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variable solubility/amt of fillers from pill to pill using same solvent


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this is really odd...

 

yesterday i began my liquid solution of clonazepam, and i dropped 2 of my 0.5mg pills  (ACCORD this time around  ::) ) into a cup and then squeezed 1ml of 190 proof alcohol onto the pills and waited. those lil buggers just sat there, only the orange outer part dissolved. ok so i thought, i'll just swish it around a lil bit, nothing else happened...ok i'll poke the pills with a dental pick, they began to split into large chunks, but still not "dissolving" as i'd read they do in a few seconds or  less than a minute. anyways i finally got them to dissolve after more than 5 minutes and added the 9ml of water and then did my 1 cup and 3 daily doses from the 1 cup.

 

today i used 2 same exact pills from the same RX bottle and same generic ACCORD brand and repeated the 1ml of 190 proof alcohol and they dissolved in seconds!

 

what in the world?

 

i guess the pharmacist was right when she said that the benzos vary so much from pill to pill even in the same batch, the same bottle...the fillers and API are not evenly distributed and even in "splittable" pills like my 0.5mg's are, they are not even and vary from pill to pill. so say the first 2 pills i tried dissolving had more of some excipient ingredient, binder or filler than the 2 pills from today...then that could account for their resiistance to dissolving. maybe. lol i just thought i'd report on my experience.

 

oh, another thing,

after my first liquid dose of clonazepam using alcohol as a solvent in a 1:1:9 ratio...i felt like i had a hangover this morning complete with sensitivity to noise and light!

i tried to sleep it off but was irritable and unable to get back to a good sleep. had strange dreams but not nightmares.

 

so yes, to my surprise, i found out first hand that those people reporting feeling the switch from pills to liquid solutions, even after one single dose, even without reducing/cutting the dose, well...they were right! it is possible and it happened to me. i feel a lil embarassed because i thought it wasn't possible, blew it off as if they just had ramped up anxiety/anticipation of a bad reaction. but i took my dose yesterday and went to be not worried about anything at all. i was so sure of myself haha anyways, i'm fine, just a little manic today. at least i got the kitchen cleaned up when my hangover passed.  :)

 

 

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Thanks for adding your experience to the mix... :)

 

One thing I wondered was if a rotary press was used and uncalibrated “punches” caused different pill densities..??

Gawd, the things we have to worry about..!!

 

Hope your back on track in no time..

:)

 

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Please remember that only a tiny amount of you tablet (less than 1%) is actually the active ingredient, clonazepam.  Some of the inactive ingredients will vary in solubility, but the active ingredient, clonazepam, is absolutely soluble.

 

As long as the tablet breaks down/deconstructs, the clonazepam will be completely dissolved.

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Thanks for adding your experience to the mix... :)

 

One thing I wondered was if a rotary press was used and uncalibrated “punches” caused different pill densities..??

Gawd, the things we have to worry about..!!

 

Hope your back on track in no time..

:)

 

hi cant  :)

 

ooh that's a good possible explanation for the variability in hardness!

 

yeah, so many lil things when we're already anxious i totally agree.  i know this was a litttle thing.  but it's like making somebody with fear of the dark only have access to buy lightbulbs that work some of the time, and they have to buy the bulbs anyways. or they have wonky electrical wiring but no access to electrician repairmen. kinda makes just simple things not so simple!

 

lol at least my home's electrical (though wonky) works 99% of the time and we have the option to buy different kinds of lightbulbs for our house haha  :balloon: 

thx for the wellwishes and i'm on my way to streamlining things for mixing the daily meds so things should start going smoother real soon! (i can handle a hangover in the mornings until i get used to the switch to liquid clonazepam.)

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Thanks for adding your experience to the mix... :)

 

One thing I wondered was if a rotary press was used and uncalibrated “punches” caused different pill densities..??

Gawd, the things we have to worry about..!!

 

Hope your back on track in no time..

:)

 

Actually, tablets are in fact made with a tablet press, or pill press. There are rotary, types, linear types, etc.  But no matter the design, the process is the dry powder is mixed in a hopper , and then dropped into a tablet "cavity", then compressed with a punch, or ram.  And there will be variation in both uniformity of content, and uniformity of weight.

 

The FDA (US Pharmacopeia) actually allows +/-  15%  variation (a range of 30%) for both weight and content.  Pharma mfgrs normally hold tighter tolerances than than, but +/- 5% is pretty common.

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Builder,  -Yeeees..?? Just spitballing the hardness aspect...

 

Nomore, -a candle in the wind... :( (or perhaps the rain..)

You will get there mate, you know which way is up..

Hope your off n running soon..

 

:)

 

 

 

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Builder,  -Yeeees..?? Just spitballing the hardness aspect...

 

Nomore, -a candle in the wind... :( (or perhaps the rain..)

You will get there mate, you know which way is up..

Hope your off n running soon..

 

:)

 

great song!

 

but i like this one better:

  love the message and that's my style, hippie/oddball,  natural and no damned autotune!!!

lol

 

 

 

 

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this is really odd...

 

yesterday i began my liquid solution of clonazepam, and i dropped 2 of my 0.5mg pills  (ACCORD this time around  ::) ) into a cup and then squeezed 1ml of 190 proof alcohol onto the pills and waited. those lil buggers just sat there, only the orange outer part dissolved. ok so i thought, i'll just swish it around a lil bit, nothing else happened...ok i'll poke the pills with a dental pick, they began to split into large chunks, but still not "dissolving" as i'd read they do in a few seconds or  less than a minute. anyways i finally got them to dissolve after more than 5 minutes and added the 9ml of water and then did my 1 cup and 3 daily doses from the 1 cup.

 

today i used 2 same exact pills from the same RX bottle and same generic ACCORD brand and repeated the 1ml of 190 proof alcohol and they dissolved in seconds!

 

what in the world?

 

i guess the pharmacist was right when she said that the benzos vary so much from pill to pill even in the same batch, the same bottle...the fillers and API are not evenly distributed and even in "splittable" pills like my 0.5mg's are, they are not even and vary from pill to pill. so say the first 2 pills i tried dissolving had more of some excipient ingredient, binder or filler than the 2 pills from today...then that could account for their resiistance to dissolving. maybe. lol i just thought i'd report on my experience.

 

oh, another thing,

after my first liquid dose of clonazepam using alcohol as a solvent in a 1:1:9 ratio...i felt like i had a hangover this morning complete with sensitivity to noise and light!

i tried to sleep it off but was irritable and unable to get back to a good sleep. had strange dreams but not nightmares.

 

so yes, to my surprise, i found out first hand that those people reporting feeling the switch from pills to liquid solutions, even after one single dose, even without reducing/cutting the dose, well...they were right! it is possible and it happened to me. i feel a lil embarassed because i thought it wasn't possible, blew it off as if they just had ramped up anxiety/anticipation of a bad reaction. but i took my dose yesterday and went to be not worried about anything at all. i was so sure of myself haha anyways, i'm fine, just a little manic today. at least i got the kitchen cleaned up when my hangover passed.  :)

 

I don't take Accord anymore and read bad things about it on another Forum.  I specifically ask the pharmacy for the same manufacturer every month (Activis) as I was having really weird side effects and results from the pharmacy giving me different pills from different distributors every month and Accord was the worst one of all.  I'm not speaking for everyone... I'm not an expert but I didn't do well on Accord and reported them to the FDA when my urine test came back negative. Not going to judge the manufacture but I'm hoping I didn't get a placebo.  :-[  This happened back in May of 2018 when Teva stopped making Clonazepam.  I hope you get it sorted out.  :smitten:

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this is really odd...

 

yesterday i began my liquid solution of clonazepam, and i dropped 2 of my 0.5mg pills  (ACCORD this time around  ::) ) into a cup and then squeezed 1ml of 190 proof alcohol onto the pills and waited. those lil buggers just sat there, only the orange outer part dissolved. ok so i thought, i'll just swish it around a lil bit, nothing else happened...ok i'll poke the pills with a dental pick, they began to split into large chunks, but still not "dissolving" as i'd read they do in a few seconds or  less than a minute. anyways i finally got them to dissolve after more than 5 minutes and added the 9ml of water and then did my 1 cup and 3 daily doses from the 1 cup.

 

today i used 2 same exact pills from the same RX bottle and same generic ACCORD brand and repeated the 1ml of 190 proof alcohol and they dissolved in seconds!

 

what in the world?

 

i guess the pharmacist was right when she said that the benzos vary so much from pill to pill even in the same batch, the same bottle...the fillers and API are not evenly distributed and even in "splittable" pills like my 0.5mg's are, they are not even and vary from pill to pill. so say the first 2 pills i tried dissolving had more of some excipient ingredient, binder or filler than the 2 pills from today...then that could account for their resiistance to dissolving. maybe. lol i just thought i'd report on my experience.

 

oh, another thing,

after my first liquid dose of clonazepam using alcohol as a solvent in a 1:1:9 ratio...i felt like i had a hangover this morning complete with sensitivity to noise and light!

i tried to sleep it off but was irritable and unable to get back to a good sleep. had strange dreams but not nightmares.

 

so yes, to my surprise, i found out first hand that those people reporting feeling the switch from pills to liquid solutions, even after one single dose, even without reducing/cutting the dose, well...they were right! it is possible and it happened to me. i feel a lil embarassed because i thought it wasn't possible, blew it off as if they just had ramped up anxiety/anticipation of a bad reaction. but i took my dose yesterday and went to be not worried about anything at all. i was so sure of myself haha anyways, i'm fine, just a little manic today. at least i got the kitchen cleaned up when my hangover passed.  :)

 

I don't take Accord anymore and read bad things about it on another Forum.  I specifically ask the pharmacy for the same manufacturer every month (Activis) as I was having really weird side effects and results from the pharmacy giving me different pills from different distributors every month and Accord was the worst one of all.  I'm not speaking for everyone... I'm not an expert but I didn't do well on Accord and reported them to the FDA when my urine test came back negative. Not going to judge the manufacture but I'm hoping I didn't get a placebo.  :-[  This happened back in May of 2018 when Teva stopped making Clonazepam.  I hope you get it sorted out.  :smitten:

 

 

thx Raquel  :hug:  boy i feel the same...i wish my pharmacies (there's 2 our insurance allows us to use) could assure me that they would use the same generic consistently at least for however long they could, and let me know before a switch would occur so i could at least try to stabilize or hold or get alternative sources for the drug to make a switchover to the new generic smoother. like i read some others were doing when they have to do ageneric switch, they slowly break their pills in halves and mix the new with the old until they finally get the new one mostly and it's easier they say than a cold switch to the new generic. but i have no notice, just find out when i pick it up what i'm getting. frustrating! 

 

so did you have a bloodtest to se how much clonazepam was in your blood while taking ACCORD and it came out zero medicine in the results??!!

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Nomore....I'll be interested to see how you do on the liquid.  I could only give it 5 days and was tanking fast but I do personally have a highly sensitive CNS. 
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Nomore....I'll be interested to see how you do on the liquid.  I could only give it 5 days and was tanking fast but I do personally have a highly sensitive CNS.

 

i'm hypersensitive too, was extremely emotional/angry/outburst last night , felt so guilty and ashamed all night and this morning but manage to get up and do chores, so fingers crossed!

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Yes... my Dr. said there was nothing in my urine indicating I was on Clonazepam which made me suspicious... then I started reading other forums where there was entire threads about this issue... especially Accord.  I have not had a blood test as I don't have insurance.  CVS wouldn't allow me to be consistent with the manufacturer so I left CVS and I use Walgreens.  They actually order Activis for me.  I'm not sure how long they can do that but hopefully I will be done with my taper before they run out.  Some people on that forum were complaining about Activis too.  I Guess you have to find something that works and see if your pharmacy can keep you on the same one.  FYI... I don't have insurance and my Clonazepam is only $8.00 out of pocket for 15 pills.  So if you don't mind paying that much you may want to call around and find another pharmacy that can help you and be consistent.  :smitten:
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I think the DLMT is a great method of tapering, but maybe not for everyone. I did great with it a couple of years ago when I started tapering again. I used dry and liquid.

This time I used Teva dry and the Brand liquid. The Brand did not work. I thought for sure that the Brand would be fine.  I had tried the Accord and it was like water.

Will proceed with it again probably starting this week.

Consistency is the most important thing and with having to use different generics really throws people for a loop!

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Nomore....I'll be interested to see how you do on the liquid.  I could only give it 5 days and was tanking fast but I do personally have a highly sensitive CNS.

 

HEY mOM ack capslock!

 

was it 5 days of reducing or 5 days from the switch to liquid clonazepam? i plan on starting the reducing/tapering part on friday, that will have given me 14 days to make sure i'm stabilized. it was tricky the first few days but now i feel much better. did you give yourself time to stabilize your CNS when you switched to liquid before you started reducing the dosage? i'm sensitized too. better than being numb tho...i guess! :D

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I think the DLMT is a great method of tapering, but maybe not for everyone. I did great with it a couple of years ago when I started tapering again. I used dry and liquid.

This time I used Teva dry and the Brand liquid. The Brand did not work. I thought for sure that the Brand would be fine.  I had tried the Accord and it was like water.

Will proceed with it again probably starting this week.

Consistency is the most important thing and with having to use different generics really throws people for a loop!

 

oh how i agree with that...consistency dammit! i don't care if the generic i get is strong or weak, as long as it's the same strength every pill! lol

hopefully i can get the compounding (smaller private) pharmacy to order me a buncha pills in one generic and then at leas t for awhile i have that one less variable to worry about every month. it's been a doozy the past 3 months, going from  Accord, to Solco, then back to Accord...i can handle regular wd's but not the constant zig-zagging. i wonder if i can do like Raquel did, get tested and see if there's any benzo showing in my blood or urine?

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Nomore,

I didn't reduce my dose for the 5 days that I switched to liquid - I was just trying to stabilize on it but could not.  I was getting all kinds of worse symptoms, including smelling burning all the time, severe temperature changes (sweating/freezing), all kinds of other severe symptoms I hadn't had before.  It was full liquid though - my whole tablet.  I am super sensitive now that I'm in severe tolerance - I may have handled it a lot better several months ago.  That's good for you that you are handling it well - definitely has a huge advantage.....was bummed that it did not work for me.  Maybe if I stabilize a bit more on my way down, with my CNS stabilizing, then I can try again - I don't know - I'm kind of afraid.  I don't understand how some do so well with it and others cannot handle.  The noise sensitivity thing is a constant for me now almost, regardless -one of my worst symptoms. 

 

I agree that Accord was like water for me when I used it a few years back, prior to my daily K usage.  It's interesting to me, though, that the brand K still gave issues, given that many say it is stronger. 

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Nomore,

I didn't reduce my dose for the 5 days that I switched to liquid - I was just trying to stabilize on it but could not.  I was getting all kinds of worse symptoms, including smelling burning all the time, severe temperature changes (sweating/freezing), all kinds of other severe symptoms I hadn't had before.  It was full liquid though - my whole tablet.  I am super sensitive now that I'm in severe tolerance - I may have handled it a lot better several months ago.  That's good for you that you are handling it well - definitely has a huge advantage.....was bummed that it did not work for me.  Maybe if I stabilize a bit more on my way down, with my CNS stabilizing, then I can try again - I don't know - I'm kind of afraid.  I don't understand how some do so well with it and others cannot handle.  The noise sensitivity thing is a constant for me now almost, regardless -one of my worst symptoms. 

 

I agree that Accord was like water for me when I used it a few years back, prior to my daily K usage.  It's interesting to me, though, that the brand K still gave issues, given that many say it is stronger.

 

oh wow you really felt it too! ok i understand now. well, it looks like we both had bad reactions/ramped up sxs when we switched to the alcohol solvent with water version of clonazepam...but i felt better after a few days and you just kept feeling terrible! if it was me, i'd be scared too. but if it were me, i think i'd try again, if the alcohol solvent is a no-go, maybe propylene glycol? were you in acute wd when you made the switch to liquid clonazepam?

 

the hyperacusis and tinnitus is bad for me too. i have had it so  long though i forgot how it is to not have it. it def gets worse with stress...i hate public noisy places, like the beep of a cherry picker going backwards, and the smells of a hardware store where chemicals from wood permeate the air...stuff like that i gotta try not to be around. i try to shop at odd hours like late night so less people and traffic. no malls for me for awhile.  :idiot:

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