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Compounded liquid clonazapam felt like placebo-posting here for more views


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First an explanation of what I’ve been experiencing since I quit smoking with nicotine replacement patches in October in relation to clonazapam. Since then I’ve been falling asleep early in evening after taking 3rd dose of day .5mg k pin dose, been unable to focus on prayers(start praying, loose focus, start over, end up asleep)then waking up to take bed dose a couple of hours later. Also along the way, of quitting smoking, I’ve become more spacey in general & more tired. The fatigue & poor cognition(was already present, but not to this degree)has increased as nicotine decreased until I finally discontinued nicotine 4/20/18. Prior to this(quitting smoking starting 10/5/17) I never fell asleep early, sometimes having insomnia despite bed time dose of clonazapam, 2mg. I’ve also stopped coffee.

 

In summary, I feel that as I’ve dropped the nicotine stimulant, I’ve needed less clonazapam or it has become too much for me @ times, & I didn’t realize what was was going on. But I can’t just start making big cuts, I want to get off quickly, but safely & I do still have anxiety. I surmise that loosing the stimulant has caused the clonazapam to cause increased fatigue & cog fog.

 

More background, I’m so used to & tolerant to clonazapam & take it so regularly & regimental, don’t skip doses, that I don’t feel it’s effects,(like the first time I took .5mg, I could barely feed myself, I was so uncoordinated & then asked to be reduced to .25mg) I just don’t have panic attacks & have less anxiety due in part to the clonazapam & in part by knowing that it will prevent a panic attack. That & it helps my insomnia/sleep. I never felt huge anxiolytics effects from clonazapam. Point being it’s hard to say just from one dose, especially my 3rd dose of the day weather or not it’s working, as I’m so used to it, it’s just my norm. I mean I take it around the clock.  I still feel anxiety many times but never have panic attacks(sometimes will get a mini start to feel one sensation) & sometimes I don’t feel anxiety. I’m not sure how many doses I’d have to skip or what situation I’d have to be in to feel severe anxiety or panic. Lately I feel fatigued & very poor cognition(part of that may be ms, but I don’t & wont know until I eliminate clonazapam, which is going to take a little no time.)

 

So, more than one person warned me that there have been others who’ve had bad experiences with compounded liquid clonazapam as in it didn’t work or put them into withdrawal. Well I finally tried my compounded liquid clonazapam the other evening for my 3rd .5mg dose, out of 3 .5mg doses per day, then 2mg @ bed, and the normal evening grogginess & brain fogginess was not there. At first felt like it hit me fast like taking a shot(that warm sensation or something) then a bit later felt like I didn’t take any medicine at all. I didn’t fall asleep early like I’ve been doing, was up till 10:30pm, after taking sleep dose @ 9:45pm & I was able to pray lucidly, without going around in circles starting over again repeating myself. I was worried I may not fall asleep. So I don’t know if liquid has proper med amount/ absorbable ability enough in it or if it will put me into withdrawal & I won’t know it because Im already on such a high daily dose.

 

Also, I’m tolerant to it now, but I don’t know if I need that 3rd dose anymore, for example I don’t always feel anxious before taking evening dose, I take it preventatively & to stay on schedule, so it could take longer for anxiety/withdrawal to show for that .5mg dose reduction or maybe for any .5mg dose reduction @ this starting point.

 

Since I’m trying to do daily liquid micro taper, & I take such a high total daily dose I feel I won’t know if this liquid isn’t working right until it’s too late as I’m so far just trying to replace one .5mg dose with it. I don’t want to go into withdrawal and don’t want to start something that I may not sense withdrawal from until I’m further down the line & it’s too late. But I so much wanted to try to taper with compounded liquid. There was such a difference though, like medicine vs no medicine, I don’t know what to do.

 

Does anyone know how long & at what taper rate I’d need to go in order to know if it’s putting me in withdrawal or not?

 

Ideas, advice as to how I should proceed would be greatly appreciated.

 

I don’t want to scrap liquid idea if it could work, but don’t want to start something that could harm me & not be the way I’m able to taper anyway.

 

If I can’t do this I’ll have to go dry & will need all the help I can get for that. Am not into crushing pills. Maybe could get into cutting & weighing if explained to where I could understand. Perhaps the filing method, not sure how to do that either. Ugh.. feel stuck. Oh & I won’t be making my own liquid. Not @ this point @ least, maybe @ end of taper if am having a hard time.

 

What do I do about this compounded liquid & figuring out if it’s going to work or not?

 

Thank you, sorry for the novel.

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Hi Scaredie!

 

Ok...I think I have the big picture. I think that because you have given up the nicotine & caffeine stimulants it very well could be the reason you are feeling more sedated. This can actually be a good thing because now you don't have to worry if there is a ever so slight difference between the tablets & the manufactured liquid. btw...when they make the liquid all they do is crush up the exact same tablets that you take orally & put them in a precise amount of liquid.

 

I know this whole process is very difficult for you due to the excessive worrying  :( I wish you could just trust in your God & those of us who have given you sound advice & continue on reducing from your 3rd dose. I think anxiety is a HUGE factor here. The pharmacists are experts & it is highly unlikely they would give you medication that was not prepared properly. Some times it may take a couple of weeks for one to acclimate to the liquid. You are not really taking that much liquid so please continue to take it for your 3rd dose & give yourself a chance to get used to it  :thumbsup:

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Hi Scaredie!

 

Ok...I think I have the big picture. I think that because you have given up the nicotine & caffeine stimulants it very well could be the reason you are feeling more sedated. This can actually be a good thing because now you don't have to worry if there is a ever so slight difference between the tablets & the manufactured liquid. btw...when they make the liquid all they do is crush up the exact same tablets that you take orally & put them in a precise amount of liquid.

 

I know this whole process is very difficult for you due to the excessive worrying  :( I wish you could just trust in your God & those of us who have given you sound advice & continue on reducing from your 3rd dose. I think anxiety is a HUGE factor here. The pharmacists are experts & it is highly unlikely they would give you medication that was not prepared properly. Some times it may take a couple of weeks for one to acclimate to the liquid. You are not really taking that much liquid so please continue to take it for your 3rd dose & give yourself a chance to get used to it  :thumbsup:

Ok, thank you for reading my novel & responding. I will continue to try to work on the 3rd dose & try not to worry. So you think the lessened sedation I experienced was due to the slight difference between tablets & liquid & the time it takes to adjust to liquid?

I’m to keep this refrigerated and shake well. Could the extra viscosity that refrigerating causes make the clonazapam disperse less evenly in the compound? Like maybe I need to super shake it?

Also, am I supposed to to take what’s left in the tip of the syringe? It didn’t push that all out, I had to draw water from the sink into it & repeat push to clean it out-no big deal, just need to know if I’m supposed to complete what’s in the tip, please. Bunches of thanks

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Hi Scaredie!

 

Ok...I think I have the big picture. I think that because you have given up the nicotine & caffeine stimulants it very well could be the reason you are feeling more sedated. This can actually be a good thing because now you don't have to worry if there is a ever so slight difference between the tablets & the manufactured liquid. btw...when they make the liquid all they do is crush up the exact same tablets that you take orally & put them in a precise amount of liquid.

 

I know this whole process is very difficult for you due to the excessive worrying  :( I wish you could just trust in your God & those of us who have given you sound advice & continue on reducing from your 3rd dose. I think anxiety is a HUGE factor here. The pharmacists are experts & it is highly unlikely they would give you medication that was not prepared properly. Some times it may take a couple of weeks for one to acclimate to the liquid. You are not really taking that much liquid so please continue to take it for your 3rd dose & give yourself a chance to get used to it  :thumbsup:

Ok, thank you for reading my novel & responding. I will continue to try to work on the 3rd dose & try not to worry. So you think the lessened sedation I experienced was due to the slight difference between tablets & liquid & the time it takes to adjust to liquid?

I’m to keep this refrigerated and shake well. Could the extra viscosity that refrigerating causes make the clonazapam disperse less evenly in the compound? Like maybe I need to super shake it?

Also, am I supposed to to take what’s left in the tip of the syringe? It didn’t push that all out, I had to draw water from the sink into it & repeat push to clean it out-no big deal, just need to know if I’m supposed to complete what’s in the tip, please. Bunches of thanks

 

That could be part of it, the other part maybe that the liquid Is metabolizing quicker than the tablets. You should adjust to this after a couple of weeks so just stick with it :thumbsup:

 

Just shake it up before you dose & you should be ok... no worries

 

As far as the tiny bit in the tip goes if it is there every time it remains a constant therefore it does not matter..don't worry about this....just continue to clean the syringe out after every dose by pulling water from a container into & push out a couple of times then you will be all set for your next dose.

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Hi Scaredie!

 

Ok...I think I have the big picture. I think that because you have given up the nicotine & caffeine stimulants it very well could be the reason you are feeling more sedated. This can actually be a good thing because now you don't have to worry if there is a ever so slight difference between the tablets & the manufactured liquid. btw...when they make the liquid all they do is crush up the exact same tablets that you take orally & put them in a precise amount of liquid.

 

I know this whole process is very difficult for you due to the excessive worrying  :( I wish you could just trust in your God & those of us who have given you sound advice & continue on reducing from your 3rd dose. I think anxiety is a HUGE factor here. The pharmacists are experts & it is highly unlikely they would give you medication that was not prepared properly. Some times it may take a couple of weeks for one to acclimate to the liquid. You are not really taking that much liquid so please continue to take it for your 3rd dose & give yourself a chance to get used to it  :thumbsup:

I don’t think this pharmacist has much experience with liquid clonazapam, actually. He didn’t know if light would effect it & had to do some research before making it. Seems the norm for the few compounding pharmacists here.

Ok, thank you for reading my novel & responding. I will continue to try to work on the 3rd dose & try not to worry. So you think the lessened sedation I experienced was due to the slight difference between tablets & liquid & the time it takes to adjust to liquid?

I’m to keep this refrigerated and shake well. Could the extra viscosity that refrigerating causes make the clonazapam disperse less evenly in the compound? Like maybe I need to super shake it?

Also, am I supposed to to take what’s left in the tip of the syringe? It didn’t push that all out, I had to draw water from the sink into it & repeat push to clean it out-no big deal, just need to know if I’m supposed to complete what’s in the tip, please. Bunches of thanks

 

That could be part of it, the other part maybe that the liquid Is metabolizing quicker than the tablets. You should adjust to this after a couple of weeks so just stick with it :thumbsup:

 

Just shake it up before you dose & you should be ok... no worries

 

As far as the tiny bit in the tip goes if it is there every time it remains a constant therefore it does not matter..don't worry about this....just continue to clean the syringe out after every dose by pulling water from a container into & push out a couple of times then you will be all set for your next dose.

So your saying that the lessened sedation could be due to metabolizing the liquid quicker than the tablets?

If I’m metabolizing them quicker, won’t they last for a shorter duration and possibly cause inter dose withdrawal?

When you say I should adjust in two weeks to the faster metabolizing, what do you mean?

Will I have same anxiolytic & bed time sleeping effects from liquid during adjustment?

My 3rd dose overlaps with my bed dose, so it could potentially cause sleep issues.

What happens as my body adjusts to liquid compound?

What happens after my body adjusts to liquid compound?

Earlier, you said I wouldn’t have to worry about my concentration being @ .5mg/ml vs .1mg/ml until later. How much later?

Hope this all comes through ok. I put questions after more than one quote area. Not sure how that works.

Much gratitude again😊

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So your saying that the lessened sedation could be due to metabolizing the liquid quicker than the tablets?

It could be a factor...don't worry about this

 

 

If I’m metabolizing them quicker, won’t they last for a shorter duration and possibly cause inter dose withdrawal?

yeah, anything is possible...don't worry about this

 

 

When you say I should adjust in two weeks to the faster metabolizing, what do you mean?

IF you are metabolizing liquid faster your body should adjust/compensate from any minute difference because you are on such a high dose. The long half life of clonazapam allows this....don't worry about this

 

 

Will I have same anxiolytic & bed time sleeping effects from liquid during adjustment?

You may..don't worry about this.

 

 

My 3rd dose overlaps with my bed dose, so it could potentially cause sleep issues.

It may...don't worry about this

 

 

What happens as my body adjusts to liquid compound?

You may turn into a toad....but don't worry about this :laugh:

 

 

What happens after my body adjusts to liquid compound?

You turn into a princess...but don't worry about this either  :)

 

 

Earlier, you said I wouldn’t have to worry about my concentration being @ .5mg/ml vs .1mg/ml until later. How much later?

 

You MAY need to do this once you get towards the end of your taper.... don't worry about this.

 

 

Hope this all comes through ok. I put questions after more than one quote area. Not sure how that works.

Much gratitude again😊

 

:smitten:

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So your saying that the lessened sedation could be due to metabolizing the liquid quicker than the tablets?

It could be a factor...don't worry about this

 

 

If I’m metabolizing them quicker, won’t they last for a shorter duration and possibly cause inter dose withdrawal?

yeah, anything is possible...don't worry about this

 

 

 

When you say I should adjust in two weeks to the faster metabolizing, what do you mean?

IF you are metabolizing liquid faster your body should adjust/compensate from any minute difference because you are on such a high dose. The long half life of clonazapam allows this....don't worry about this

 

 

Will I have same anxiolytic & bed time sleeping effects from liquid during adjustment?

You may..don't worry about this.

 

 

My 3rd dose overlaps with my bed dose, so it could potentially cause sleep issues.

It may...don't worry about this

 

 

What happens as my body adjusts to liquid compound?

You may turn into a toad....but don't worry about this :laugh:

 

 

What happens after my body adjusts to liquid compound?

You turn into a princess...but don't worry about this either  :)

 

 

Earlier, you said I wouldn’t have to worry about my concentration being @ .5mg/ml vs .1mg/ml until later. How much later?

 

You MAY need to do this once you get towards the end of your taper.... don't worry about this.

 

 

Hope this all comes through ok. I put questions after more than one quote area. Not sure how that works.

Much gratitude again😊

 

:smitten:

Ok, so your what your saying is ‘ don’t worry about anything’?😂 thanks dear.Have a good day😊

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:thumbsup::smitten:

When you say I should adjust in two weeks to the faster metabolizing, what do you mean?

 

IF you are metabolizing liquid faster your body should adjust/compensate from any minute difference because you are on such a high dose. The long half life of clonazapam allows this....don't worry about this

I know you said don’t worry about this, but I feel the need to understand.

I’m on a high dose, now, but what about as 3rd dose is gone & so on reducing throughout taper? As far as the long half life goes & being on liquid compound?

For example the half life may be long, but the effectiveness of a dose is about 6 hours on tablets as far as I can tell & remember from when I could feel them.

On liquid: If I’m metabolizing faster am I shortening the half life? Am I shortening the duration of action of each dose? Thank you😊

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:thumbsup::smitten:

When you say I should adjust in two weeks to the faster metabolizing, what do you mean?

 

IF you are metabolizing liquid faster your body should adjust/compensate from any minute difference because you are on such a high dose. The long half life of clonazapam allows this....don't worry about this

I know you said don’t worry about this, but I feel the need to understand.

I’m on a high dose, now, but what about as 3rd dose is gone & so on reducing throughout taper? As far as the long half life goes & being on liquid compound?

For example the half life may be long, but the effectiveness of a dose is about 6 hours on tablets as far as I can tell & remember from when I could feel them.

On liquid: If I’m metabolizing faster am I shortening the half life? Am I shortening the duration of action of each dose? Thank you😊

 

"IF" is the big factor here....you will not know until you try  :thumbsup:  :smitten:

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:thumbsup::smitten:

When you say I should adjust in two weeks to the faster metabolizing, what do you mean?

 

IF you are metabolizing liquid faster your body should adjust/compensate from any minute difference because you are on such a high dose. The long half life of clonazapam allows this....don't worry about this

I know you said don’t worry about this, but I feel the need to understand.

I’m on a high dose, now, but what about as 3rd dose is gone & so on reducing throughout taper? As far as the long half life goes & being on liquid compound?

For example the half life may be long, but the effectiveness of a dose is about 6 hours on tablets as far as I can tell & remember from when I could feel them.

On liquid: If I’m metabolizing faster am I shortening the half life? Am I shortening the duration of action of each dose? Thank you😊

 

"IF" is the big factor here....you will not know until you try  :thumbsup:  :smitten:

Thank you, Bella. I hope you don’t mind I asked Jim Hawk if he could give his imput on this too. He doesn’t have all of the details that I gave you, just that liquid felt like placebo. I’m not second guessing you, just different communication styles sometimes come across in a more understandable way. And you know my my need to understand things. Eternally grateful for all your help & hanging with me.😊

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Hello Scardie,

 

I truly believe that your fear of what "might" happen may be a self fulfilling prophesy.

It is hard not to blame everything on the withdrawals, but some of the symptoms might not be withdrawal at all, just symptoms of normal life.

My psychiatrist explained to me that what i might be feeling are things that i have felt all along, i am just now hyper aware of everything that goes on in my body and mind, whereas before, if i felt a bit nauseous/tired/anxious i would just barely notice it as it was a part of normal everyday life, i now put too much focus on it and give that feeling too much space in my thoughts so it gets blown way out of proportion.

You say that your sleep pattern changed, well that isn't necissaruly a result of the liquid clonazepam, it might be that your stress over starting the liquid caused a bit of insomnia and anxiety, not the fact that there was much difference in the dose. Or maybe you were just going through a rough patch of sleep, i know that in the past, and currently, my sleep has not always been exactly the same every single day, some nights i'm not tired and some nights i am very sleepy. It has nothing to do with benzo's as this same thing has happened to me, and i am sure many others, before we even touched a benzo.

As an example, my arm hurts today, it is def. nerve related because when i press on my elbow, it shoots pain up and down my whole arm, but i'm not freaking out that this is a withdrawal symptom, or a result of taking benzos. I have no idea why my arm/elbow is sore, yes, it may be benzo related, but i just as likely could have banged it on something and not remembered. In any event, worrying if it is related is not going to do anything to change the fact that it hurts.

You ask if there is any way to know when or if withdrawals will hit or if liquid will work for you, the only way to get the answers to these questions is to do it, nobody can answer.

 

 

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Hello Scardie,

 

I truly believe that your fear of what "might" happen may be a self fulfilling prophesy.

 

...a really common phenomenon!

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Hello Scardie,

 

I truly believe that your fear of what "might" happen may be a self fulfilling prophesy.

It is hard not to blame everything on the withdrawals, but some of the symptoms might not be withdrawal at all, just symptoms of normal life.

My psychiatrist explained to me that what i might be feeling are things that i have felt all along, i am just now hyper aware of everything that goes on in my body and mind, whereas before, if i felt a bit nauseous/tired/anxious i would just barely notice it as it was a part of normal everyday life, i now put too much focus on it and give that feeling too much space in my thoughts so it gets blown way out of proportion.

You say that your sleep pattern changed, well that isn't necissaruly a result of the liquid clonazepam, it might be that your stress over starting the liquid caused a bit of insomnia and anxiety, not the fact that there was much difference in the dose. Or maybe you were just going through a rough patch of sleep, i know that in the past, and currently, my sleep has not always been exactly the same every single day, some nights i'm not tired and some nights i am very sleepy. It has nothing to do with benzo's as this same thing has happened to me, and i am sure many others, before we even touched a benzo.

As an example, my arm hurts today, it is def. nerve related because when i press on my elbow, it shoots pain up and down my whole arm, but i'm not freaking out that this is a withdrawal symptom, or a result of taking benzos. I have no idea why my arm/elbow is sore, yes, it may be benzo related, but i just as likely could have banged it on something and not remembered. In any event, worrying if it is related is not going to do anything to change the fact that it hurts.

You ask if there is any way to know when or if withdrawals will hit or if liquid will work for you, the only way to get the answers to these questions is to do it, nobody can answer.

Thank you for your insight & see where your coming from. I havnt really tapered yet. So I not blaming anything on withdrawals yet. Just tried that one liquid dose & it felt like placebo compared to tablets. It wasn’t enough time for me to go into withdrawal. The whole point of doing liquid titration is to avoid withdrawal & be precise. If I don’t understand this bioavailability-half life stuff with the liquid & don’t know if it will put me into withdrawal, it defeats its purpose. If it puts me into withdrawal by me trying to see if it will, then I could kindle & have an unecesarry withdrawal.

 

Are you still on Effexor & seroquel?

What i# the seroquel for?

Are you dry or liquid tapering benzo?

Are you weighing pills?

 

Thanks for your thoughtful kind concern. Be well

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Are you still on Effexor & seroquel?

What i# the seroquel for?

Are you dry or liquid tapering benzo?

Are you weighing pills?

 

Thanks for your thoughtful kind concern. Be well

 

Hi Scardie,

 

Yes, i am still on effexor and seroquel. The seroquel was added back in March 2017 when my first attempt at tapering backfired and my psychiatrist added it to my daily dose to help with the anxiety.

I am dry cutting my clonazepam, i'm not weighing, just cutting the pills up into quarters as best i can.

I didn't mean that you had withdrawals from that one dose of liquid, just that you may have been expecting the liquid to be different from the pills, so you focused on any minute changes, and these may or may not have been a result of the liquid.

Nobody is ever going to know what type or speed of taper will or will not put them into withdrawals, even if you know all of the information regarding bio-availability and half life etc.

I don't think that you have to worry about kindling if you try the liquid for one dose a day and then find it doesn't work so have to switch back to pills.

Getting over the fear of what might happen is the first step of this process. There a millions of things that could go wrong as well of millions of things that could not go wrong.

 

If you are truly ready to start the taper, you will start it, but if you are not ready there will always be a reason not to do it.

 

Are you seeing a therapist or getting any sort of help for your anxiety and mental health other than the pills?

If you don't have any skills to deal with your mental health other than taking pills, when you stop taking pills your previous issues will still be there. The Benzo did not fix your anxiety etc. it just numbed you enough so that you didn't care about it.

 

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Are you still on Effexor & seroquel?

What i# the seroquel for?

Are you dry or liquid tapering benzo?

Are you weighing pills?

 

Thanks for your thoughtful kind concern. Be well

 

Hi Scardie,

 

Yes, i am still on effexor and seroquel. The seroquel was added back in March 2017 when my first attempt at tapering backfired and my psychiatrist added it to my daily dose to help with the anxiety.

I am dry cutting my clonazepam, i'm not weighing, just cutting the pills up into quarters as best i can.

I didn't mean that you had withdrawals from that one dose of liquid, just that you may have been expecting the liquid to be different from the pills, so you focused on any minute changes, and these may or may not have been a result of the liquid.

Nobody is ever going to know what type or speed of taper will or will not put them into withdrawals, even if you know all of the information regarding bio-availability and half life etc.

I don't think that you have to worry about kindling if you try the liquid for one dose a day and then find it doesn't work so have to switch back to pills.

Getting over the fear of what might happen is the first step of this process. There a millions of things that could go wrong as well of millions of things that could not go wrong.

 

If you are truly ready to start the taper, you will start it, but if you are not ready there will always be a reason not to do it.

 

Are you seeing a therapist or getting any sort of help for your anxiety and mental health other than the pills?

If you don't have any skills to deal with your mental health other than taking pills, when you stop taking pills your previous issues will still be there. The Benzo did not fix your anxiety etc. it just numbed you enough so that you didn't care about it.

Thank you. Do you have side effects from seroquel? Effexor? Is the seroquel helping your anxiety?

I appreciate & understand everything you’ve said here.

 

I’m not seeing a therapist, but I do need one. Researching one, making a decision of whom to choose(very hard for me lately, making decisions). That is a big part of my problem. The treatment(medication wise)resistant depression that I’ve had for years.( although when I’ve been on them & they’ve partially worked or worked with side effects, I can’t stand the sleepiness, lack of motivation side effect & of course the withdrawal) I’ve been off them for @ least a year so I thought the next best thing I can do is to taper off benzos as they can blunt all your good chemicals & therefore cause depression. Plus, like I said, I’m feeling like maybe I’m over medicated benzo wise since quitting smoking.

 

So yes I’ll work to get to a therapist & maybe the same scenario is going on with me not being able to cope without antidepressants as will happen with not being able to cope without benzos. I’ve been on & off Psych Meds for years, but the last 2 attempts since 2010, nothing took & was tolerable except lexapro for a very short time, with bad withdrawal upon discontinuation. now I’m trying to cope on my own. Although it’s a long process, I hope loosing the benzo will improve my depression, fatigue, & cognitive problems.

 

There is definitely a deifferece between the liquid & tablet clonazapam. The night I took it & had mental clarity & much less fatigue was not imagined & the next nights I went back to more fatigue & much less mental clarity.

Thanks

 

 

 

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Are you still on Effexor & seroquel?

What i# the seroquel for?

Are you dry or liquid tapering benzo?

Are you weighing pills?

 

Thanks for your thoughtful kind concern. Be well

 

Hi Scardie,

 

Yes, i am still on effexor and seroquel. The seroquel was added back in March 2017 when my first attempt at tapering backfired and my psychiatrist added it to my daily dose to help with the anxiety.

I am dry cutting my clonazepam, i'm not weighing, just cutting the pills up into quarters as best i can.

I didn't mean that you had withdrawals from that one dose of liquid, just that you may have been expecting the liquid to be different from the pills, so you focused on any minute changes, and these may or may not have been a result of the liquid.

Nobody is ever going to know what type or speed of taper will or will not put them into withdrawals, even if you know all of the information regarding bio-availability and half life etc.

I don't think that you have to worry about kindling if you try the liquid for one dose a day and then find it doesn't work so have to switch back to pills.

Getting over the fear of what might happen is the first step of this process. There a millions of things that could go wrong as well of millions of things that could not go wrong.

 

If you are truly ready to start the taper, you will start it, but if you are not ready there will always be a reason not to do it.

 

Are you seeing a therapist or getting any sort of help for your anxiety and mental health other than the pills?

If you don't have any skills to deal with your mental health other than taking pills, when you stop taking pills your previous issues will still be there. The Benzo did not fix your anxiety etc. it just numbed you enough so that you didn't care about it.

Thank you. Do you have side effects from seroquel? Effexor? Is the seroquel helping your anxiety?

I appreciate & understand everything you’ve said here.

 

I’m not seeing a therapist, but I do need one. Researching one, making a decision of whom to choose(very hard for me lately, making decisions). That is a big part of my problem. The treatment(medication wise)resistant depression that I’ve had for years.( although when I’ve been on them & they’ve partially worked or worked with side effects, I can’t stand the sleepiness, lack of motivation side effect & of course the withdrawal) I’ve been off them for @ least a year so I thought the next best thing I can do is to taper off benzos as they can blunt all your good chemicals & therefore cause depression. Plus, like I said, I’m feeling like maybe I’m over medicated benzo wise since quitting smoking.

 

So yes I’ll work to get to a therapist & maybe the same scenario is going on with me not being able to cope without antidepressants as will happen with not being able to cope without benzos. I’ve been on & off Psych Meds for years, but the last 2 attempts since 2010, nothing took & was tolerable except lexapro for a very short time, with bad withdrawal upon discontinuation. now I’m trying to cope on my own. Although it’s a long process, I hope loosing the benzo will improve my depression, fatigue, & cognitive problems.

 

There is definitely a deifferece between the liquid & tablet clonazapam. The night I took it & had mental clarity & much less fatigue was not imagined & the next nights I went back to more fatigue & much less mental clarity.

Thanks

 

Hi Scaredie!

 

Think this is a great idea! A good  therapist will help you to not only to understand "why" but will also give you the tools you need to learn how to cope with stressful life situations.

 

Just want to share that I suddenly "developed" & was diagnosed with "clinical depression" within a year of starting benzo's. I never once questioned the doctors diagnosis & just tried to accept that it was all part of my "PTSD". For years on end I lay in bed staring at the walls wishing the end would come. Finally I had enough (after 20 years) & said to myself "I will get off of ALL medications & other substances & see if this helps. So my journey began.

 

Guess what...the depression lifted early on in my taper. Not only the depression, fatigue & cognative issues resolved, but a host of other "diagnosed disorders" magically wen away as well.

 

So I agree, the best thing for you to do is seek counsel & get off benzo poison & just see if you feel better. You can always go back on alternative meds if it does not work out.

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Are you still on Effexor & seroquel?

What i# the seroquel for?

Are you dry or liquid tapering benzo?

Are you weighing pills?

 

Thanks for your thoughtful kind concern. Be well

 

 

Hi Scardie,

 

Yes, i am still on effexor and seroquel. The seroquel was added back in March 2017 when my first attempt at tapering backfired and my psychiatrist added it to my daily dose to help with the anxiety.

I am dry cutting my clonazepam, i'm not weighing, just cutting the pills up into quarters as best i can.

I didn't mean that you had withdrawals from that one dose of liquid, just that you may have been expecting the liquid to be different from the pills, so you focused on any minute changes, and these may or may not have been a result of the liquid.

Nobody is ever going to know what type or speed of taper will or will not put them into withdrawals, even if you know all of the information regarding bio-availability and half life etc.

I don't think that you have to worry about kindling if you try the liquid for one dose a day and then find it doesn't work so have to switch back to pills.

Getting over the fear of what might happen is the first step of this process. There a millions of things that could go wrong as well of millions of things that could not go wrong.

 

If you are truly ready to start the taper, you will start it, but if you are not ready there will always be a reason not to do it.

 

Are you seeing a therapist or getting any sort of help for your anxiety and mental health other than the pills?

If you don't have any skills to deal with your mental health other than taking pills, when you stop taking pills your previous issues will still be there. The Benzo did not fix your anxiety etc. it just numbed you enough so that you didn't care about it.

Thank you. Do you have side effects from seroquel? Effexor? Is the seroquel helping your anxiety?

I appreciate & understand everything you’ve said here.

 

I’m not seeing a therapist, but I do need one. Researching one, making a decision of whom to choose(very hard for me lately, making decisions). That is a big part of my problem. The treatment(medication wise)resistant depression that I’ve had for years.( although when I’ve been on them & they’ve partially worked or worked with side effects, I can’t stand the sleepiness, lack of motivation side effect & of course the withdrawal) I’ve been off them for @ least a year so I thought the next best thing I can do is to taper off benzos as they can blunt all your good chemicals & therefore cause depression. Plus, like I said, I’m feeling like maybe I’m over medicated benzo wise since quitting smoking.

 

So yes I’ll work to get to a therapist & maybe the same scenario is going on with me not being able to cope without antidepressants as will happen with not being able to cope without benzos. I’ve been on & off Psych Meds for years, but the last 2 attempts since 2010, nothing took & was tolerable except lexapro for a very short time, with bad withdrawal upon discontinuation. now I’m trying to cope on my own. Although it’s a long process, I hope loosing the benzo will improve my depression, fatigue, & cognitive problems.

 

There is definitely a deifferece between the liquid & tablet clonazapam. The night I took it & had mental clarity & much less fatigue was not imagined & the next nights I went back to more fatigue & much less mental clarity.

Thanks

 

Hi Scaredie!

 

Think this is a great idea! A good  therapist will help you to not only to understand "why" but will also give you the tools you need to learn how to cope with stressful life situations.

 

Just want to share that I suddenly "developed" & was diagnosed with "clinical depression" within a year of starting benzo's. I never once questioned the doctors diagnosis & just tried to accept that it was all part of my "PTSD". For years on end I lay in bed staring at the walls wishing the end would come. Finally I had enough (after 20 years) & said to myself "I will get off of ALL medications & other substances & see if this helps. So my journey began.

 

Guess what...the depression lifted early on in my taper. Not only the depression, fatigue & cognative issues resolved, but a host of other "diagnosed disorders" magically wen away as well.

 

So I agree, the best thing for you to do is seek counsel & get off benzo poison & just see if you feel better. You can always go back on alternative meds if it does not work out.

Awe, thanks so much, Bella for sharing your story. I’m sorry to hear of your suffering. The laying in bed wishing the end would come resonates with me.

 

What an inspiration your story is for me to persue therapy & taper.

 

It’s been hard with all of my current symptoms, add in indecisiveness, to not want to run back & try another psych med(although my track record with them is horrible).

 

What really good timing it is for you to have chimed in. Thank you be well😊

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Awe, thanks so much, Bella for sharing your story. I’m sorry to hear of your suffering. The laying in bed wishing the end would come resonates with me.

 

What an inspiration your story is for me to persue therapy & taper.

 

It’s been hard with all of my current symptoms, add in indecisiveness, to not want to run back & try another psych med(although my track record with them is horrible).

 

What really good timing it is for you to have chimed in. Thank you be well😊

 

You are welcome Scaredie!

 

I am glad my story was inspirational. I truly believe once you get started with a a therapist that you can relate to & you begin your taper, you will find that things slowly will start to fall into place for you. Sometimes these medications can really mess with our functionality to the point we barely recognize what our baseline was prior to the medication. Hopefully things will turn out good for you too....hang in there & never loose hope my friend :smitten:

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Hi Scaredie!

 

Ok...I think I have the big picture. I think that because you have given up the nicotine & caffeine stimulants it very well could be the reason you are feeling more sedated. This can actually be a good thing because now you don't have to worry if there is a ever so slight difference between the tablets & the manufactured liquid. btw...when they make the liquid all they do is crush up the exact same tablets that you take orally & put them in a precise amount of liquid.

 

I know this whole process is very difficult for you due to the excessive worrying  :( I wish you could just trust in your God & those of us who have given you sound advice & continue on reducing from your 3rd dose. I think anxiety is a HUGE factor here. The pharmacists are experts & it is highly unlikely they would give you medication that was not prepared properly. Some times it may take a couple of weeks for one to acclimate to the liquid. You are not really taking that much liquid so please continue to take it for your 3rd dose & give yourself a chance to get used to it  :thumbsup:

 

I hesitate to post as I don't want to scare Scardie BUT

 

The pharmacists may be experts but I am one of the ones who had a horrific experience with professionally compounded klonopin. It was a nightmare. After three weeks I was suicidal, missing work constantly, abandoned that plan, went back to the tablets and was fine. Others have had the same experience with compounded klonopin.

 

So if you are noticing a difference, I would just pay attention to it. I personally really wanted it to work--I thought this would be the easiest way off. It just didn't work at all.

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Hi Scaredie!

 

Ok...I think I have the big picture. I think that because you have given up the nicotine & caffeine stimulants it very well could be the reason you are feeling more sedated. This can actually be a good thing because now you don't have to worry if there is a ever so slight difference between the tablets & the manufactured liquid. btw...when they make the liquid all they do is crush up the exact same tablets that you take orally & put them in a precise amount of liquid.

 

I know this whole process is very difficult for you due to the excessive worrying  :( I wish you could just trust in your God & those of us who have given you sound advice & continue on reducing from your 3rd dose. I think anxiety is a HUGE factor here. The pharmacists are experts & it is highly unlikely they would give you medication that was not prepared properly. Some times it may take a couple of weeks for one to acclimate to the liquid. You are not really taking that much liquid so please continue to take it for your 3rd dose & give yourself a chance to get used to it  :thumbsup:

 

I hesitate to post as I don't want to scare Scardie BUT

 

The pharmacists may be experts but I am one of the ones who had a horrific experience with professionally compounded klonopin. It was a nightmare. After three weeks I was suicidal, missing work constantly, abandoned that plan, went back to the tablets and was fine. Others have had the same experience with compounded klonopin.

 

So if you are noticing a difference, I would just pay attention to it. I personally really wanted it to work--I thought this would be the easiest way off. It just didn't work at all.

Thank you, NJ. What differences did you notice along the way?

 

We’re you on as high of a dose as I am, like where I might not notice withdrawal effects till too late?

 

Do you think you could help me with gram scale if I can’t do liquid?

Be well

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Thank you. Do you have side effects from seroquel? Effexor? Is the seroquel helping your anxiety?

I appreciate & understand everything you’ve said here.

 

I’m not seeing a therapist, but I do need one. Researching one, making a decision of whom to choose(very hard for me lately, making decisions). That is a big part of my problem. The treatment(medication wise)resistant depression that I’ve had for years.( although when I’ve been on them & they’ve partially worked or worked with side effects, I can’t stand the sleepiness, lack of motivation side effect & of course the withdrawal) I’ve been off them for @ least a year so I thought the next best thing I can do is to taper off benzos as they can blunt all your good chemicals & therefore cause depression. Plus, like I said, I’m feeling like maybe I’m over medicated benzo wise since quitting smoking.

 

So yes I’ll work to get to a therapist & maybe the same scenario is going on with me not being able to cope without antidepressants as will happen with not being able to cope without benzos. I’ve been on & off Psych Meds for years, but the last 2 attempts since 2010, nothing took & was tolerable except lexapro for a very short time, with bad withdrawal upon discontinuation. now I’m trying to cope on my own. Although it’s a long process, I hope loosing the benzo will improve my depression, fatigue, & cognitive problems.

 

There is definitely a deifferece between the liquid & tablet clonazapam. The night I took it & had mental clarity & much less fatigue was not imagined & the next nights I went back to more fatigue & much less mental clarity.

Thanks

 

Hi Scardie,

 

I am not sure what is helping my anxiety, it could be a combo of all the things, the Effexor was given for anxiety as well, not depression. But i currently don't suffer from any abnormal anxiety, but i am quite aware of my mental health, i do a lot of work on myself so that i can be off of all drugs one day and be able to have it under control. I see a therapist once a week and do a lot of meditation, exercise and eating right etc.

i had some fairly horrific side effects when i very first started the effexor, i thought that i was actually going crazy and dying, and was prepared to end up back on the psych ward for a while. It was horrific, mental as well as physical symptoms. However, since i had initially started on 75mg, my psychiatrist felt that if i just lowered the dose to 37.5mg for a few weeks, my body would adjust and the side effects would go away. They eased almost immediately after lowering the dose and when i increased back up to 75mg i had no ill effects and still don't.

I can see no side effects from the seroquel either, however i am on a very small dose, 25mb total per day.

 

I did not mean at all that you had imagined how the liquid clonazepam effected you, only that you may have been hyper aware of it, so noticed it a lot more that you would have. And i wonder why if you had more mental clarity and less fatigue, do you see that as a bad thing? Is that not what you are trying to accomplish?

 

As for finding a therapist, i wouldn't put too much effort into researching just the right one, maybe ask for a few recommendations from your doctor or family or friends and just give it a try? if you meet and don't feel like they are a good fit for you, there is no rule that you have to go back. I don't know where you are, but where i live, we have a mental health department that provides free therapy as well as support groups and education on mental health, maybe there might be something along those lines in your community? i think it might be worth looking into.

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Thank you. Do you have side effects from seroquel? Effexor? Is the seroquel helping your anxiety?

I appreciate & understand everything you’ve said here.

 

I’m not seeing a therapist, but I do need one. Researching one, making a decision of whom to choose(very hard for me lately, making decisions). That is a big part of my problem. The treatment(medication wise)resistant depression that I’ve had for years.( although when I’ve been on them & they’ve partially worked or worked with side effects, I can’t stand the sleepiness, lack of motivation side effect & of course the withdrawal) I’ve been off them for @ least a year so I thought the next best thing I can do is to taper off benzos as they can blunt all your good chemicals & therefore cause depression. Plus, like I said, I’m feeling like maybe I’m over medicated benzo wise since quitting smoking.

 

So yes I’ll work to get to a therapist & maybe the same scenario is going on with me not being able to cope without antidepressants as will happen with not being able to cope without benzos. I’ve been on & off Psych Meds for years, but the last 2 attempts since 2010, nothing took & was tolerable except lexapro for a very short time, with bad withdrawal upon discontinuation. now I’m trying to cope on my own. Although it’s a long process, I hope loosing the benzo will improve my depression, fatigue, & cognitive problems.

 

There is definitely a deifferece between the liquid & tablet clonazapam. The night I took it & had mental clarity & much less fatigue was not imagined & the next nights I went back to more fatigue & much less mental clarity.

Thanks

 

Hi Scardie,

 

I am not sure what is helping my anxiety, it could be a combo of all the things, the Effexor was given for anxiety as well, not depression. But i currently don't suffer from any abnormal anxiety, but i am quite aware of my mental health, i do a lot of work on myself so that i can be off of all drugs one day and be able to have it under control. I see a therapist once a week and do a lot of meditation, exercise and eating right etc.

i had some fairly horrific side effects when i very first started the effexor, i thought that i was actually going crazy and dying, and was prepared to end up back on the psych ward for a while. It was horrific, mental as well as physical symptoms. However, since i had initially started on 75mg, my psychiatrist felt that if i just lowered the dose to 37.5mg for a few weeks, my body would adjust and the side effects would go away. They eased almost immediately after lowering the dose and when i increased back up to 75mg i had no ill effects and still don't.

I can see no side effects from the seroquel either, however i am on a very small dose, 25mb total per day.

 

I did not mean at all that you had imagined how the liquid clonazepam effected you, only that you may have been hyper aware of it, so noticed it a lot more that you would have. And i wonder why if you had more mental clarity and less fatigue, do you see that as a bad thing? Is that not what you are trying to accomplish?

 

As for finding a therapist, i wouldn't put too much effort into researching just the right one, maybe ask for a few recommendations from your doctor or family or friends and just give it a try? if you meet and don't feel like they are a good fit for you, there is no rule that you have to go back. I don't know where you are, but where i live, we have a mental health department that provides free therapy as well as support groups and education on mental health, maybe there might be something along those lines in your community? i think it might be worth looking into.

Thanks for the wonderful response. I’m glad to here you’re doing so well & it certainly sounds like you have a good routine going. Would love to learn about meditation. If I thought there was a psych med that I hadn’t tried & failed or couldn’t tolerate already, that would help me, I’d be on that wagon, as I’m suffering, driving all around me nuts too.

 

I wake every morning dreading the day ahead, every day(I do believe that’s depression, perhaps some anxiety mixed in) not to say I can’t overcome it in other ways, just much harder to get self to do things that I need in this state.

 

You said-

And i wonder why if you had more mental clarity and less fatigue, do you see that as a bad thing? Is that not what you are trying to accomplish?

My answer: of course that’s what I want to accomplish, but not because I’m using a liquid compound that isn’t adequate & May put me into withdrawal without my knowledge because I’m on such a high dose. You see, I tried to explain that those were mostly the symptoms I felt, but I’m on so much throughout the day around the clock, I don’t think a subpar dose would do much more than that. Understand now?

 

Appreciate your continued support. Be well

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Hi Scaredie!

 

Ok...I think I have the big picture. I think that because you have given up the nicotine & caffeine stimulants it very well could be the reason you are feeling more sedated. This can actually be a good thing because now you don't have to worry if there is a ever so slight difference between the tablets & the manufactured liquid. btw...when they make the liquid all they do is crush up the exact same tablets that you take orally & put them in a precise amount of liquid.

 

I know this whole process is very difficult for you due to the excessive worrying  :( I wish you could just trust in your God & those of us who have given you sound advice & continue on reducing from your 3rd dose. I think anxiety is a HUGE factor here. The pharmacists are experts & it is highly unlikely they would give you medication that was not prepared properly. Some times it may take a couple of weeks for one to acclimate to the liquid. You are not really taking that much liquid so please continue to take it for your 3rd dose & give yourself a chance to get used to it  :thumbsup:

 

I hesitate to post as I don't want to scare Scardie BUT

 

The pharmacists may be experts but I am one of the ones who had a horrific experience with professionally compounded klonopin. It was a nightmare. After three weeks I was suicidal, missing work constantly, abandoned that plan, went back to the tablets and was fine. Others have had the same experience with compounded klonopin.

 

So if you are noticing a difference, I would just pay attention to it. I personally really wanted it to work--I thought this would be the easiest way off. It just didn't work at all.

Thank you, NJ. What differences did you notice along the way?

 

We’re you on as high of a dose as I am, like where I might not notice withdrawal effects till too late?

 

Do you think you could help me with gram scale if I can’t do liquid?

Be well

 

Scardie,

 

I felt like I was taking nothing when I took the compounded klonopin. It was from a very reputable pharmacist. I only mention this again because I am not the only one to have this experience.

 

I began my journey at 1 mg of klonopin. I am not sure what you mean might not notice withdrawal effects until too late. It is never too late. You can always updose if symptoms become unmanageable.

 

I have responded to some of your other threads about the gram scale, and there is a ton of info on this site. You just shave or use a razor or whatever to make the pill smaller. The smaller the cuts, normally the easier it is to tolerate.

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Hi Scaredie!

 

Ok...I think I have the big picture. I think that because you have given up the nicotine & caffeine stimulants it very well could be the reason you are feeling more sedated. This can actually be a good thing because now you don't have to worry if there is a ever so slight difference between the tablets & the manufactured liquid. btw...when they make the liquid all they do is crush up the exact same tablets that you take orally & put them in a precise amount of liquid.

 

I know this whole process is very difficult for you due to the excessive worrying  :( I wish you could just trust in your God & those of us who have given you sound advice & continue on reducing from your 3rd dose. I think anxiety is a HUGE factor here. The pharmacists are experts & it is highly unlikely they would give you medication that was not prepared properly. Some times it may take a couple of weeks for one to acclimate to the liquid. You are not really taking that much liquid so please continue to take it for your 3rd dose & give yourself a chance to get used to it  :thumbsup:

 

I hesitate to post as I don't want to scare Scardie BUT

 

The pharmacists may be experts but I am one of the ones who had a horrific experience with professionally compounded klonopin. It was a nightmare. After three weeks I was suicidal, missing work constantly, abandoned that plan, went back to the tablets and was fine. Others have had the same experience with compounded klonopin.

 

So if you are noticing a difference, I would just pay attention to it. I personally really wanted it to work--I thought this would be the easiest way off. It just didn't work at all.

Thank you, NJ. What differences did you notice along the way?

 

We’re you on as high of a dose as I am, like where I might not notice withdrawal effects till too late?

 

Do you think you could help me with gram scale if I can’t do liquid?

Be well

 

Scardie,

 

I felt like I was taking nothing when I took the compounded klonopin. It was from a very reputable pharmacist. I only mention this again because I am not the only one to have this experience.

 

I began my journey at 1 mg of klonopin. I am not sure what you mean might not notice withdrawal effects until too late. It is never too late. You can always updose if symptoms become unmanageable.

 

I have responded to some of your other threads about the gram scale, and there is a ton of info on this site. You just shave or use a razor or whatever to make the pill smaller. The smaller the cuts, normally the easier it is to tolerate.

Thank you for taking the time to respond!

 

Were you taking your dose as all liquid?

 

What I meant by not notice withdrawal effects until too late is that since I’m only taking liquid in place of one .5mg dose, the rest of my doses remaining tablets .5mg 6a .5mg 12pm [?6pm liquid] & 2mg 9:45pm, & I’m on such a high daily dose, that I may not notice the suttleties of withdrawal or lack of effect until I’m in bad withdrawal. That scares me.

 

I really want liquid to work too...

 

I’ve forgotten everything about the scale. I’ll re-figure it out if that ends up being where I end up. I’ll have to reach out to others again. Appreciate all of your help & concern & the heads up about the pharmacists. I’m too scared to try & make my own liquid. Be well, much gratitude

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