I think I'm in tolerance withdrawal

I've been on a pretty low dose (2-4mg/day) of Valium for over 30 years for panic disorder and anxiety. I also have a weird phobia that causes the panic attacks. It's not working well anymore and after much research, I think I'm in tolerance withdrawal. I don't feel well, am severely underweight but can't eat, have tons and tons of symptoms and have been getting panic attacks that border on hysteria. Distance I'm willing to go from home is getting smaller and smaller because who knows when one of these hysteria episodes will happen. Discussed my thoughts on this with my doc and he said there is no such thing as tolerance withdrawal and to just increase my dose a little. He said I should be on Valium the rest of my life. I'm a bit locked in with him since very few mental health providers take my insurance so clearly I need to manage this on my own, and with your help, because he's pretty worthless.

Welcome to BenzoBuddies!  We are glad you decided to join us.  You'll find a lot of support and information on this forum, which is the only one of its kind online.  Tolerance, and tolerance withdrawal are very real.  For many, it's the reason they decide to get off benzos.

 

For those starting a taper, we generally recommend starting out at a rate of 5 to 10% every 10-14 days, then adjusting the taper to suit your own needs.  Note: very short term users may be able to taper faster.

 

Withdrawal symptoms, which vary widely but commonly include anxiety and insomnia, often occur during a taper, but these are temporary and will get better in time.  In general, first tapers are easier, but cold turkeys or multiple withdrawals may be more severe and longer lasting.  Here are a few links to get you started:

 

The Ashton Manual, a concise reference for tapering and symptom issues.  Chapter III contains excellent descriptions of common symptoms such as muscle issues, anxiety, and hyper-awareness

 

Withdrawal Support (during your taper)

 

Once again, welcome!

Hi munchie and welcome. I am also a 30 year benzo user and my doc also told me the same thing. Tolerance does happen to many ppl who decide to take these drugs long-term for  anxiety disorder management. We all here all living proof that it can and does happen. The drugs no longer work for me now and I am sick again with panic and anxiety, now complicated and made many times worse by taking benzos for 30 years. I also (like you)  having trouble eating now and keeping my weight up and I hate it. Have you decided yet that you are going to slowly try to come off these drugs?

Munchie, the good news, you are on a low dose and that gives you the opportunity to taper slowly.

Since you are in tolerance and I believe you are (imo) we want to taper you slowly so we don't aggravate your brain and central nervous system anymore than it already is, there are a lot of ways of tapering, go to the Home PAGE and scroll down reading through the different tapering methods.  I think since you are so low already, a daily liquid micro taper might be a good way because you can titrate very low amounts.  Ashton, in my opinion is too fast for a lot of people, but you will need to make that decision for yourself.  Your goal is to keep enough benzo in you to almost cover your withdrawal symptoms, which means watching your symptoms, if they seem to be getting worse, slow down or lower the amount you are tapering.  Read, ask questions and we will be here.  Mary 💜🙏☮️

Munchie,

 

Welcome.  I’m so sorry you’re needing to deal with benzos.  We’re here to support you.

 

SaraSue 

Thank you all, I appreciate the support. Nobody in my real life wants to hear it anymore. They think I need to take Prozac and I will be cured of anxiety and that all my other symptoms are from starvation (and while I don't doubt that's part of it since I seriously never eat) I don't think it's all of it.

 

Not beating up on myself but I really think I did this to myself, unintentionally. I was prescribed 5 mg. Valium for years, to be cut in half or quarters, usually quarters, unless I was really panicking badly (so taking only 1.25 once or twice a day for the most part). A few years ago, my doc was on vacation when I had my med check and his partner lowered me to 2 mg. tablets since he thought it was silly to be breaking up pills. Well, for whatever reason, I kept breaking them up the same way anyway so I was taking a quarter of a 2, so half a milligram!! So I suddenly lowered my dose by more than half after all those years and I do believe that's when this all started but didn't connect it until recently. Even if I took a half of the 2 it was still lower than a quarter of the 5. I did not do this to lower my dose but I'm super anxious about any new drugs or changes and it sounds so ridiculous to me since this was the same drug but it caused anxiety to take a different size....that quarter of a pill was my comfort level, my magical panic-curing quarter...makes zero sense even to me but truth is truth.

 

Now to back up, I have a terrible phobia of vomiting. Childhood family food poisoning trauma reared it's ugly head in adulthood. I'm generally an anxious person but I do not panic unless it has something to do with stomachs or sickness, me or others or even on TV or movies. I could count on one hand the rare random panic attacks for no apparent reason that didn't involve stomach stuff in all these years. If someone in another country talks about a stomach virus or food poisoning I'm done for, not that I think I'm catching it from them of course but it's just a reminder that it's out there. As you could predict because life is funny, my anxiety hits me in my stomach and tightens my throat to where I feel like I will gag, and when you gag, well I'm sure you know what I assume is next so there comes the panic. I've been telling doctors for years that I feel like I will throw up from my throat only, not from my stomach because it didn't really feel sick, and they blow me off because they don't know what it is. Now that I've obviously been in tolerance for several years, and the legit stomach symptoms that tolerance causes make me unable to eat and the constant emptiness really has messed up my stomach, it's become a vicious cycle of feeling sick from not eating but feeling too sick to eat. My weight is dangerously low. I feel horrendous and like all the energy has been sucked out of me just the last few weeks. It's as if I maintained okay at this weight with not much food for years and just now hit a wall and my body is saying nope, no more.

 

I don't know what to do next. I would imagine I should get off these pills but I don't know what I'll do about the panic and phobia afterwards or even during. I thought I should go back to the dose that worked and get stable for a minute here but hey, I think even that doesn't work now. It seems the more I take the worse I feel and will still be panicky on higher doses. I'm feeling the sedation effects more now probably because of my malnutrition.  Changing benzos seems wrong since I'm already on the one most switch to for their taper. I somehow need to stabilize so I can try to eat or I think this won't end well and end sooner than I'd like. My daughter said tonight if I don't take the Prozac and get stable I will die, it's that simple. My whole family is on the Prozac train and angry that I won't take it. I just don't know.

Thank you all, I appreciate the support. Nobody in my real life wants to hear it anymore. They think I need to take Prozac and I will be cured of anxiety and that all my other symptoms are from starvation (and while I don't doubt that's part of it since I seriously never eat) I don't think it's all of it.

 

Not beating up on myself but I really think I did this to myself, unintentionally. I was prescribed 5 mg. Valium for years, to be cut in half or quarters, usually quarters, unless I was really panicking badly (so taking only 1.25 once or twice a day for the most part). A few years ago, my doc was on vacation when I had my med check and his partner lowered me to 2 mg. tablets since he thought it was silly to be breaking up pills. Well, for whatever reason, I kept breaking them up the same way anyway so I was taking a quarter of a 2, so half a milligram!! So I suddenly lowered my dose by more than half after all those years and I do believe that's when this all started but didn't connect it until recently. Even if I took a half of the 2 it was still lower than a quarter of the 5. I did not do this to lower my dose but I'm super anxious about any new drugs or changes and it sounds so ridiculous to me since this was the same drug but it caused anxiety to take a different size....that quarter of a pill was my comfort level, my magical panic-curing quarter...makes zero sense even to me but truth is truth.

 

Now to back up, I have a terrible phobia of vomiting. Childhood family food poisoning trauma reared it's ugly head in adulthood. I'm generally an anxious person but I do not panic unless it has something to do with stomachs or sickness, me or others or even on TV or movies. I could count on one hand the rare random panic attacks for no apparent reason that didn't involve stomach stuff in all these years. If someone in another country talks about a stomach virus or food poisoning I'm done for, not that I think I'm catching it from them of course but it's just a reminder that it's out there. As you could predict because life is funny, my anxiety hits me in my stomach and tightens my throat to where I feel like I will gag, and when you gag, well I'm sure you know what I assume is next so there comes the panic. I've been telling doctors for years that I feel like I will throw up from my throat only, not from my stomach because it didn't really feel sick, and they blow me off because they don't know what it is. Now that I've obviously been in tolerance for several years, and the legit stomach symptoms that tolerance causes make me unable to eat and the constant emptiness really has messed up my stomach, it's become a vicious cycle of feeling sick from not eating but feeling too sick to eat. My weight is dangerously low. I feel horrendous and like all the energy has been sucked out of me just the last few weeks. It's as if I maintained okay at this weight with not much food for years and just now hit a wall and my body is saying nope, no more.

 

I don't know what to do next. I would imagine I should get off these pills but I don't know what I'll do about the panic and phobia afterwards or even during. I thought I should go back to the dose that worked and get stable for a minute here but hey, I think even that doesn't work now. It seems the more I take the worse I feel and will still be panicky on higher doses. I'm feeling the sedation effects more now probably because of my malnutrition.  Changing benzos seems wrong since I'm already on the one most switch to for their taper. I somehow need to stabilize so I can try to eat or I think this won't end well and end sooner than I'd like. My daughter said tonight if I don't take the Prozac and get stable I will die, it's that simple. My whole family is on the Prozac train and angry that I won't take it. I just don't know.

Oh Wow..!!

Welcome, and sorry to hear...

 

Is it something non medicine therapy could help..?

 

Its getting to that quiet time of day.. If you dont get replies/help here, -thats a good post to copy and paste onto the Withdrawal Support Board..

 

You have probs done yourself a huge favour keeping your dose low, but dont let anyone convince you it cant be having a big effect at these doses...

 

I feel having a wholistic plan will be a great help here.. Nutrition, CBT?, and when ready, a taper of some sort...

 

If you are particularly sensitive to these doses you *may* need to look at DLMT (Daily liquid micro tapering) =small/tiny reductions often/daily..  This also might not be needed at all, but you dont have a higher dose to test the waters with...  Your history may give an indication??

 

Just some thoughts to explore...

 

 

Thanks, it's a rough time for sure. I did have a consultation with a woman who does natural healing and Ayurveda about a week ago. She used to be a pharmacist, not practicing traditional medicine anymore, so I figured she had lots of experience with drugs to work me through this naturally. She gave me a few supplements, two of which have all sorts of weird animal organs in them like bovine testicle and pig spleen...sigh...that just sets my phobia off like a rocket simply thinking of taking them but they have glowing reviews so I'm working up my courage to take them. They're from a reputable company, Standard Process, so it's not some oddball thing but still. She also has a whole nutrition plan laid out but just for now I'm supposed to be having bone broth and easy to digest nutritious things, adding coconut oil to my broth and drinks, things like that. It's a long, slow road I guess so I need to take a baby step at least.