Author Topic: Valium dosing question maybe builder(?)  (Read 3353 times)

[Buddie]

Valium dosing question maybe builder(?)
« on: October 15, 2019, 04:36:11 pm »
I was taking 5mg at 7am, 5mg at 3pm and 5mg at 11pm.  I changed the 3pm dose to all liquid and cut it down to 7ml from 50ml. I am having a lot of ups and downs.  I thought about evening out all of my doses, and doing 2.5mg in pill form, and the rest in liquid for all three doses.  Then, cutting one of those doses down each day and trying to keep them even.  Or, should I try to completely eliminate the middle dose, then move the other two doses to 12 hrs apart so Iím not waiting so long?  My GeneSite test said I am a rapid metabolizer of Valium.  Iíve thought of doing all liquid, but thatís a lot of PG and nasty Valium water a day.  :sick: Iím just wondering what has worked for others...  I started at 20mg and Iím down to 10.7.  Doing about a 7.5% cut a month. Thanks!
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: Valium dosing question maybe builder(?)
« Reply #1 on: October 15, 2019, 06:06:29 pm »
Even at the short end of the scale ("rapid metabolizer"), the half life [...] 18 hours!  And because of the accumulation factor (approx. 8:1), small changes in the daily dose schedule will probably never really be felt.

And all that PG would be about 1/2 oz.  (Why does everyone obsess about the inactive components in a liquid, but never seem to worry about the 7-8 inactive ingredients in their tablet?)

Every one needs to choose a taper plan that they believe will work for them.  But IMO, a DLMT taper with a true, uniformly-distributed solution (vodka/water, PG/water, or diluted Rx liquid) [...] the easiest, most comfortable option.
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: Valium dosing question maybe builder(?)
« Reply #2 on: October 15, 2019, 07:06:45 pm »
Even at the short end of the scale ("rapid metabolizer"), the half life [...] 18 hours!  And because of the accumulation factor (approx. 8:1), small changes in the daily dose schedule will probably never really be felt.

And all that PG would be about 1/2 oz.  (Why does everyone obsess about the inactive components in a liquid, but never seem to worry about the 7-8 inactive ingredients in their tablet?)

Every one needs to choose a taper plan that they believe will work for them.  But IMO, a DLMT taper with a true, uniformly-distributed solution (vodka/water, PG/water, or diluted Rx liquid) [...] the easiest, most comfortable option.

I have been doing a DLMT using 100ml of PG and 400ml of water.  I dissolve 50mg in the Pg then add the water.  I was just wondering if I should dose 2 or 3 times a day, really.  And, assuming by your answer, doing half a pill and part liquid isnít best.  All liquid would be, correct?  I have been fine with it and am just trying to do what [...] best.  I changed all doses to even doses today, before I put this up this morning.  However, I am open to all good options. You helped me to set up my taper.  I think we even talked about what I should do when I got down to 2 pills.  But my brain canít remember.   
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: Valium dosing question maybe builder(?)
« Reply #3 on: October 15, 2019, 07:33:37 pm »
Whether you dose 2 or 3 times a day isn't going to make any difference. Your blood levels aren't going to vary enough to have any real effect.

And whether it's pills or liquid, 1mg diazepam [...] 1mg of diazepam.  Your body won't know how it got to your stomach.  I did a pills + liquid taper, because I too was intimidated by all the BS I read here on BB.  If I had to do it al over, I would have just done liquid, for the convenience. 

It's whatever your comfortable with.  If you like the tablets + liquid, then stay on  it.  If you think all liquid would be more convenient, then switch.

1mg diazepam [...] 1mg diazepam.
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: Valium dosing question maybe builder(?)
« Reply #4 on: October 15, 2019, 07:49:14 pm »
Whether you dose 2 or 3 times a day isn't going to make any difference. Your blood levels aren't going to vary enough to have any real effect.

And whether it's pills or liquid, 1mg diazepam [...] 1mg of diazepam.  Your body won't know how it got to your stomach.  I did a pills + liquid taper, because I too was intimidated by all the BS I read here on BB.  If I had to do it al over, I would have just done liquid, for the convenience. 

It's whatever your comfortable with.  If you like the tablets + liquid, then stay on  it.  If you think all liquid would be more convenient, then switch.

1mg diazepam [...] 1mg diazepam.

You have a very valid point.  I appreciate your wisdom.   You originally had me do 100ml pg and 400ml of water with 50mg of Valium.  I cut .25ml a day. 
[...] there a more concentrated formula I might try (that youíd recommend) so Iím not drinking close to 50ml per dose? 
I know everyone bothers you for taper advice, I truly appreciate that you take the time to help people who are still trying to get off of this crap.  2x a day would be easier.  Iíve made 3 changes in the past 3 days, but I agree, Valium [...] valium, either way.  Thank you.
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: Valium dosing question maybe builder(?)
« Reply #5 on: October 15, 2019, 07:55:55 pm »
Whether you dose 2 or 3 times a day isn't going to make any difference. Your blood levels aren't going to vary enough to have any real effect.

And whether it's pills or liquid, 1mg diazepam [...] 1mg of diazepam.  Your body won't know how it got to your stomach.  I did a pills + liquid taper, because I too was intimidated by all the BS I read here on BB.  If I had to do it al over, I would have just done liquid, for the convenience. 

It's whatever your comfortable with.  If you like the tablets + liquid, then stay on  it.  If you think all liquid would be more convenient, then switch.

1mg diazepam [...] 1mg diazepam.

Specifically, what 'BS' here at BB? Really - I'd like to know!
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: Valium dosing question maybe builder(?)
« Reply #6 on: October 15, 2019, 10:02:28 pm »
[...] what are the other 7- 8 other inactive ingredients in valium? Thank you
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: Valium dosing question maybe builder(?)
« Reply #7 on: October 16, 2019, 12:07:18 am »
Whether you dose 2 or 3 times a day isn't going to make any difference. Your blood levels aren't going to vary enough to have any real effect.

And whether it's pills or liquid, 1mg diazepam [...] 1mg of diazepam.  Your body won't know how it got to your stomach.  I did a pills + liquid taper, because I too was intimidated by all the BS I read here on BB.  If I had to do it al over, I would have just done liquid, for the convenience. 

It's whatever your comfortable with.  If you like the tablets + liquid, then stay on  it.  If you think all liquid would be more convenient, then switch.

1mg diazepam [...] 1mg diazepam.

You have a very valid point.  I appreciate your wisdom.   You originally had me do 100ml pg and 400ml of water with 50mg of Valium.  I cut .25ml a day. 
[...] there a more concentrated formula I might try (that youíd recommend) so Iím not drinking close to 50ml per dose? 
I know everyone bothers you for taper advice, I truly appreciate that you take the time to help people who are still trying to get off of this crap.  2x a day would be easier.  Iíve made 3 changes in the past 3 days, but I agree, Valium [...] valium, either way.  Thank you.

The only part of the ratio that's important [...] 2ml PG for each 1mg of diazepam. You can add as much, or as little, water as you wish.  The .1mg per ml suggest concentration [...] just for convenience.  As long as you use 2ml solvent for each mg diazepam, you can dilute as you choose.

But remember, dilution makes measuring easier, and dramatically reduces the error factor.
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: Valium dosing question maybe builder(?)
« Reply #8 on: October 16, 2019, 08:42:14 am »
Whether you dose 2 or 3 times a day isn't going to make any difference. Your blood levels aren't going to vary enough to have any real effect.

And whether it's pills or liquid, 1mg diazepam [...] 1mg of diazepam.  Your body won't know how it got to your stomach.  I did a pills + liquid taper, because I too was intimidated by all the BS I read here on BB.  If I had to do it al over, I would have just done liquid, for the convenience. 

It's whatever your comfortable with.  If you like the tablets + liquid, then stay on  it.  If you think all liquid would be more convenient, then switch.

1mg diazepam [...] 1mg diazepam.

Specifically, what 'BS' here at BB? Really - I'd like to know!

Seems like you missed my post, [...].

Actually, I now have two questions for you:

1) To what 'BS at BB' do you refer?

2) Can you provide a citation in support of your argument that 'home brew' liquids possess an identical pharmacokinetic profile to regular prescribed pills? Inquiring minds must know!
Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.

[Buddie]

Re: Valium dosing question maybe builder(?)
« Reply #9 on: October 16, 2019, 12:10:40 pm »
Whether you dose 2 or 3 times a day isn't going to make any difference. Your blood levels aren't going to vary enough to have any real effect.

And whether it's pills or liquid, 1mg diazepam [...] 1mg of diazepam.  Your body won't know how it got to your stomach.  I did a pills + liquid taper, because I too was intimidated by all the BS I read here on BB.  If I had to do it al over, I would have just done liquid, for the convenience. 

It's whatever your comfortable with.  If you like the tablets + liquid, then stay on  it.  If you think all liquid would be more convenient, then switch.

1mg diazepam [...] 1mg diazepam.

Specifically, what 'BS' here at BB? Really - I'd like to know!

Seems like you missed my post, [...].

Actually, I now have two questions for you:

1) To what 'BS at BB' do you refer?

2) Can you provide a citation in support of your argument that 'home brew' liquids possess an identical pharmacokinetic profile to regular prescribed pills? Inquiring minds must know!

Yes, I guess I missed that post. sorry.

The BS [...] all of the precautions I read here on BB that one must "adapt" or "gradually transition"  to liquid, that it somehow [...] metabolized differently.  A concept completely unsupported by any med or pharma science.  (...and thankfully,  that view actually seems to be slowly diminishing here on BB  ;))

A simple google search for the Rx  liquid benzos will show that the each contains 3 common ingredients, 1) a benzo, 2) a solvent (alcohol or propylene glycol) and 3)water.  Different formulations will also have some stablizers, extenders, colorants, flavorants, etc, the add to its commercial acceptability, but really don't effect it's functionality.  The common solvents, alcohol or PG, will dissolve the benzo into a uniformly distributed solution, and water will dilute to a more convenient concentration.

Suggestions, opinions and/or advice provided by the author of this post should not be regarded as medical advice; nor should it substitute for professional medical care. Consult your doctor before making any changes to your medication. Please read our Community Policy Documents board for further information.