Author Topic: How would I use Valium as a crossover while tapering off Clonazepam?  (Read 564 times)

[Buddie]

Re: How would I use Valium as a crossover while tapering off Clonazepam?
« Reply #20 on: April 28, 2018, 11:13:22 pm »
To clarify, the first step would be to reduce the clonazepam in half (to 0.125 mg) while at the same time adding 2.5 mg valium. That keeps your total benzo dose about the same. You would take that same amount every day for at least a week, and see how you feel to figure out next step from there.
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: How would I use Valium as a crossover while tapering off Clonazepam?
« Reply #21 on: April 29, 2018, 02:00:52 am »
Another option would be to gradually replace one with the other. Maybe try this gradual substitution for a week then hold & see how you feel as [...] suggests.

Here is a guide that gradually replaces the Clonazapam with the Valium using all liquid.  :thumbsup:

      Click on image
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: How would I use Valium as a crossover while tapering off Clonazepam?
« Reply #22 on: April 29, 2018, 11:20:59 am »
To clarify, the first step would be to reduce the clonazepam in half (to 0.125 mg) while at the same time adding 2.5 mg valium. That keeps your total benzo dose about the same. You would take that same amount every day for at least a week, and see how you feel to figure out next step from there.

So you are suggesting that I reduce my usual dose of "C" in half all at once while adding Valium? Aren't they two different drugs that treat different things?  That is kind of a scary thought to me. I'll keep it in mind but will have to research a bit on that. Thank you. I'm frustrated!!! :'(
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: How would I use Valium as a crossover while tapering off Clonazepam?
« Reply #23 on: April 29, 2018, 11:48:41 am »
Thank you [...]! So I'm confused. Would I be tapering BOTH Clonazepam and Valium at the same time and how many ml's of liquid would I be starting with? You know I'm NOT good with math... and on this taper, fuzzy brain along with severe sleep deprivation I can't think very clearly so if you have time can you spell this out for me? I see how busy you are on this forum and you don't need me adding to your busyness. I'll be holding on 0.25 for a couple of months so take your time.  I'm just trying to figure out how to survive this horrible insomnia at the current time while trying not to updose.

Also, I just posted that I'm about ready to updose. I can't get into my pdoc for a couple of months and I'm starting to get really ill from not sleeping. I feel horrible... and I can't function this way. My boys are saying that I've changed.. everyone notices how unhappy I am. Im not working right now thank God but I will not be able to work like this. I work in healthcare and have to do CPR if required. There's no freaking way! Im really discouraged tonight... ready to jump ship and updose! I desperately need sleep! So dang tired and unhappy!!  :-[

Hi RR-

Sorry you are having such a difficult time. This whole process can be very draining. Do what you have tpo do to remain functional.

This tentative plan is a way to slowly introduce Valium while slowly tapering the Klonopin in equal ammounts. This particular example plan takes 30 days to complete the substitution/crossover. This plan is only a suggestion. The substitution can take as long as you like. The plan above has you reducing the Klonopin while adding the Valium a little bit everyday instead of all at once. See how the numbers in the Klonopin column decrease while the numbers in the Valium column increase consecutively? The second part of this plan is the taper from the Valium once you are fully crossed over. This can also be changed to any rate/time frame that you want to try.

Let me know your thoughts & we can tweak this so you have a solid plan to share with your doctor.
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: How would I use Valium as a crossover while tapering off Clonazepam?
« Reply #24 on: April 29, 2018, 11:59:05 am »
Thank you [...]! So I'm confused. Would I be tapering BOTH Clonazepam and Valium at the same time and how many ml's of liquid would I be starting with? You know I'm NOT good with math... and on this taper, fuzzy brain along with severe sleep deprivation I can't think very clearly so if you have time can you spell this out for me? I see how busy you are on this forum and you don't need me adding to your busyness. I'll be holding on 0.25 for a couple of months so take your time.  I'm just trying to figure out how to survive this horrible insomnia at the current time while trying not to updose.

Also, I just posted that I'm about ready to updose. I can't get into my pdoc for a couple of months and I'm starting to get really ill from not sleeping. I feel horrible... and I can't function this way. My boys are saying that I've changed.. everyone notices how unhappy I am. Im not working right now thank God but I will not be able to work like this. I work in healthcare and have to do CPR if required. There's no freaking way! Im really discouraged tonight... ready to jump ship and updose! I desperately need sleep! So dang tired and unhappy!!  :-[

Hi RR-

Sorry you are having such a difficult time. This whole process can be very draining. Do what you have tpo do to remain functional.

This tentative plan is a way to slowly introduce Valium while slowly tapering the Klonopin in equal ammounts. This particular example plan takes 30 days to complete the substitution/crossover. This plan is only a suggestion. The substitution can take as long as you like. The plan above has you reducing the Klonopin while adding the Valium a little bit everyday instead of all at once. See how the numbers in the Klonopin column decrease while the numbers in the Valium column increase consecutively? The second part of this plan is the taper from the Valium once you are fully crossed over. This can also be changed to any rate/time frame that you want to try.

Let me know your thoughts & we can tweak this so you have a solid plan to share with your doctor.

I understand what the idea is with your suggestion.  What amount of liquid would you suggest to start with and what size syringe? Thank you so much for your help [...]!
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: How would I use Valium as a crossover while tapering off Clonazepam?
« Reply #25 on: April 29, 2018, 12:08:22 pm »
Raqeul:

This is just my opinion.

You mention you have had a lot of life stress and it sounds like you had a tremendous loss in your fiancee. I would say don't discount how much life stress can throw a wrench into a taper. And grief is just very very hard. Life stress can really be very difficult. I just went through a period of nonstop nauses for two months due to a job change--I have changed jobs every two to three years without difficulty, but doing it while tapering was nearly impossible. And I was holding during this time.

If I were you, rather than switching anything up I would think about holding (and updosing and holding if you need to). While I applaud your determination to get off the drugs, this may not be the right time in your life to keep cutting through symptoms and hoping for the best. There is a long hold support group on BB; you may want to check it out. I'd also be hesitant to switch to valium during this time. See if you can get stable on the klonopin somehow. It is really hard in times like what you are going through to figure out what is the benzo taper and what is normal reaction to grief and other life stress. Good luck and take good care of yourself.

Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: How would I use Valium as a crossover while tapering off Clonazepam?
« Reply #26 on: April 29, 2018, 01:13:18 pm »
So I looked at your signature. Are you currently taking Remeron and what exactly are you tapering from? Im NOT going to updose cause I'm at 0.25 and I am NOT going back to 0.5 after doing a very time consuming titration taper. No way! I am not going to waste another six months of my life. Everyone is telling me to do something different. Some say Valium cross-over others say no. Some say melatonin or CBD oil and others say no. The internet says things work on one web-site and on another there's contraindications.  I'm so confused. When the rubber hits the road I have to do what works best for me and right now I'm going to hold. I'm going to cut my 0.5 mg pills in half and hold for awhile. Then I will move on but if I wait until my life is not stressful I'll be waiting forever because my life is always stressful and I'm always going through something.  It's been like that for two decades and it's called "life". It's whatever. I'm thinking that posting here is making it worse.  :'(
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: How would I use Valium as a crossover while tapering off Clonazepam?
« Reply #27 on: April 29, 2018, 02:28:20 pm »
So I looked at your signature. Are you currently taking Remeron and what exactly are you tapering from? Im NOT going to updose cause I'm at 0.25 and I am NOT going back to 0.5 after doing a very time consuming titration taper. No way! I am not going to waste another six months of my life. Everyone is telling me to do something different. Some say Valium cross-over others say no. Some say melatonin or CBD oil and others say no. The internet says things work on one web-site and on another there's contraindications.  I'm so confused. When the rubber hits the road I have to do what works best for me and right now I'm going to hold. I'm going to cut my 0.5 mg pills in half and hold for awhile. Then I will move on but if I wait until my life is not stressful I'll be waiting forever because my life is always stressful and I'm always going through something.  It's been like that for two decades and it's called "life". It's whatever. I'm thinking that posting here is making it worse.  :'(

Hey there-

As confusing as it may be, always try to stick with your gut feeling when making difficult decisions. It is so true that there are many contradictions on the internet. This is probably due to the fact that this process in not a linear process. What has worked for one may not necessarily work for another. Only you know what is best for you. I would say to get a SOLID back-up, alternative plan that you are comfortable with. Then, after your "hold" you will have the option of continuing your taper how ever you see fit. Whether it be with klonopin or with Valium or even with a combo of both (yes, I have seen this done successfully) btw, the Valium should give you sleep if that is what you are looking for. All options are open to you. What ever method(s) you do decide to go with, we are here for you to help you implement whatever strategy you choose to move forward with...let us know  :thumbsup:

Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: How would I use Valium as a crossover while tapering off Clonazepam?
« Reply #28 on: April 29, 2018, 03:01:09 pm »
Thanks. I am trying to understand how to cross-over to Valium so I can sleep. I only take 0.25 mg's of Clonazepam and I have severe insomnia. I want to take the Valium so I can sleep but I do not know how much to start with while on my Clonazepam. Everyone is giving me different amounts. I don't want to take too much but need enough to sleep while going through this taper. I'm doing a water titration at the rate of 10 percent a month. It's slow but I want it that way. I'm holding right now for two months at 0.25 mg's.  I only take Clonazepam... no other meds at all. Thank you!  :smitten:
« Last Edit: April 29, 2018, 03:41:46 pm by [Buddie] »
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: How would I use Valium as a crossover while tapering off Clonazepam?
« Reply #29 on: April 29, 2018, 04:10:01 pm »
I'm not advocating for what to do, but I think it is important to understand that the whole basis of the ashton protocol is that even though valium isnt the exact same as other drugs (varies from person to person) it is similar enough that it is a suitable replacement.

Imagine you didnt want to eat butter anymore, you could replace it with the equivalent quantity of olive oil. Different name but serves essentially the same purpose.

I found klonopin and valium to be even more similar than butter and olive oil. I also got such immediate relief from insomnia with my first 0.125 to 2.5 mg transition that I wouldnt have wanted to do it more gradually.

Take care,
[...]
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.