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Water Titration w/Vodka.


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Can someone explain exactly how this is done?

 

Put the pill with 1ml vodka over the top, let dissolve and then add the other 99ml of h20?

 

or...

 

sorry benzo brain. lol

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Here's what I do, but others may have different methods. (Note - I split my 2mg tablets in half, and make sure I keep the other half separate so I use it for the next batch I make up.)

 

I put 1mg valium tablet into the glass jar that I'm making my batch in. I add 1ml of vodka.

 

The tablet breaks down very quickly (seconds) and then I swish the liquid around for maybe another 10-15 seconds, just to make sure the valium is dissolved properly. The alcohol will dissolve the valium, thus making a solution, as opposed to a "suspension" (which is what whole milk and straight water will create with tablets).

 

Then I add 99ml of water to make up a 100ml solution.

 

The details of how I then proceed with measuring my doses can be seen in the link I have in my signature below.

 

A few things to note, which have been discussed previously on BB....

 

(a) Don't store the valium/vodka/water solution in the fridge as there is some concern that the cold could cause the valium and vodka to separate

 

(b) If you have concerns about summer time temperatures, an option would be to measure out a few days of doses from your main mixture and then store in the fridge. If the valium and vodka do separate, the right dose of valium will still be within the dose.

 

© When storing in the cupboard, also protect from light as much as possible, as that can also affect the valium.

 

(d) It's been confirmed on the valium support thread that 1ml of 80 proof (40%) vodka is enough to dissolve approx 16mg of valium.

 

 

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Can someone explain exactly how this is done?

 

Put the pill with 1ml vodka over the top, let dissolve and then add the other 99ml of h20?

 

or...

 

sorry benzo brain. lol

 

Yup, that'll work.

 

And I don't mean to be nitpicky over semantics, but that is NOT "water titration".  You are making a liquid valium solution with alcohol as a solvent, then diluting it with water.

 

Water titration does NOT make a "solution".

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Here's what I do, but others may have different methods. (Note - I split my 2mg tablets in half, and make sure I keep the other half separate so I use it for the next batch I make up.)

 

I put 1mg valium tablet into the glass jar that I'm making my batch in. I add 1ml of vodka.

 

The tablet breaks down very quickly (seconds) and then I swish the liquid around for maybe another 10-15 seconds, just to make sure the valium is dissolved properly. The alcohol will dissolve the valium, thus making a solution, as opposed to a "suspension" (which is what whole milk and straight water will create with tablets).

 

Then I add 99ml of water to make up a 100ml solution.

 

The details of how I then proceed with measuring my doses can be seen in the link I have in my signature below.

 

A few things to note, which have been discussed previously on BB....

 

(a) Don't store the valium/vodka/water solution in the fridge as there is some concern that the cold could cause the valium and vodka to separate

 

(b) If you have concerns about summer time temperatures, an option would be to measure out a few days of doses from your main mixture and then store in the fridge. If the valium and vodka do separate, the right dose of valium will still be within the dose.

 

© When storing in the cupboard, also protect from light as much as possible, as that can also affect the valium.

 

(d) It's been confirmed on the valium support thread that 1ml of 80 proof (40%) vodka is enough to dissolve approx 16mg of valium.

 

Hi DP,  I don't mean to be critical, but I just wanted to keep things accurate.  It is not a fact that Valium does not dissolve in milk.  I believe it does.  I have been trying to confirm this and found this study which says Valium both binds and dissolves in milk...

 

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1694991

 

ABSTRACT: "The binding and solubility of nitrofurantoin, piroxicam, indomethacin, prednisolone, diazepam, dicumarol, and griseofulvin in milk were determined at 15, 25, and 37 degrees C in bovine milk samples with fat contents of 0.75 and 3.50%. Drug binding to milk components was independent of drug concentration over the drug concentration studied, and the fat content of milk strongly affected binding values of most of the listed drugs. Further, drug binding increased with decreasing temperatures for most of the drugs examined. The solubility of all drugs is greatly enhanced in milk compared to their aqueous solubility (pH 6.5 phosphate buffer). The high solubility cannot be accounted for solely on the basis of drug binding to milk components. An attempt is made to correlate the binding and solubility data with physicochemical properties of the drugs (logP, pKa, aqueous solubility). The potential significance of these findings is discussed with regard to preparation and in vivo delivery of drugs from drug-milk formulations."

 

They talk about both binding and solubility and to be honest I don't understand what binding is and how it is different from dissolving.  From the context it seems binding is akin to dissolving.  They want $40 for the whole paper and I am not willing to pay that, but I think even with this abstract we can say at least that it is very likely that Valium does dissolve in milk.  Milk is a good option for Valium and I'd hate to see people deterred from using it because they think it only suspends.  That does not seem to be the case.

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I'd rather keep out of the the milk suspension/solution debate (which is usually part of the "water is okay for valium titration" debate). Things can get heated when that subject comes up. I'll leave it to those who know about that kind of stuff..lol....
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Does this work for ativan / lorazepam as well? I've been using fizzy water which seems to dissolve the pill slightly better than reg water but it never really dissolves. I have to crush the pill and it's always suspended and I'm always paranoid and concerned that my daily dose is never consistent.  Thanks.
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Lorazepam does not dissolve in water or milk.  It does however dissolve in alcohol and there are members who are using alcohol very effectively for liquid tapers.  It works well.
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  • 3 weeks later...

Lorazepam does not dissolve in water or milk.  It does however dissolve in alcohol and there are members who are using alcohol very effectively for liquid tapers.  It works well.

 

you dissolve it in alcohol not vodka?

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Lorazepam does not dissolve in water or milk.  It does however dissolve in alcohol and there are members who are using alcohol very effectively for liquid tapers.  It works well.

 

you dissolve it in alcohol not vodka?

 

I know of members that are using Everclear grain alcohol and vodka too.  The important ingredient is ethyl alcohol in these.  Both seem to be very effective.  These are basically alcohol/water mixtures.  I think the proofs were pretty high in both cases.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi:

 

It might be worth the trouble to get some Everclear. The 151 proof, which is the one you want, is available in all 50 states. Try BevMo. My method, linked at the end of my sig, has a reference in the solvents discussion to the Jordan Journal of Pharmaceutical Sciences, Volume 5, No. 2, 2012, showing Ativan solubility in ethyl alcohol/water mixtures falls off pretty rapidly at 120-130 proof. 140 proof vodka would probably work in a pinch. So would 151 rum, but I'd rather not have all those unknown smelly compounds in my solvent.

 

aweigh

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • 1 month later...

I was on liquid Valium but I could not tolerate it. So now I am on 12mg of pills a day. All my Tablets are 2mg. I was doing a cut and hold using compounded Valium. But I can no longer use this Dr and my Dr told me I could use liquid Valium to taper off of the Valium.

 

I found my stomach got upset using the liquid Valium so my plan is to use Vodka to dissolve a 2mg pill and to cut my dose from 12mg to 11.7 mg and hold for 10 days. Is this possible to do?

 

Can anyone recommend a procedure and what equipment I would need. I have an accurate 1ml syringe.

The compounded Valium was 2mg/ml and the liquid Valium was 1mg/ml.

 

I would just like to take all pills except for the solution I would use for making my cuts

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Being on 12mg per day is it mostly pills and then use a 2mg pill dissolved and diluted in alcohol to make my cut. I was going to cut .25 to .3 mg every 10 days. It would be difficult using pill cutting and making a daily solution with milk and Valium seems like it would be tedious and time consuming. So I was thinking of the Vodka method. I just need to know how much to dilute the 2mg pill with and how much water to add. Would I first remove the amount I want to cut .3mg and then dilute and drink the remainder of the solution?
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Diaz-Pam, how do you make a 2mg/1ml solution using the Vodka method. I take it 2mg/1ml means in every 1ml solution there is 2mg of Valium. I had been using a compounded Valium of 2mg/ml. Now I would like to make a 2mg/ml solution using alcohol
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Diaz-Pam, how do you make a 2mg/1ml solution using the Vodka method. I take it 2mg/1ml means in every 1ml solution there is 2mg of Valium. I had been using a compounded Valium of 2mg/ml. Now I would like to make a 2mg/ml solution using alcohol

 

Rob-why do you want such a concentrated solution?

 

BTW, Roxane already makes a 5mg per 1 ml solution alcohol-based solution.  You could simply dilute that 2.5:1 and you would have a 2mg per 1 ml solution.

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Ok I get it. Lets say I just want to make a 1mg/ml solution. My 1ml syringe has 20 large lines which I have been using for making my cuts with the compounded valium. So if I had a 1mg/ml solution each of these lines would equal .05mg.

 

How would I make a 100ml solution of liquid Valium using 10mg Tablets and Vodka?

I would use 10 of the 10mg pills some kind of alcohol and the rest would be water.

 

I am not able to get the script now for the Roxane since I am taking the pills. I don't think my Dr will write a script for both pills and the Roxane liquid.

 

So now I am left with making my own solution out of the many 10mg pills I have left over from over a year ago

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  • 2 months later...
Is it just Ativan that doesn't dissolve in water/milk or is it Klonopin also?  I am unable to ever have any alcohol again because my body is too sensitive to even the smallest amount of it.
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Is it just Ativan that doesn't dissolve in water/milk or is it Klonopin also?  I am unable to ever have any alcohol again because my body is too sensitive to even the smallest amount of it.

 

Milk works great for Klonopin.  Be sure to use whole milk.  The fat is the key.

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I'm confused. I know this sounds stupid :-[ but I have bad cog fog and really bad when it comes to math. On 12mg of Valium. I have 5mg and 2mg tabs. I would take the 5 mg in pill form and then dry cut the 2mg into 1mg and dissolve that? Then just get a dropper? I was just wondering if it's okay to take pills with liquid till I get to 1mg. Do you make cuts daily? On the Ashton plan so I would still take it 2x/day. I take 5mg in the p.m. till the end of taper. My sx's are only in the morning.
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I'm confused. I know this sounds stupid :-[ but I have bad cog fog and really bad when it comes to math. On 12mg of Valium. I have 5mg and 2mg tabs. I would take the 5 mg in pill form and then dry cut the 2mg into 1mg and dissolve that? Then just get a dropper? I was just wondering if it's okay to take pills with liquid till I get to 1mg. Do you make cuts daily? On the Ashton plan so I would still take it 2x/day. I take 5mg in the p.m. till t 11 the end of taper. My sx's are only in the morning.

 

The widely used liquid tapering concept would say at 12mg, take 11 mg tablets (5+5+1), and the last mg in liquid.  Then each day reduce the liquid until you are at 0 liquid, (and now at 11 mg.)

 

Now take 10 mg with tablets (5+5), and I mg liquid.  Reduce the liquid dose until your down to 0 liquid (and now at 10mg.)

 

Rinse, repeat...

 

I would suggest using a oral syringe instead of a dropper.  1 ml and 10 ml syringes are very inexpensive, usually even free at most pharmacies. 

 

Your dosing schedule is just a personal choice.  Most folks on V dose twice a day, some more oftern and some only once a day...depends on how you feel.  Most of the time I dosed twice a day, and took a smaller dose in the AM, and a bigger dose before bed.  Again, whatever seems to work best for you.

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