Vegas shooting- the subject of psych drugs has already made the news

I was just watching Tucker Carlson and he was discussing the shooting with radio show host Tammy Bruce, and she brought up the subject of psych drugs and how they are never talked about in relation to these kinds of situations. At this point we have no idea whether this guy was on any drugs at all but as soon as I heard about it I automatically wondered if whoever was responsible for this was on psych drugs.

 

Many, many of these attacks (maybe most) have been perpetrated by people who are on one or more psych drugs and knowing what I know about them I guarantee that the drugs are a factor in most of these cases. I just hope that the link between the two starts to get more attention because it may have the potential to expose these drugs to the public for what they really are.

I was just watching Tucker Carlson and he was discussing the shooting with radio show host Tammy Bruce, and she brought up the subject of psych drugs and how they are never talked about in relation to these kinds of situations. At this point we have no idea whether this guy was on any drugs at all but as soon as I heard about it I automatically wondered if whoever was responsible for this was on psych drugs.

 

Many, many of these attacks (maybe most) have been perpetrated by people who are on one or more psych drugs and knowing what I know about them I guarantee that the drugs are a factor in most of these cases. I just hope that the link between the two starts to get more attention because it may have the potential to expose these drugs to the public for what they really are.

 

I might be reading different sources than Tammy Bruce does, but I hear this discussion nearly every time something like this happens.  As to the connection between psych drugs and violence, that's an egg-or-chicken question. 

I might be reading different sources than Tammy Bruce does, but I hear this discussion nearly every time something like this happens.

 

I have also heard it discussed before. Maybe she meant that no one is taking it seriously.

 

As to the connection between psych drugs and violence, that's an egg-or-chicken question.

 

Of course it is and we might not ever have definitive proof that the drugs are directly responsible but if we could get the general public to take a serious look at it they might start to see these drugs a little differently.

The idea that benzos are "addictive" is misleading and factually incorrect in most cases and the public tends to tune it out because they don't believe that it can ever happen to them. So the media can talk about that until they are blue in the face but until people understand that it has nothing to do with your ability to avoid abusing the drug in most cases, this problem will never go away.

 

If they ever establish a solid link between these mass killings and psych drugs it just might make people realize that the real problem with these drugs lies in the way they can fundamentally alter brain chemistry. It would be a lot harder to ignore the idea that a drug could possibly cause you murder 60 innocent people.

I have a bit of doubt that psych drugs may have played a role in this horrible tragedy. Obviously, the shooter had a very clear and elaborate plan that probably took months to prepare and put it into action. I think this time, we are looking at cold, extremely calculated, very meticulously premeditated crime that someone on psych drugs would just not have the cognitive powers or the physical strength or the required dexterity to pull it off. It may just as easily be that this was an angry, violent man who had a lot of grudges and seething anger and a lot of time, money and resources to pull it off.

 

Seriously, someone under the influence of psychiatric drugs would probably end up shooting himself in his rear by accident, rather than killing and harming so many innocent people in such a premeditated, sickly precise, deliberate way.

This is a bit of a slippery slope, since the topic of psychiatric drugs is often used as a deflection of the issue of assault rifles in the hands of the mentally ill, as it can then be said that mental illness itself is not the issue, only the drugs are.

 

That pushes the topic more than a little into politics, so it’s going to make for a precarious discussion on BB.

Seems he was upset as he was denied an opiod script.

 

Las Vegas medical shooting: Chad Broderick, patient with opiod addiction wanted more drugs before being rejected returning. Savages of drug withdrawal and addiction.

 

Chad Broderick, a 50 year old regular patient at a Las Vegas medical office went on a shooting rampage after being denied opiod pills. Shooting at two medical facility workers before taking his own life.

 

Identification of the deceased man, whose identity had not been publicly revealed came 9.30 am local time, after the Clark County coroner identified the man as 50-year-old Chad Broderick of Las Vegas.

 

According to employees interviewed by ktnv, the regular patient had earlier come to the ‘pain-management clinic’ unannounced seeking an appointment.

 

As per the rules and regulations of Las Vegas’ Center for Wellnes and Pain Care, the man was denied. It is understood the man had specifically come to gain access to pain killer pills.

 

The man had been observed leaving ‘visibly’ distressed.

 

At some point, Broderick returned, having entered the facility through an unlocked door in the back. That’s when he started firing.

 

Las Vegas police confirmed Chad Broderick firing a gun inside the business in the 300 block of North Buffalo Drive and then turned the gun on himself. Despite having shot at two workers, as patients waited nearby, no serious injuries were noted.

 

Two employees were transported to UMC Trauma with minor gunshot wounds. A third person was hurt after falling while trying to leave the facility.

 

Caitlyn Jones said she was one of about a dozen people in the clinic when the gunman opened fire just a few feet from her.

 

‘I’ve never heard something that loud in my life,’ she told the Las Vegas Review-Journal. ‘He pointed the gun at me and I just ran.’

 

‘The withdrawal is absolutely astoundingly painful,’ said retired Metro Lt. Randy Sutton, ‘people get desperate.’

 

While the identity of the deceased shooter hadn’t been released until Friday late morning, a report via news.com.au posted a video purportedly of the shooter describing a prior incident of police coming to his and wife’s home where he was arrested and subjected to humiliating reproach, including being led away in the street without clothes.

 

I have a bit of doubt that psych drugs may have played a role in this horrible tragedy. Obviously, the shooter had a very clear and elaborate plan that probably took months to prepare and put it into action. I think this time, we are looking at cold, extremely calculated, very meticulously premeditated crime that someone on psych drugs would just not have the cognitive powers or the physical strength or the required dexterity to pull it off. It may just as easily be that this was an angry, violent man who had a lot of grudges and seething anger and a lot of time, money and resources to pull it off.

 

Seriously, someone under the influence of psychiatric drugs would probably end up shooting himself in his rear by accident, rather than killing and harming so many innocent people in such a premeditated, sickly precise, deliberate way.

 

I would not discount the idea that someone on psych meds could plan and execute something like this. Many, many of the people who perpetrate these mass killings are on prescription meds, and the body count is high.

 

This is a bit of a slippery slope, since the topic of psychiatric drugs is often used as a deflection of the issue of assault rifles in the hands of the mentally ill, as it can then be said that mental illness itself is not the issue, only the drugs are.

 

If it was truly a mental health issue we would see a lot of "he was off his meds at the time", but the reality is that in almost all of these cases the killers were on meds to treat their mental illnesses.

It’s still a chicken-or-egg question.

 

When people are on meds, drugs are blamed. When they are off meds, drugs are blamed.

 

It’s a technicality that continues to block the reality of assault rifles not mixing well with mentally ill individuals.

It’s still a chicken-or-egg question.

 

When people are on meds, drugs are blamed. When they are off meds, drugs are blamed.

 

It is, but you can't ignore the fact that in most of these cases these people are on meds. If it was a matter of the mental illness itself causing the homicidal tendencies we would certainly see more of them happening when the person in question is not on medication.

 

It’s a technicality that continues to block the reality of assault rifles not mixing well with mentally ill individuals.

 

Neither do trucks, airplanes, knives or bombs. Weapons and mental illness have been around forever but these mass killings have only been a big problem over the past 20 years or so. You can blame whatever you want for the problem but the fact of the matter is that that these killings coincide with the change in how mental illness is treated (drug them up and send them out into public) and someone needs to be taking a serious look at this.

 

Please leave the gun debate out of this. This is a discussion about psych drugs and the possible role they play in mass killings. I'm not going to be happy if this gets locked because it goes off topic.

It is, but you can't ignore the fact that in most of these cases these people are on meds.

 

Sources?

Sources?

 

This is my personal observation, and it is based on hearing psych drugs mentioned many times during the mass killing discussions, and I can't recall even one time where it was mentioned that the killer was "off his meds". I am not aware of any studies that have been done and someone may have compiled some data on this but I haven't seen it.

I was curious so I did a little poking around. Apparently someone is documenting this phenomenon.

 

SSRI Stories is a collection of over 6,000 stories that have appeared in the media (newspapers, TV, scientific journals) in which prescription drugs were mentioned and in which the drugs may be linked to a variety of adverse outcomes including violence.

 

https://ssristories.org/

They are seriously mentally ill ppl who do this

 

I'm not sure but most are psychopaths

 

We were all here on psyche meds but none of us murdered anyone or plotted a mass murder.

 

This Vegas killer was obviously  mentally deranged, his dad was wanted by the FBI at one time so genetics could come into play?

They are seriously mentally ill ppl who do this

 

I'm not sure but most are psychopaths

 

We were all here on psyche meds but none of us murdered anyone or plotted a mass murder.

 

This Vegas killer was obviously  mentally deranged, his dad was wanted by the FBI at one time so genetics could come into play?

 

Exactly! 

They are seriously mentally ill ppl who do this

 

I'm not sure but most are psychopaths

 

We were all here on psyche meds but none of us murdered anyone or plotted a mass murder.

 

This Vegas killer was obviously  mentally deranged, his dad was wanted by the FBI at one time so genetics could come into play?

 

Are they seriously mentally ill, or did the drugs make them homicidal? Maybe they had some mild or moderate mental problems that were compounded by the drugs? Of course we can't ignore that people who take these kinds of drugs are more likely to have anxiety, depression etc that might predispose them to erratic or violent behavior, but would they have ever done anything like this if they weren't pushed over the edge by a drug or drugs?

 

Knowing what we know from personal experience I'm not sure why it would be a stretch for BB's to believe that psych drugs could be directly responsible for something like this. The fact that most of us don't end up doing something like this doesn't prove anything and the fact that many if not most of these people who commit these crimes are on psych drugs should raise a lot of questions.

 

These kinds of killings are much more prevalent today than they were 40 years ago and there seem to be a lot of them in the USA. Is it a coincidence that the number of these shootings has increased exponentially after the deinstitutionalization of mental illness and the explosion of the use of SSRI's in a country where 5% of the worlds population consumes 50% of the world's pharmaceutical drugs?

 

 

I think these drugs do change people in various ways.  I was in the fourth year of 'happily' taking my 1mg of klonopin at night, and decided to go on a diet.  It turned out to be a very successful diet.  At one point, I lost 102 pounds (46kg).  That was a good outcome.  What was weird was that I could do it.  It was torturous - nearly as torturous as my withdrawal.  Yet I ruthlessly adhered to my diet.  Not once did I exceed my calorie limit for a day (not even on Halloween, Thanksgiving, Christmas, Super Bowl Sunday, or even my birthday).  I had tried losing weight many times before, and was usually good for 20 or so pounds before I'd give up.  And since healing, my weight has fluctuated up and down.  However, that intense, unyielding discipline is gone.  So me on benzos definitely created an outlier 'experience'.

 

So yeah, I think these drugs when coupled with certain predispositions can lead to 'unusual' outcomes.

We were all here on psyche meds but none of us murdered anyone or plotted a mass murder.

 

Another thing to note is that it would seem to me that benzos would not likely cause this kind of violent behavior while the person is taking them. The real problem with benzos is after you come off of them. SSRI's seem to cause more problems while the person is taking them. This would jive with my experience- I didn't have noticeable issues with benzos while I was taking them, but I had to discontinue SSRI's because the side effects were horrendous. So benzos are definitely different than other psych drugs and SSRI's seem to be a more common denominator in these mass killings.

 

Apparently the Vegas shooter was on diazepam. I personally doubt if this had anything to do with it. Maybe the autopsy will show other drugs in his system. Maybe this had nothing to do with drugs. All I know is that we shouldn't ignore the possibility of a connection between psych drugs and mass killings.

 

 

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/stephen-paddock-prescribed-anti-anxiety-meds-june-report-article-1.3540386

 

I agree with the moderators on how this is being spun in all different directions searching for the why? The why is always the difficult question because we all want so badly to prevent this from ever happening again, we all don't want to worry about going to fun events. Unfortunately this search and speculation only causes more divisions in relation to race, religion, gun rights, political views, and finally the "mentally ill". Benzo survivors know suffering and I think we are extra sensitive to the suffering of others because of this fact. I can feel it in the air; the confusion and anger. I felt it fleeing my home during Irma. Sadness and confusion; and boy oh boy is it powerful when you are in the middle of it. I can't imagine the terror experienced by anyone near the venue. I made the poor choice to watch the videos and it sent me into panic.

 

Funny thing is my husband called my sorry butt an optimist yesterday. I'm in the middle of a cut and feeling like complete garbage emotionally. In my opinion we have millions of guns in circulation which will not vanish if banned, millions on drugs, millions depressed, global unrest... All and all numbers wise we are holding it together pretty well. This is no consolation for anyone that has lost someone and I'm trying not to be insensitive, but as a flawed human species I'm actually surprised this is not a multiple time of day event.

 

In any event whether it was a catalyst or not Benzo rage is real and a very common side effect. I'm a very very passive person. Vegetarian animal lover who saves roaches in my house 😂... but I have acted in really bizarre evil ways during acute withdrawl. I've actually come close to a physical altercation which is very unlike me off Benzos. Chicken and egg maybe? Maybe the straw that broke the camel's back is a better turn of phrase.

I agree that it's very much in the air.  Last night I taught a telescope basics class/lab.  We went outside to look at the Moon and Saturn.  While I was setting up, some idiot set off a bunch of firecrackers across the street.  The students were visibly and audibly concerned.  This one's going to take a while to settle down.

I think we're jumping the gun (oops, sorry) a bit here by suggesting that meds played a role.  Charles Whitman did much the same in 1966 and left a note asking that his brain be autopsied.  He knew there was something wrong.  So they did the autopsy and found a large brain tumor.

 

Early days in this investigation...

Generally speaking, not specifically about this particular case, but there are many studies that do establish the relationship between psychotropic drugs and violence.  Here is one.

 

The relevance of cytochrome P450 polymorphism in forensic medicine and akathisia-related violence and suicide:

http://www.jflmjournal.org/article/S1752-928X(16)30005-1/fulltext

 

Also see the link FG posted earlier and look under "Lessons from SSRI Stories" where you will find  the essay, "What Does the Research Show?".  Below this is more cited research on the connection between psychotropic drugs and violence.

I think we're jumping the gun (oops, sorry) a bit here by suggesting that meds played a role.

 

With the prevalence of psych drugs in many if not most of these mass killing situations and absolutely no apparent motive in this particular case I wonder how the thought wouldn't at least cross everyone in the benzo community's mind. The shooter was prescribed a benzo, and I personally doubt that one benzo script would cause something like this but I am curious to know whether there were any other drugs in his system.

 

We will probably never be able to prove that psych drugs were directly responsible for any of these murders but we do need to pay attention and ask questions because the fact that so many of these people are on these drugs at the time and I absolutely do not buy the idea that we can conveniently explain this away as mental illness.

 

Anyone who hasn't read Anatomy of an Epidemic really needs to do so. Robert Whitaker makes a rock solid case that these drugs can and often do cause the very mental problems they are supposed to treat. Given that fact we will never be able to rule out drugs as a cause for any of these acts of violence.

 

Anyone who can't or doesn't want to read Anatomy of an Epidemic can find tons of Robert Whitaker talks on Youtube.

 

 

Psych drugs or not, for all it is worth, there is an extremely complex history to this man's life.....

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2017/10/02/las-vegas-gunman-liked-to-gamble-listened-to-country-music-lived-quiet-retired-life-before-massacre/?utm_term=.505dacfe3927

https://www.naturalnews.com/2017-10-04-breaking-las-vegas-shooter-stephen-paddock-was-taking-psychiatric-medications-that-increase-killing-behavior-by-45.html

 

A 2015 study published in World Psychiatry of 960 Finnish adults and teens convicted of homicide showed that their odds of killing were 45 percent higher during time periods when they were on benzodiazepines.