How many people HAVE to work while tapering

Etown, I have asked my doctor and she says no ..

I do not know what to do ..I am in a bad place. ..

Love Anu

what was your starting dose?

etown

My starting dose was 2.25 mgs ..

My daily dose now, is 2.07 mgs ..

Anu

How did you feel at 2.25. Unless you can get somewhat stable and get out of this free fall I or nobody else should be giving you tapering advise. What you need is to get somewhat stable and stop this madness. One way to do that is to go back to the last dose you felt ok on and hold there until you have the courage to move on. Getting over to Valium would really make this whole nightmare easier for me and you to work with. The slower acting Benzo's are so irritating to the brain and all the changes in dosing and doses you are making is driving your brain upsidedown. I know I/we can really help if you stabilize. If not your brain in this out of control state will dictate how you feel. IMO you will not be able to taper in this state for long. I would go back to a dose that helps you stabilize whatever that is and hold long enough to catch your breath and do this again. then while you are holding we can come up with a realistic plan to let you taper slowly and keep the symptoms under control somewhat.

etown

Anu - I know you feel like crap right now but if you get a small window take the time to get your signature a little more detailed and cleaned up it is kinda confusing. It helps us know exactly what has gone on and helps us to help you better

etown

Thanks etown.    A few other people have mentioned to me about switching over to Valium also.  I'm kind of hesitant to do so b/c I have a severe sensitivity to meds.  Early on in my taper, my psych tried to switch me over to Clonazepam and it made me feel like I couldn't breathe......so I opted to just try to taper off the Lorazepam without taking anything else.  Others have suggested that I try a liquid titration method.  I'm confused about what to do. It's like a guessing game b/c I have no idea how each different thing may effect me......like, I don't know if I'll have side effects to Valium.....I don't know if liquid titration will have adverse effects......I'm just really confused on how to proceed.....and the psych that I have isn't really helpful....in fact, he tried to get me to jump off altogether when I was at .5 mgs/day.... so I'm kinda on my own with all of this and it's really frustrating. :'(     You mentioned that short acting benzos are more up and down and irritating to the brain......perhaps, that explains the severe headaches  and severe muscle weakness/exhaustion that I get all the time.  I wish I knew exactly what to do so I could feel better......I'm afraid that I will die trying to figure out the right way to get off of the demon drug. :'( :'( :'(  After 2 1/2 months of being down to .125 mgs 2Xs/day, I had a few days where I felt sort of normal and I was too quick to think that I was past all the horrible stuff and decided to jump off.  On day 4 it was so terrible, I had to reinstate and decided to cut a 1/4 dose at the same time and went to .065 mgs 3Xs/day......that proved to a bad idea also.  I went back to .25 mgs total but spread it out to .065 mgs 4Xs/day thinking that would be easier........again, that was also back....so now I'm back to .125 mgs 2Xs/day and going through continued x/s....hoping to reach a point where I'm stabilized.    I have absolutely no idea what I'm doing and in the meantime,  am horribly, horribly sick.  :'( :'( :'( :( :( 

Etown, I am concerned that a long time has gone by, to updose ..Last I was at 2.25 mgs was on August the 10 th. I would worry about it .

.What do you think?

I will clean up my signature ..You are right, it is messy.

Thank you for your effort to help me ..

Love, Anu

Brunette - only a few people have prob crossing to Valium. IMO you should try it. It is way smoother with a longer half life. Read my post a few back about these intense free fall symptoms you are experiencing. There is no need for this pain. You just need a slower taper after stabilizing. Who cares what dose you need to go to to stabilize? You can't go on like this its plain insanity. I will help you regardless it will just take a bit od thinking on my part because Valium tapering is my new life. I love the cut withscales because it is easy accurate and you get to watch the poison go away.

stay here we'll help one way or another

etown

Anu - I know time passed is an issue. But if you keep this up it will take longer to heal anyway. Get to a stable dose whatever it takes and you will be glad you did. You can't go on likr this. This does not need to be like this. Stop this free fall whatever it takes. Starting at a stable dose will probably save you time in the end and one heck of a lot of pain

etown

So that I understand what you are suggesting, etown, Are you saying that it is safe for me to go back to 2.25?

Is there a bad case scenario to do this etown? Can updosing backfire?

Love, Anu

Anu if you were better then than now its a no brainer.

etown

I will be going to work this weekend.  I will be selling things for Christmas at an open air market.  I got a good spot too!  Wish me luck.  I think I will have a blast!

 

SZ-

Hi Anu,

Etown is right about up-dosing.  Look at my sig.  When I dropped from 2.5 to 1.875 I slammed into the wall hard.  I up-dosed just a little bit back to 2mg and held for two weeks.  I started feeling better almost immediately, but held anyway to be sure I was stable before starting back down again using Etowns help with figuring out the daily tapering / scale method.

 

I was disappointed to up-dose, but do not fear it will create negative effects for you.  Quite the opposite - it will allow you to stabilize and get your life back under control. 

 

I hope you get it smoothed out soon.

Way to go Sky - out and about will be really good for you. Making a few bucks can't be a bad thing either.

Good luck

etown

"Quite the opposite - pain is glutamate exitotoxicity and brain cell death"

 

I am not aware of any evidence to date in any animal or human study indicating that pain is "brain cell death." This statement is likely to be unecessarily alarming to folks here. I personally examine brain cell death professionally, and while I have not done this specifically in human brains from people who were on benzos, I would challenge you to provide the evidence that this does indeed occur. With all due respect, I think such statements need to be well thought out before posting.

 

My intention is not to alarm anyone.

 

I apologize if that is how it comes across.

I am referring more specifically to incorrect information being stated as fact. Thank you for your response.

Eliz maybe just modify your wording a bit. I know you didn't mean to be counter productive. That way if people read back they won't get the wrong idea. I do agree with you though that crazy out of contol symptoms do not equal healing.

We have a fun and informative thread here and the intention has never been to give information that can be taken wrongly, so lets fix it and move on.

Thanks Liz you're the best.

Laser thank you for pointing it out from a professionals perspective

etown

Hi everybody!

 

Tough day. Kids pounced on us at 5:00 am. Good thing Dad is here to help.

 

Anyway, I modified my sig. Any advice on my Ativan taper?

 

Since beginning a liquid micro taper, I've had a lot more functional days than bad days. I've even had a big improvement in my cognition, motivation and REM sleep. I can feel emotions again. S/x have been headaches, soreness, tiredness and 2 brief adrenaline surges (each after a stressful event). There have been a few days where I almost felt normal.

 

My daily cut has been between .002 mg and .005 mg, depending on how I feel. I started at .002 at the beginning and worked up to .005

 

What do y'all think? Too slow? Too fast? Could I speed up because I'm feeling better overall?

 

I'm new at this and could use the advice of people who have more experience.

 

Thanks,

 

Rriver

When I was at 0.65mg Ativan, my weekly cut (mg) worked out to be a daily reduction (e.g. divided by 7) that was >0.05mg. That was me and may not be appropriate for someone else, but I did tolerate it well until I started getting lower. Look at my sig and divide my weekly cuts by 7, you'll get an idea of my pace. I am doing pretty well these days and headed off to work in a few minutes.

 

Glad to hear you are doing better. Liquid lorazepam really was essential for me to get control of this beast. Just gradually keep bumping up your cuts until your body says stop. The message your body tells you will be loud and clear. And due to Ativans rapid PK, you should hear this message rather quickly and can adjust as necessary.

Hi all....I'm back after a week of having preschool-age grandkids visit. We had a great time despite my benzo trials. It was heartwarming and nice to have the distraction and what a sweet (tho hectic) distraction it was!

 

I hope everyone's workweek is going well so far; with the week half over now, it is a slide into home plate, right?

 

I see elsewhere that exercise has become a great topic and is bringing about terrific improvements for those who are able to be more active. It is amazing and inspiring to see the efforts put out by those of you who are making it work for you against all odds. I am hoping to have my treadmill by Friday and join the ranks, although I have to confess that just an hour shopping with my 4 year old grandcherub yesterday put me back in bed in misery by the afternoon. I have right rib pain and lower back rib pain that makes it difficult to even stand for more than a few minutes. Does anyone else have this?  I'm thinking of doubling my magnesium to see if that helps. Anyone have any other suggestions?

 

On the neural pathway issues and our withdrawal symptoms, during my manic researching period, I found a LOT of information on the disregulation of GABA and glutamate neuron pathways in the arenas of seizure disorders (one danger of benzo wd), Multiple Sclerosis, Amylateral Sclerosis, Huntingtons Disease, and very new research in autism, ADHD, and bipolar. These disorders all have GABA/ glutamate disregulation as a part of the disease process and this has been known and researched for quite some time. In ALS and Huntingtons, the glutamate toxicity causes continual neural cell damage to the extent that eventually the neural damage is severe enough that the end result is not life sustaining. Many people have beat the odds of their prognosis by following a glutamate and aspartame restricted diet (GARD) to reduce the damage to the neural receptors. Parents of ADHD and autism spectrum children have also reported good results with this diet and report some radical behavior changes too. I found all this research very interesting because benzo use creates a down regulation of GABA receptor neurons and therefore a proportionate over abundance of glutamate excitability very similar. We are so blessed to know what is causing this and have high expectations for healing this disregulation as we withdraw the benzos and our bodies regenerate GABA neurons. Every single person is unique as to liver methylation, brain plasticity, kidney function, the extent of the downregulation, the degree of perfection of the new neural growth, etc.  No one statement on recovery can be made that covers every person; there are just too many variables. I can say, for myself, after studying the preponderance of what is already KNOWN about neural disregulation, that I am very comfortable in the belief that a taper that does NOT get too far ahead of the healing rate allows for more complete and less damaged neural regeneration and less damage overall to the many body systems affected by benzo neural disregulation.  If the taper rate far exceeds the rate of healing, we only have to look around this website to see the great variation in individuals ability to heal. Some CTs seem to heal within months and then there are those who are many many years out who have not experienced healing still. The protracted thread is testament. There are very few on the protracted thread that followed a very slow and mostly asymptomatic taper. Most protracted folks warn the rest of us to NOT follow their example. This is not intended at all, in any fashion, to scare people, but to HELP them have better outcomes. I hope the potential for fear does not become a reason to suppress information that may have the capacity to help so many sufferers navigate their way safely out of benzo hell and go on to live a healthy life. Not to say some fast taperers and CTs haven't done so, but everyone needs to find their own unique "sweet spot"that works for them. Using

the information already available in the research and in the anecdotal experience of so many might aid in that process.

 

Here's to happy and healthy healing for us all!  We are ALL in the same boat rowing in the same direction. Heave ho, yonder shores are brimming with benzo free good living!

 

~OneLove~ 

 

 

Hi OneLove,

Nice to have you back and to hear that your visit with your family went well.  I hope you had a ball!

 

On the exercise thing, I am following Bart's advice and starting slow on my elliptical machine.  Only up to 13 minutes daily so far but I started at only 5 minutes, so that is an improvement.  Even if you start slow, you can build up daily or weekly at your own pace.  I feel like it is helping me already.  For sure even this little amount daily is having a positive effect on my sleep.

 

Are you still holding?

i am holding and waiting to stabilize.  Had some wdrwals at work but not miserable.  I did make it to the gym for 25 minutes of elliptical at lunch.  very easy pace. 

you got it

drew

etown

Hi Eliz and thanks for the welcome back. It's good to be back!!  I've missed my Benzo Buddies and the great support we all give one another.

 

I'm so impressed with your elliptical workout. I actually went to a store and tried one out two weeks ago. I LOVE that smooth action they have and that would be soooo much easier on my bad ribs, costochondritis, and back stuff that this benzo as made sooooo much worse. The low impact would be so much better for recovery, from that aspect. But the doggone thing wore me out so seriously in less than 60 seconds that I can't even begin to fathom 13 minutes straight. If you keep this up, you will be mighty for sure! And whaaaaa??  Did you say it is HELPING YOUR SLEEP?  That is MAJOR, is it not?  I mean, gee, I think about how many things you have tried to help your sleep and there you were, still having to function every single day with very little sleep. I honestly don't know how you were able to do it. To find that this workout is truly helping your sleep is really incredibly amazing. How can you beat a triple bonus like that?  Better health, GABA upregulation, AND better sleep?  Wow. Now I am much more eager to get my treadmill. Except I'm beginning to think maybe I should rethink the elliptical instead. Any thoughts on the difference between the two? 

 

And I need to update my signature. I have been doing some corrective dosing from my low of 2.55 and have been holding at 2.70 for a few days. Debating on several options from here as things are not going as well at this dose as I had hoped.