Feeling too rough on dry taper, want to try DLMT but not sure what to do.

Hey guys,

I've dry cut my Valium to 0.077g in the evening and my dose in the morning is 0.087g or 2.5mg. What I did consider doing is a DLMT to help ease the harsh withdrawal symptoms, and I read where this method is by far the easiest to tolerate.

I'm keen to try this method, but don't want to updose or stabilise again, if I can help it (kindling has made me feel like dirt in the past). I want to keep my progress going.

I have zero knowledge on how to do this. The only things I know are you need jars, full cream milk, and a syringe haha! I am terrible with maths. Even Jim Hawk's liquid taper plan looks confusing. I read somewhere that reducing 1mL then 2mL daily can catch up on you and throw you into a huge "wave", may have been Surviving Antidepressants?

Also, where do you guys buy your syringes and which ones do you use?

Thanks,

Dave.

The "taper plan" is no different for liquid than it is for dry.  But instead of taking smaller and smaller doses of dry benzo, you take smaller and smaller doses of liquid benzo.  If you make a solution where .1mg=1ml, then you can easily make dose decrements of .10mg at a time.  .1mg=1ml is a very convenient ratio, as it eliminates any actual "math".  You just think in X10 multiples.  EX: 1mg=10ml, .5mg=5ml, 2.5mg=25mls, etc.

Doing a DLMT, your cuts do NOT "catch up" with you.  SXS, if any, will emerge slowly, so if you perceive and sxs coming on, you have time to respond by slowing your cut rate, of doing a hold.

The most convenient liquid uses either vodka (alcohol) or propylene glycol as a solvent, and then is diluted with water.  You can easily prepare and store 10-14 day batches, and no refrigeration is required.  There is also an Rx liquid diazepam, if your doc will write a scrip.  That's even better.

Yes, you can use milk, but there are obviously some limitations with storage and portability.  But it will work.

You will need a 1ml and 10ml oral syringe, and a glass jar with a lid for mixing and storing. 

Making your liquid is about as complicated as adding cream and sugar to your coffee, and reading a syringe is about as complicated as reading a ruler.

The "taper plan" is no different for liquid than it is for dry.  But instead of taking smaller and smaller doses of dry benzo, you take smaller and smaller doses of liquid benzo.  If you make a solution where .1mg=1ml, then you can easily make dose decrements of .10mg at a time.  .1mg=1ml is a very convenient ratio, as it eliminates any actual "math".  You just think in X10 multiples.  EX: 1mg=10ml, .5mg=5ml, 2.5mg=25mls, etc.

 

Doing a DLMT, your cuts do NOT "catch up" with you.  SXS, if any, will emerge slowly, so if you perceive and sxs coming on, you have time to respond by slowing your cut rate, of doing a hold.

 

The most convenient liquid uses either vodka (alcohol) or propylene glycol as a solvent, and then is diluted with water.  You can easily prepare and store 10-14 day batches, and no refrigeration is required.  There is also an Rx liquid diazepam, if your doc will write a scrip.  That's even better.

 

Yes, you can use milk, but there are obviously some limitations with storage and portability.  But it will work.

 

 

You will need a 1ml and 10ml oral syringe, and a glass jar with a lid for mixing and storing. 

 

Making your liquid is about as complicated as adding cream and sugar to your coffee, and reading a syringe is about as complicated as reading a ruler.

I thought as much, that there would be no difference in calculations e.g. 1mg=10mL and so on. I was told on Surviving Antidepressants that cuts can catch up on you on a daily taper, but I thought that's only if you are silly enough not to HOLD on your taper if symptoms get hairy. I do holds, but everyone is different. Some people can handle daily cutting, others need to hold and then go down further once comfortable.

I have to go shopping for some equipment. For some jars and syringes.

What do you need two syringes for? Did you end up getting your syringe online?

Thanks Builder, appreciate it mate!

Dave.

The "taper plan" is no different for liquid than it is for dry.  But instead of taking smaller and smaller doses of dry benzo, you take smaller and smaller doses of liquid benzo.  If you make a solution where .1mg=1ml, then you can easily make dose decrements of .10mg at a time.  .1mg=1ml is a very convenient ratio, as it eliminates any actual "math".  You just think in X10 multiples.  EX: 1mg=10ml, .5mg=5ml, 2.5mg=25mls, etc.

 

Doing a DLMT, your cuts do NOT "catch up" with you.  SXS, if any, will emerge slowly, so if you perceive and sxs coming on, you have time to respond by slowing your cut rate, of doing a hold.

 

The most convenient liquid uses either vodka (alcohol) or propylene glycol as a solvent, and then is diluted with water.  You can easily prepare and store 10-14 day batches, and no refrigeration is required.  There is also an Rx liquid diazepam, if your doc will write a scrip.  That's even better.

 

Yes, you can use milk, but there are obviously some limitations with storage and portability.  But it will work.

 

 

You will need a 1ml and 10ml oral syringe, and a glass jar with a lid for mixing and storing. 

 

Making your liquid is about as complicated as adding cream and sugar to your coffee, and reading a syringe is about as complicated as reading a ruler.

I thought as much, that there would be no difference in calculations e.g. 1mg=10mL and so on. I was told on Surviving Antidepressants that cuts can catch up on you on a daily taper, but I thought that's only if you are silly enough not to HOLD on your taper if symptoms get hairy.1)  I do holds, but everyone is different. Some people can handle daily cutting, others need to hold and then go down further once comfortable.

I have to go shopping for some equipment. 2) For some jars and syringes.

3) What do you need two syringes for? Did you end up getting your syringe online?

Thanks Builder, appreciate it mate!

Dave.

1)  If you choose an appropriate taper rate, you should not need to hold.  If you become symptomatic, that means you are tapering too fast.

2)  I re-used jars like empty pickl/olive/salad ressing, etc) containers.

3) For example, your 2.5mg dose would be 25 mls.  Do you want to do 25X ml  pulls with a 1ml syringe, or 2 X 10ml  pull  + 1X .5 with a 1ml syringe?

Hey Builder, thanks once again for replying!

Ah, now I see why you need a 10mL and a 1mL syringe.

So the way I understand liquid micro tapering, and it could be very wrong I don't know, I would pull 0.1mL from 25mL as 25mL equates to 2.5mg, discard 0.1mL, then take 0.2mL from 24.9mL to 24.7mL, then 0.3mL from 24.7mL to 24.4mL etc. until complete, is that right? Isn't the dose exactly the same for each pull?

Cheers,

Dave.

Hey Builder, thanks once again for replying!

Ah, now I see why you need 10mL and a 1mL syringe.

So the way I understand liquid micro tapering, and it could be very wrong I don't know, I would pull 1mL from 250mL as 250mL equates to 2.5mg, discard 1mL, then take 2mL from 249mL to 247mL, then 3mL from 247mL to 244mL etc. until complete, is that right? Isn't the dose exactly the same for each pull?

Cheers,

Dave.

<sigh>  You don't discard anything.  You make enough liquid to last 10-14 days. then you just draw up and drink the scheduled dose, just like you would any liquid med.

Imagine that your doc gave you a scrip for a liquid med, and the dosing instructions were:  Take 10 the first day, then reduce dose by 1 tsp each day after that.  I'm sure you would take 10 tsp day 1, 9 tsp day 2, 8 tsp day 3, etc.

That's how a daily liquid taper works.

Hey Builder, thanks once again for replying!

Ah, now I see why you need 10mL and a 1mL syringe.

So the way I understand liquid micro tapering, and it could be very wrong I don't know, I would pull 1mL from 250mL as 250mL equates to 2.5mg, discard 1mL, then take 2mL from 249mL to 247mL, then 3mL from 247mL to 244mL etc. until complete, is that right? Isn't the dose exactly the same for each pull?

Cheers,

Dave.

 

<sigh>  You don't discard anything.  You make enough liquid to last 10-14 days. then you just draw up and drink the scheduled dose, just like you would any liquid med.

 

Imagine that your doc gave you a scrip for a liquid med, and the dosing instructions were:  Take 10 the first day, then reduce dose by 1 tsp each day after that.  I'm sure you would take 10 tsp day 1, 9 tsp day 2, 8 tsp day 3, etc.

 

That's how a daily liquid taper works.

So do you draw up your required dose in the syringe and drink the drawn up liquid from the syringe?

Do you remake your solution after 10-14 days?

Sorry I'm just lost on this whole process.

Dave.

 

 

 

So do you draw up your required dose in the syringe and drink the drawn up liquid from the syringe?

Do you remake your solution after 10-14 days?

Sorry I'm just lost on this whole process.

Dave.

You can drink it directly from teh syringe, you can squirt it into a glass, you can mix it with juice or soft drink, it doesn't matter.  Its a measured dose, and you just ingest it, as you would with any other liquid med.

you can prepare multi-day batches to suit your needs.  10-14 days is just a general compromise.

Once again, the "whole process" is not much different than taking a Rx or OTC liquid med.  There is nothing unique or complicated about it.

I use a 10 ML syringe to take my daily doses by squirting the mix right into my mouth aiming it to go down my throat.  I am taking Liquid Valium mixed with one part liquid valium to nine parts water.  I mix a big batch and draw my daily doses from it.

The 10 ML syringe has hash marks between the 1 ml marks allowing you to taper by .2 ml.  If you want to slow your taper you can reduce by .2 ml every second day or every third day.  So you would stay on the same dose for two or three days and then reduce it and stay at that dose another 2 or three days and reduce it, and so on.

I use a 10 ML syringe to take my daily doses by squirting the mix right into my mouth aiming it to go down my throat.  I am taking Liquid Valium mixed with one part liquid valium to nine parts water.  I mix a big batch and draw my daily doses from it.

 

The 10 ML syringe has hash marks between the 1 ml marks allowing you to taper by .2 ml.  If you want to slow your taper you can reduce by .2 ml every second day or every third day.  So you would stay on the same dose for two or three days and then reduce it and stay at that dose another 2 or three days and reduce it, and so on.

Oh right, okay thanks for that confuseduser! I've been doing similar with the dry taper, but hit some rocks doing it that way.

Thanks for the advice Builder! I understand the process much better now. 😀