Need help with Jim Hawk's liquid taper plan

Hi,

 

On January 27, 2019, I started my liquid taper using Jim Hawk's excellent Benzodiazepine Liquid Taper Plan. I entered the data and had no trouble receiving a Daily Plan. http://benzo.alwaysdata.net/titration/titrationForm.php

 

Today, I want to re-calculate my Daily Plan and I'm running into a three glitches.

 

1) In the past, a calendar popped up to enter the quit date. No calendar is popping up now.

2) in the past, it was possible to change the rate from 5% to 7% and receive a Daily Plan. This is not working for me now.

3) I want to see what a daily taper plan will look like if I decide to quit one to two doses first instead of across all doses. When I enter my data, I am not receiving a plan. I do want to use an extended taper plan.

 

Here is my data: Planned quit date: 27.01.2019

Drug: Clonazepam, 1 mg tablet

Daily doses:

Dose 1: 0.5 mg

Dose 2: 0.5 mg

Dose 3: 1.0 mg

 

Follow-Up: I was just able to recalulate the liquid taper plan using a 7% taper with elimination of the first doses. Two weeks ago, the daily plan end date was December 18, 2019. When I recalculated the plan, the end date is now May 22, 2021. Why is there a difference?

 

Thanks in advance if anyone can help me!

Hi Starlight-

 

I just tried input your numbers and the program is working fine. Maybe try again 

Dear Buddie,

 

Thanks for checking on the titration plan. I am having trouble with the chart using Safari, but it worked with Google Chrome. However, I am getting disparate end dates. Two weeks ago, my end date was December 18, 2019. Now, my end date is coming up as May 22, 2021. When you inputted my numbers, what end date are you seeing? Also, I want to select an attenuated taper, but the circle does not fill in when I click on it.

 

Thanks again!

Dear Buddie,

 

Thanks for checking on the titration plan. I am having trouble with the chart using Safari, but it worked with Google Chrome. However, I am getting disparate end dates. Two weeks ago, my end date was December 18, 2019. Now, my end date is coming up as May 22, 2021. When you inputted my numbers, what end date are you seeing? Also, I want to select an attenuated taper, but the circle does not fill in when I click on it.

 

Thanks again!

 

I get June 2021 is end date going by "percentage" option at 7%

 

Using the "Quantity" option at 7% of 2mg = .14/14days=.01 per day) I get end date of August 29th 2019.

 

If I were in your shoes and was not experiencing major symptoms I would start out with a "Quantity" option of 5% reduction (.007 daily) of your 2mg dose. This would be end date of Nov. 21st 2019. If I ran into debilitating symptoms I would then reduce my daily drop accordingly.

Dear Bella Amis,

 

You are most helpful and responsive. Thank you for your replies. I want to take your suggestion to start with a "Quantity" option of 5% reduction (0.007 daily) of my 2 mg dose with an end date of Nov. 21, 2019.

 

I tried to enter the data but do not think that I'm doing it correctly. Will you please help me just a little bit more? Under the Planned Reduction section, my start date is 01/27/2019. What numbers do I enter for

"Quantity" mg

(or) Percent %

Reduction order: First dose first

Combine with tablets: No

Attenuated ending: Yes

 

Thanks again!

Quantity would be .14 and attenuated ending would be no.

 

This brings you to August.

 

I would personally do .1 which brings you to October and is the recommended 5% pace. October 31st if based on 1/27/2019.

Dear Bella Amis,

 

You are most helpful and responsive. Thank you for your replies. I want to take your suggestion to start with a "Quantity" option of 5% reduction (0.007 daily) of my 2 mg dose with an end date of Nov. 21, 2019.

 

I tried to enter the data but do not think that I'm doing it correctly. Will you please help me just a little bit more? Under the Planned Reduction section, my start date is 01/27/2019. What numbers do I enter for

"Quantity" mg

(or) Percent %

Reduction order: First dose first

Combine with tablets: No

Attenuated ending: Yes

 

Thanks again!

 

Here is what I typed in:

 

  click image

 

Dear Bella Amis and EtherealRemant,

 

Thanks for rolling up your sleeves to help me. I really appreciate it.

 

It was helpful to see your copy and paste of the chart, Bella Amis, and it helped me to see that you inputted the tablet size as .5mg. My tablet size is 1.0 mg. This explains our different results. Also, your plan dissolves 10 tablets. My plan dissolves 2 tablets.

 

EtherealRemnant: I would like to follow your suggestion of tapering at .1 mg at the recommended 5% pace and ending on Oct. 31, 2018. However, when I input this data, the end point comes up as April 27, 2020. I wish that I knew how to copy and paste the actual chart that I'm creating. All I can do is provide the numbers that I'm inputting.  Can either of you figure out why I am coming up with disparate end dates?

 

Thanks for your continued help!

 

Benzodiazepine Liquid Taper Plan

 

Benzodiazepine name: Clonazepam

Tablet size: 1.0 mg

Planned quit dose: 0.025 mg/day

Suggested quit dose: 0.025mg/day

Liquid solution

Number of tablets to dissolve: 2 unit

Total volume of liquid: 100 ml

Concentration: 0.02 mg/ml

Suggested concentration: 0.1 mg/ml

Daily dose(s) in taper order

Dose 1: 0.5 mg

Dose 2: 0.5 mg

Dose 3: 1.0 mg

 

Planned reduction

Start date: 1/27/2019

 

Quantity: 0.1 mg

(or) Percent: 5%

Every: 14 days

Reduction order:

First dose first Across doses

Combine with tablets: No

Attenuated ending:

Yes 

 

End date is: 4/27/2020

 

 

 

 

Dear Bella Amis and EtherealRemant,

 

Thanks for rolling up your sleeves to help me. I really appreciate it.

 

It was helpful to see your copy and paste of the chart, Bella Amis, and it helped me to see that you inputted the tablet size as .5mg. My tablet size is 1.0 mg. This explains our different results. Also, your plan dissolves 10 tablets. My plan dissolves 2 tablets.

 

EtherealRemnant: I would like to follow your suggestion of tapering at .1 mg at the recommended 5% pace and ending on Oct. 31, 2018. However, when I input this data, the end point comes up as April 27, 2020. I wish that I knew how to copy and paste the actual chart that I'm creating. All I can do is provide the numbers that I'm inputting.  Can either of you figure out why I am coming up with disparate end dates?

Thanks for your continued help!

 

Benzodiazepine Liquid Taper Plan

 

Benzodiazepine name: Clonazepam

Tablet size: 1.0 mg

Planned quit dose: 0.025 mg/day

Suggested quit dose: 0.025mg/day

Liquid solution

Number of tablets to dissolve: 2 unit

Total volume of liquid: 100 ml

Concentration: 0.02 mg/ml

Suggested concentration: 0.1 mg/ml

Daily dose(s) in taper order

Dose 1: 0.5 mg

Dose 2: 0.5 mg

Dose 3: 1.0 mg

 

Planned reduction

Start date: 1/27/2019

 

Quantity: 0.1 mg

(or) Percent: 5%

Every: 14 days

Reduction order:

First dose first Across doses

Combine with tablets: No

Attenuated ending:

Yes 

 

End date is: 4/27/2020

 

  click image

Dear Bella Amis,

 

Thank you very much for your chart. It works for me now and I see that you selected a tapering schedule that is not attenuated. This accounts for the date discrepancies.

 

I will try this plan.

 

Thanks again for your help!

Yeah attenuated ending shouldn’t be needed if you get the proper dose cut rate from the start, otherwise it will drag your taper out significantly longer. If you have problems, you can either run the math again with attenuated ending selected or you can just change your daily cut amounts which is trivial with liquid.