Permanent damage?

I’m struggling to understand how permanent damage isn’t caused by all of this?

 

Especially when someone cold turkies. This process causes huge amounts of cortisol and glutamate. The 2 most toxic substances to the brain, they both kill brain cells, glutamate causes excitotoxicity.

 

I’m just so upset by all of this and can’t help but think I’ll never be what I was ever. I only took Xanax for 3 weeks, I’m 2 months out cold turkey, I can’t feel my brain, no emotions, terrible anxiety that I NEVER had before. No memory, suicidal daily, mornings are unbearable, only relief I get is night where I just sit in an emotionless dream world but I’m not in pain.

 

Do you truely get back to 100% your old self?

 

I will say, I started taking turmeric as it apparently heals the brain, and I have noticed a very slight improvement however not 100% sure there’s improvement or not

 

Got my cortisol measured, morning cortisol should be no more than 200 (200 is still too high). Mine is 928.

 

I feel doomed

dont feel doomed. Its an illusion from the brain. People lose almost all of they're brains in strokes and regain complete function. no chemical, the brain died, went black,.....dead. and it HEALS!

 

When kids have seizures that cant be treated medically they do a hemispherectomy where they just remove the diseased half of the brain. they remove half the brain! and the kids go onto to live normally, the brain re-wires itself. Its called neuroplasticity and its remarkable. The human body has remarkable healing abilities. the liver can be destroyed to 30% and grow back completely.

 

Accept that the brain is amazing and will heal and many others will tell you that it does and have hope!.

 

now remind yourself of these facts and ask yourself what evidence you have for these fears and illusions that it wont, none!. so realize its not rational to think like your thinking right now.

 

then distract yourself because dwelling on these irrational thoughts does you no good

I’m struggling to believe believe it. People with Alzheimer’s and dementia  don’t heal with time. And glutamate and cortisol seem to be the main causes of those conditions.

 

The brain has a great ability to repair, through bdnf and neuroplasticity. However, when the brain has excess glutamate, cortisol etc then bdnf is suppressed and neuroplasticity is shut down / slowed. This seems to be why dementia patients don’t heal. It seems a vicious circle where you need bdnf and neuroplasticity to lower the glutamate, but you need lower glutamate to increase neuroplasticity. I wish I’d taken any other drug, heroin, cocaine, meth.

I’m struggling to understand how permanent damage isn’t caused by all of this?

 

Especially when someone cold turkies. This process causes huge amounts of cortisol and glutamate. The 2 most toxic substances to the brain, they both kill brain cells, glutamate causes excitotoxicity.

 

I’m just so upset by all of this and can’t help but think I’ll never be what I was ever. I only took Xanax for 3 weeks, I’m 2 months out cold turkey, I can’t feel my brain, no emotions, terrible anxiety that I NEVER had before. No memory, suicidal daily, mornings are unbearable, only relief I get is night where I just sit in an emotionless dream world but I’m not in pain.

 

Do you truely get back to 100% your old self?

 

I will say, I started taking turmeric as it apparently heals the brain, and I have noticed a very slight improvement however not 100% sure there’s improvement or not

 

Got my cortisol measured, morning cortisol should be no more than 200 (200 is still too high). Mine is 928.

 

I feel doomed

 

I would be extremely surprised if you are permanently damaged after taking the drug for only 3 weeks and then stopping it.  That seems very unlikely.  I am however surprised you have reacted so badly.  You may simply be more sensitive to these drugs than others, as I am myself.  Were they prescribed drugs, I see you got them from a friend?  Perhaps they were bought online and the source may be suspect.

 

I can only say that most people seem to recover and recover well having consumed the drugs for much longer than you have.  two months is still very early days so you will have to wait and see if things start to settle down.  It is true that the brain has an amazing capacity to heal and recover so it is best to focus on that.

 

Best wishes

 

Fiona 

I can’t believe it after 3 weeks. I thought I’d Ben better by now or soon because I was only on 3 weeks. I just don’t understand it at all?

 

My symptoms have been so so so severe. I’m so upset my all of this, I don’t see the point anymore.

I am sorry, Josh, you have been hit extremely badly, I can see that but drugs can do this to some people after a short time.  Some of us are very unlucky but that does not mean recovery is not possible.    The symptoms you describe are not unusual in benzo withdrawal although they don't usually occur with such severity after taking the drug for only a few weeks.  It is very hard to live without emotions, and awareness of time etc etc.  I had little awareness of time passing also but it is now very much better, I had been on the drugs however for many years.  Emotions also very blunted but much better now.  I understand when you say you cannot feel your brain, it will be awash with chemicals at the moment  or it may be lacking other chemicals... and time is the only thing that will help.  When I first took Nitrazepam, many years ago, I had an extreme reaction to it, out of all proportion to what is normal, so these things do happen.  But there is every point in carrying on .. the suicidal feelings will go as your brain recovers from the shock of withdrawal from the drug.  The anxiety should subside, your memory should return etc etc etc. 

I’m struggling to believe believe it. People with Alzheimer’s and dementia  don’t heal with time. And glutamate and cortisol seem to be the main causes of those conditions.

 

The brain has a great ability to repair, through bdnf and neuroplasticity. However, when the brain has excess glutamate, cortisol etc then bdnf is suppressed and neuroplasticity is shut down / slowed. This seems to be why dementia patients don’t heal. It seems a vicious circle where you need bdnf and neuroplasticity to lower the glutamate, but you need lower glutamate to increase neuroplasticity. I wish I’d taken any other drug, heroin, cocaine, meth.

 

Alzheimer and dementia are very different. firstly, there is a whole symphony of things of compound and molecules going on so drawing specific links is pure speculation.

 

Take a step back and think logically, think about this, one is drug induced, the other is a degenerative disease brought on by genetics and ageing. these dementia's in a way are like cancer where there are normal mechanisms of the body that fail, in cancer is cytochrome p450, the guardian of the cell stops signalling the cells for destruction and bad cells replicate. theres a break in the chain of normal physiology. in alzheimers and other dementias its the amyloid and other deposits that have a genetic switch telling the brain to go ahead and make the disease happen.

 

So, a drug induced issue is simply just a matter of removing the drug and like a boulder clogging a river, nature starts to correct itself.

 

With a degenerative disease, the genetic link with telomere involvement means you have a problem with water flowing in the first place and the tap was turned off by genetic switches. Nature/normal just changed for you slowly over time.

 

in the end, They're completely different disease pathophysiologies. Theres no logical connection between the two. Your fear is drawing the connection

I took benzos for less than 3 weeks! Total of 14 pills 1.5mg bromazepam and 4 pills lorazepam!

 

I suffered tremendously too when I was first off. It first started with convulsions when I first got off, insomnia and non-stop adrenaline rush for 4 nights straight. My brain was pulsating and I develop tinnitus. I felt agitated and fearful for no reason, heart palpitations and hypnic jerks for at least one month after.

 

5 months after, I had a rekindling episode triggered by insomnia. Couldn’t sleep, stabbing pain, mental confusion, micro-seizures that left sexually anhedonic and a bizarre stinging numbness in my penis..

 

It gets better, but yes you are somethings are permanent. The confusion, DP/DR and stabbing pain resolved in hospital but I still have tinnitus and an elevated stress response. My penis still stings, it’s like some sort of neuropathic pain. There’s just no pleasure from sexual stimulation anymore, it’s frustrating me.

This used to worry me a lot too. I am over it now. I did some research on this subject. The current thinking is that there MIGHT be some permanent brain damage done but ONLY in a very few people. Men - mostly men - who abused benzos along with other drugs including alcohol and other things - were more likely to have permanent damage done. Ordinary people who may have used and even did some abusing - of benzos dont seem at risk.

 

Worrying about this stuff will just wear you down. At this point, it is important o remain hopefully. Read Success Stories to gain that hope. Learn as much as you can about why you have all these symptoms helps greatly as well.

dont feel doomed. Its an illusion from the brain. People lose almost all of they're brains in strokes and regain complete function. no chemical, the brain died, went black,.....dead. and it HEALS!

 

When kids have seizures that cant be treated medically they do a hemispherectomy where they just remove the diseased half of the brain. they remove half the brain! and the kids go onto to live normally, the brain re-wires itself. Its called neuroplasticity and its remarkable. The human body has remarkable healing abilities. the liver can be destroyed to 30% and grow back completely.

 

Accept that the brain is amazing and will heal and many others will tell you that it does and have hope!.

 

now remind yourself of these facts and ask yourself what evidence you have for these fears and illusions that it wont, none!. so realize its not rational to think like your thinking right now.

 

then distract yourself because dwelling on these irrational thoughts does you no good

 

But those kids are young, which is when neuroplasticity is truly at its peak. Our old and develop adult brains aren’t going to change much.

i cold turkeyed off far more use than you at the age of 42 - went through utter horror for many months and am totally healed.  the body is very smart - it has ways to protect itself - for example - the brain produces large amounts of IGF-1 to shelter itself from the glutamate.  i posted 2 success stories - one at 6 months and another at a year off.  healing is absolutely possible - unfortunately the degree of damage is more likely related to your genetics than length of use.  please read my success stories - it is so important to fill your brain with messages of healing and not of doom and permanent damage

i cold turkeyed off far more use than you at the age of 42 - went through utter horror for many months and am totally healed.  the body is very smart - it has ways to protect itself - for example - the brain produces large amounts of IGF-1 to shelter itself from the glutamate.  i posted 2 success stories - one at 6 months and another at a year off.  healing is absolutely possible - unfortunately the degree of damage is more likely related to your genetics than length of use.  please read my success stories - it is so important to fill your brain with messages of healing and not of doom and permanent damage

I second this.....please read SSRI's success story

dont feel doomed. Its an illusion from the brain. People lose almost all of they're brains in strokes and regain complete function. no chemical, the brain died, went black,.....dead. and it HEALS!

 

When kids have seizures that cant be treated medically they do a hemispherectomy where they just remove the diseased half of the brain. they remove half the brain! and the kids go onto to live normally, the brain re-wires itself. Its called neuroplasticity and its remarkable. The human body has remarkable healing abilities. the liver can be destroyed to 30% and grow back completely.

 

Accept that the brain is amazing and will heal and many others will tell you that it does and have hope!.

 

now remind yourself of these facts and ask yourself what evidence you have for these fears and illusions that it wont, none!. so realize its not rational to think like your thinking right now.

 

then distract yourself because dwelling on these irrational thoughts does you no good

 

But those kids are young, which is when neuroplasticity is truly at its peak. Our old and develop adult brains aren’t going to change much.

 

Stroke patients go from complete incapacitation to full recovery of function and life in many instances. Stroke patients are mostly elderly. Read the 'the brain that changes itself by Norman Doidge' if you'd like a good read to give you some hope. Mainstream medicine has known about these things since the 1950's when they did experiments showing that bleeding can be turned on and off by positive thinking. Yes bleeding. Then they found that stroke patients could be trained back to adulthood much like training a child. It takes many years in most cases but they regained full function. This stuff has literally been widely known for decades by the medical community. Heres the trick though. Its a two way street. If the brain is malleable like its been proven, it means its also incredibly vulnerable. So neuroplasticity is going to happen whether you participate or not. The questions is which direction your pushing yourself. Worse or better. Thats why my advice is always keep pushing yourself forward and positively. I always think about this case study from university about a spanish medical student who dropped out of medical school when his father (a doctor) had a stroke in the 1950s. His father became an infant who he needed to take to the bathroom and clean etc. He refused to believe the doctors in the 1950's that his father was like this from now on. So he trained him first to crawl like a child on hands and feet and eventually his father went back to work full time. It blew all the expectations and preconceived notions out of the water. It was a case study of neuroplasticity. I think about that when I have doubts. If a 70 year old person can regain full function after losing physical brain tissue. Than we can definitely re-regulate some neurotransmitters.

 

The establishment is very flawed. It couldn't accept that washing your hands lead to less disease so the medical academies of the day hounded the physician who discovered it (ignaz semmelwies) into an insane asylum (no joke).

 

 

i cold turkeyed off far more use than you at the age of 42 - went through utter horror for many months and am totally healed.  the body is very smart - it has ways to protect itself - for example - the brain produces large amounts of IGF-1 to shelter itself from the glutamate.  i posted 2 success stories - one at 6 months and another at a year off.  healing is absolutely possible - unfortunately the degree of damage is more likely related to your genetics than length of use.  please read my success stories - it is so important to fill your brain with messages of healing and not of doom and permanent damage

 

That is the first thing I have read about the role IGF-1 plays in withdrawal. How does that work?

I have been a nurse (RN) since 1981. And worked with so many neuro patients over the years. What I saw convinced me that the human brain is an amazing thing. People quite old could and did recover from major neuro events such as a stroke. And I went through this getting of benzos, going cold turkey off huge doses of Klonapin, Ambien and two anti-depressants. My brain suffered an enormous insult. I was so sick and crazy for several years it is truly amazing I am still here today!

 

The human brain and body was designed (over time) to attempt to right itself, no matter how awful the injury is. But it takes time for this to happen, and that is what bothered me during my long withdrawal. "Why is this taking so long?" I used to ask. "Why dont I feel better, it has been 8 months now."  Somehow, I just knew or sensed that if I stayed the course, I would eventually feel better. AND I DID. It took me a whole lot longer than most people. I didnt feel truly better until maybe my 3rd year or later. That is a bit unusual but the fact that I DO feel better is what matters. I am now healthier than I have been since 1982 when I started taking and abusing benzos. Our brains truly are remarkable in their ability to heal. You just have to give it enough time to do its job.

I’m struggling to understand how permanent damage isn’t caused by all of this?

 

Especially when someone cold turkies. This process causes huge amounts of cortisol and glutamate. The 2 most toxic substances to the brain, they both kill brain cells, glutamate causes excitotoxicity.

 

I’m just so upset by all of this and can’t help but think I’ll never be what I was ever. I only took Xanax for 3 weeks, I’m 2 months out cold turkey, I can’t feel my brain, no emotions, terrible anxiety that I NEVER had before. No memory, suicidal daily, mornings are unbearable, only relief I get is night where I just sit in an emotionless dream world but I’m not in pain.

 

Do you truely get back to 100% your old self?

 

I will say, I started taking turmeric as it apparently heals the brain, and I have noticed a very slight improvement however not 100% sure there’s improvement or not

 

Got my cortisol measured, morning cortisol should be no more than 200 (200 is still too high). Mine is 928.

 

I feel doomed

 

It's okay to seek peace through reassurance. But be careful with how definitive your remarks are. There are plenty of people (myself included) that are in a very fragile state that could incur further destabilization from buying into the notion that we could have attained permanent damage from psychiatric drug use.

I’m struggling to understand how permanent damage isn’t caused by all of this?

 

Especially when someone cold turkies. This process causes huge amounts of cortisol and glutamate. The 2 most toxic substances to the brain, they both kill brain cells, glutamate causes excitotoxicity.

 

I’m just so upset by all of this and can’t help but think I’ll never be what I was ever. I only took Xanax for 3 weeks, I’m 2 months out cold turkey, I can’t feel my brain, no emotions, terrible anxiety that I NEVER had before. No memory, suicidal daily, mornings are unbearable, only relief I get is night where I just sit in an emotionless dream world but I’m not in pain.

 

Do you truely get back to 100% your old self?

 

I will say, I started taking turmeric as it apparently heals the brain, and I have noticed a very slight improvement however not 100% sure there’s improvement or not

 

Got my cortisol measured, morning cortisol should be no more than 200 (200 is still too high). Mine is 928.

 

I feel doomed

 

It's okay to seek peace through reassurance. But be careful with how definitive your remarks are. There are plenty of people (myself included) that are in a very fragile state that could incur further destabilization from buying into the notion that we could have attained permanent damage from psychiatric drug use.

 

I do also think that it is awful to be believing in a fallacy. Joshc’s and my case shows that even a short term use is extraordinarily toxic to the brain.

 

I do think that everyone can heal to the point they will be functional, but expect to experience some bad lingering symptoms after such as tinnitus, easy agitation, numbness in some areas etc.

 

Currently there is no real evidence of permanent damage EXCEPT in one study that looked at a fairly small group of men who had abused benzos badly for years, plus other drugs and alcohol. There is no way to know what caused the damage. Was it the benzos or the alcohol or something in the street drugs they took???

 

I look at it this way. I took benzos. I even abused them earlier in life, seeking sleep, (not a "high"). But abuse them I sure did. I am a medical professional, and knew that benzos are addicting and I took them anyway. What I did not know was how awful withdrawal can be for a very few people. And when I went CT I turned out to be one of those few people. I went CT 6 years ago, almost to the day. I see NO signs of permanent brain damage. NONE. I only have one remaining symptom that I started having during withdrawal, and  its a minor one that doesnt bother me very much. I dont even think it is benzo related now - I think its part of my tendency to be OCD.

 

Many people here are terrified about possible permanent damage. I personally think its better to not go on about this very much, because it will frighten people and might even frighten them into reinstating! Lets not do that, okay?

Thank you EastCoast62 as I needed to hear that. 

It will all turn out okay. I honestly believe this. I worked in a Detox Center for a year, and on an acute Psych Unit for 4 years. Never once did I see a patient who might have had permanent brain damage from benzos. ALCOHOL - yes. But only a very few of them.

It will all turn out okay. I honestly believe this. I worked in a Detox Center for a year, and on an acute Psych Unit for 4 years. Never once did I see a patient who might have had permanent brain damage from benzos. ALCOHOL - yes. But only a very few of them.

 

I'm juggling with the idea of taking my IUD out. I got on it three years ago and a couple of months later I started antidepressants. I'm wondering if the two were correlated and if taking out the IUD might make me feel a little better. IUDs are renowned for causing a crash though, so I'm pretty scared that I will get worse when I have it out.