169 would be .03/.169 =.1775% and multiplying that by the .50 dose would be .09 or so mg of K.. which would be .09mg klonopin... Rough estimate to 1.3mg of Valium.. many people jump at .03 or so of klonopin . So you would be almost there..

 

The Valium .13/.169 = 1.54mg of Valium. Would be your dose. I believe that is what your situation is . Let me know if that sounds correct.<<

 

---

OK, it is .03 g of .171 (weight) which is the Klonopin, and that is a .5mg pill.  So I guess am on slightly more klon than you think, right?

 

And it is .13 of .169 valium, the 2 mg pill.

 

Does this make sense?  Or have I screwed it up again?  I used to be good at math...  not now! 

 

I got over to valium, ok, but then such deep deep depression could not stand it.  So was going back to klon.  But my decision making ability seems to have gone out hte window in all of this... don't know what happened to my 'follow through.'  So, here I am on bits of stuff. 

 

We are not talking the ambien here.. which is about 3/4 of a 10 mg.  Gee can you tell my problem was/is insomnia + sleep disorder?  Pretty obvious...

 

I tend to take the klon during the day and the rest at night... not that it is enough to make me sleep.  It isn't.

 

Thanks for the help!

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The Valium .13/.169 = 1.54mg of Valium. Would be your dose. I believe that is what your situation is . Let me know if that sounds correct.<<

 

---

OK, it is .03 g of .171 (weight) which is the Klonopin, and that is a .5mg pill.  So I guess am on slightly more klon than you think, right?

 

And it is .13 of .169 valium, the 2 mg pill.  + about 1.54 mg of valium

 

Does this make sense?  Or have I screwed it up again?  I used to be good at math...  not now!

 

The Klonopin dose that you are on is about the equivalent of 3.5 mg of valium: .03 g divided by .171 then multiplied by 20 to figure out the valium equivalent for crossover purposes.

 

"And it is .13 of .169 valium, the 2 mg pill" = about 1.54 mg of valium.

 

That puts you on a total of about 5.5 mg of valium per day, not counting the Ambien.

 

I would leave the Ambien for last to taper off of.

 

How long have you been holding at this level?

 

Also, how do you cut the medicines that you take?  Do you crush the pills and weigh the amounts?

 

I think I remember that you mentioned that you tried crossing over to valium but it made you too depressed so you went back to Klonopin.  I don't want to be prescriptive or disregard anything about your condition, but valium is easier to taper off because it has a longer half life and because since you are taking a larger dose of it to equal the amount of Klonopin, you can taper off it by smaller amounts, which makes the reductions easier.

 

Normally I would say to consider gradually transitioning over to liquid valium diluted with water at a ratio of 1 ml liquid valium to 9 ml of water, and then tapering very slowly. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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