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Anyone get off both Ambien and Diazepam and HOW?


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Hi there.  Have had horrible taper and never stable but worse now than ever.  Am on 3 mg valium; 10 ambien.  Been on benzos like 35 years or more, probably 40 years better guess...

 

For 2 years debilitated since mirtazapine plunged me into this.  At the time I tapred K with no problem, really, or minimal.  After mirtaz, on (bad) advice did not hold or updose K, but transitioned to Valium, kept tapering that, sleep got worse, ambien use went up.

 

Am stuck and dr. does not know what to do with me, so:

 

Anybody get off both Ambien and Diazepam over to another benzo and get off it?  Or onto something else?

 

OR:  updose and over to another benzo just diazepam, hold the Ambien?

 

Dr open to everything and mentioned phenobarb, flurazepam, librium perhaps.  He not wild about liquid valium and won't do gene test. 

 

I already tried to up valium, lower Ambien-- felt bad.  Switched out, for 9 days, valium for K.  Switched back when felt breathing probs/ back of head issues. Dr. said try ativan just at night to sleep, no valium.  Everyone here seems to think that not wise.

 

So, opinions please!  Really suffering a lot and very, very nonfunctional.

 

Don't know what the heck to try.

 

Cannot take gabapentin, ADs, antihistamines.  Melatonin makes me very depressed.  I think that rules about everything out.  Tried some mj but so far nothing good there.  CBN for sleep had horrible effect.

 

Thank you all.

 

 

 

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  • 2 weeks later...
I'm on 10 mg ambien too and tapering my xanax. Xanax is down to 0.1 mg. So I'm very interested in this. I figured I would taper the ambien once I was done with the xanax. Now not so sure.
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Magnesium might help sleep but some people have problems with it.

 

Magnesium Glycinate calms me a lot but trying not to take it too often

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Hope, yes I don't know.  I feel real addicted to the ambien; the diaz does me less good.

 

Many seem to get off one then the other... there so many theories about this.

 

I have tried about everything for sleep as have had sleep prob 50 years!!  I may revisit some stuff.  Someone else suggested lavendar, which never tried.

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I feel real addicted to the ambien; the diaz does me less good.

 

I was addicted to Ambien for many years too, so I understand.  I tried to get off it via fast taper and cold turkey in March 2016, but failed on first attempt.  But second attempt was successful and I got off Ambien permanently in May 2017.  It isn't easy, the deciding factor is whether you want to get off it for good.  Withdrawal will suck for a while, but it's survivable.  Please let me know if I can help.

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This is just my experience, as I'm not an expert except from my own drug use experience.

 

I'd get off the Ambien first and then taper the Valium. Why? Because Valium's longer half-life is shorter and not as harsh.  Quite possible, what you feel with ambien is the rebound effect. You know how a person rebounds with headaches from lots of Tylenol? Well, read this abstract:

 

J Psychopharmacol. 2012 Aug;26(8):1088-95. doi: 10.1177/0269881111424455. Epub 2011 Oct 16.

Twelve months of nightly zolpidem does not lead to rebound insomnia or withdrawal symptoms: a prospective placebo-controlled study.

 

Roehrs TA1, Randall S, Harris E, Maan R, Roth T.

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Abstract

Rebound insomnia, worsened sleep when discontinuing use of a hypnotic, is reported in some short-term studies. No study has prospectively assessed, using patient reports or nocturnal polysomnography (NPSG), the likelihood of rebound insomnia with chronic hypnotic use. The objectives of this study was to assess in primary insomniacs the likelihood of experiencing rebound insomnia and a withdrawal syndrome on repeated placebo substitutions over 12 months of nightly zolpidem use. A group of 33 primary insomniacs, without psychiatric disorders or drug and alcohol abuse, 32-65 years old, 15 men and 18 women, were randomized to take zolpidem 10 mg (n = 17) or placebo (n = 16) nightly for 12 months. In probes during months 1, 4, and 12, placebo was substituted for 7 consecutive nights in both the zolpidem and placebo groups. NPSGs were collected and Tyrer Bezodiazepine Withdrawal Symptom Questionnaires were completed on the first two discontinuation nights. Rebound insomnia was not observed on the first two and the seventh discontinuation nights and its likelihood did not increase over the 12 months of nightly zolpidem use. Some individuals did show rebound insomnia, approximately 30-40% of participants, but the percentage of 'rebounders' did not differ between the placebo and zolpidem groups and did not increase across 12 months. No clinically significant withdrawal symptoms on the Tyrer were observed on the discontinuation nights over the 12 months of nightly use. Chronic nightly hypnotic use at therapeutic doses by primary insomniacs does not lead to rebound insomnia or withdrawal symptoms.

 

Here's another really positive abstract:

 

Withdrawal from long-term use of zopiclone, zolpidem and temazepam may improve perceived sleep and quality of life in older adults with primary insomnia.

 

Lähteenmäki R1, Neuvonen PJ2, Puustinen J3,4, Vahlberg T5, Partinen M6,7, Räihä I1, Kivelä SL1,4.

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Abstract

Long-term use of benzodiazepines or benzodiazepine receptor agonists is widespread, although guidelines recommend short-term use. Only few controlled studies have characterized the effect of discontinuation of their chronic use on sleep and quality of life. We studied perceived sleep and quality of life in 92 older (age 55-91 years) outpatients with primary insomnia before and after withdrawal from long-term use of zopiclone, zolpidem or temazepam (BZDA). BZDA was withdrawn during 1 month, during which the participants received psychosocial support and blindly melatonin or placebo. A questionnaire was used to study perceived sleep and quality of life before withdrawal, and 1 month and 6 months later. 89 participants completed the 6-month follow-up. As melatonin did not improve withdrawal, all participants were pooled and then separated based solely on the withdrawal results at 6 months (34 Withdrawers. 55 Nonwithdrawers) for this secondary analysis. At 6 months, the Withdrawers had significantly (P < 0.05) shorter sleep-onset latency and less difficulty in initiating sleep than at baseline and when compared to Nonwithdrawers. Compared to baseline, both Withdrawers and Nonwithdrawers had at 6 months significantly (P < 0.05) less fatigue during the morning and daytime. Stress was alleviated more in Withdrawers than in Nonwithdrawers (P < 0.05). Satisfaction with life and expected health 1 year later improved (P < 0.05) in Withdrawers. In conclusion, sleep disturbances, daytime fatigue and impaired quality of life may resolve within 6 months of BZDA withdrawal. These results encourage withdrawal from chronic use of benzodiazepine-type hypnotics, particularly in older subjects.

© 2018 Nordic Association for the Publication of BCPT (former Nordic Pharmacological Society).

 

 

 

 

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I hear you. You may have to suffer through that awhile, but it does get better. It may not get better as fast as we like or all at once, but it slowly, gradually improves. What sucks with this is we can't really take naps, can we? Although I see as my taper gets lower and lower that I feel calmer in the mornings. Ambien doesn't calm us or sedate us. It's a hypnotic, unless used at high doses. I never used more than 10 mg.
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