please please help what is the point of my taper

I don't know how to bear the anxiety.  I am non-functional and suffer with each breath. 

 

I'm tapering from a dose I never took on any kind of regular basis - 30mg valium.  I am now at 10mg and things are no different.  I have not felt the drops.  I don't think I'm much worse either than when I was on 30mg. 

 

I was on 10mg on and off from July to sept last year.  I assume that kindled me and the medical system failed me, not with a rapid taper (I wish), but by updosing me twice.  The second updose was the lethal blow, offering no relief and only more anxiety.

 

I was a million times better, even with the kindling, before I reached out for help. 

 

It's taken me almost a year to get from 10mg to....10mg.  The mental anguish of this is horrific. 

 

I'm mentally incapable of tapering more slowly.  The smaller drops at the beginning are no different to the bigger drops (percentage wise) now.  I am unstable but have no wish to stabilise on any dose; I want to stabilise on zero. 

 

I don't know how to continue like this.  I have already sped up my taper with no additional symptoms and want to speed it up further. 

 

I know this is not BB's recommendation, but others are not tapering from a dose they never took and others feel the drops.

 

My abuse was sporadic.  I took a total of 4 doses in 2022 before going on it more regularly in July to cope with what I thought was covid.  The last of these doses was an overdose, not the other 3, and 2 weeks after that overdose I had a positive covid test.

 

I don't know what is going on with me.  It is beyond unbearable. 

 

 

 

I am so sorry that you are going through this. You are brave and strong to keep moving forward. I see one positive thing in your story: "I have already sped up my taper with no additional symptoms." I wish I could say the same. There is no right or wrong in these situations, and deprescribing guidelines are general, so you can only do what you can based on your experience and the guidelines you have researched on this site and in other reputable medical literature like from Dr. Mark Horowitz. There is no way around but through, and it totally sucks. And if you layer another medication on top of it, it adds further potential for unwanted side effects or symptoms.

Hi Simonaabranches

 

I’m so sorry this process is proving to be such hell for you, as it also is for some others.

 

This is a very difficult post to reply to, but if I can just give you an intuitive response.

 

The thing that stands out the most is that you seem to be stuck between following general guidelines, and following your own intuition.

 

If you are in such a highly symptomatic state, and only you could ‘possibly’ know this, and I say ‘possibly’ because we only ever know the depths of symptom based suffering that we’ve experienced to this point, and there’s a potential that there may even be deeper levels of suffering we haven’t yet experienced, then the question this poses is this - am I already experiencing acute withdraw? Keeping in mind that there may even be different levels within that.

 

You say there is no discernible difference to the severity of symptoms making smaller reductions or larger reductions, and if this is indeed the case, if I were in your position with few options remaining, then I would probably consider looking at doing a faster taper as suggested in the Ashton Manual for those experiencing toxicity type issues. A C/T would be the absolute last option in my mind, simply because we’re only ever guessing that things couldn’t get any worse, so a faster taper may be the compromise to this. If your experience truly tells you that your symptoms are neither worse nor better regardless of the size of your reductions to this point, then maybe a faster taper is your best option (maybe), as you will still be giving your brain at least some time to adjust on the way down before jumping. This is a decision only you can make, based on your own personal experience thus far, and the only advice I could offer is this - proceed cautiously 

Simon

 

I am sorry for what you are going through.

 

If your able, I would like to compare notes.

 

I have been tapering pretty steady for about 2 years, several medical set backs.

 

I am also on seroquel. I cut my seroquel in November, and the mental anguish was something I had never experienced. I gradually reinstated, but I am stuck with the mental anguish.

 

I do not know what it is. It feels like a byproduct of xanax, not withdrawal. It  could be serotonin syndrome, that happens sometimes while tapering.

 

I take my doses, and on bad days (like today) nothing changes. I am not experiencing the wd sxs I used to much on days like today, just pure ongoing mental anguish I utterly cant describe.

 

I did cut a dose yesterday, and I did not feel it, but the dose was too small, and I hit interdose at 2 hours.

 

I am trying to figure this out, hence reaching out to you.

 

Thanks

-Dove

thank you so much winter sun.

 

how do you know if you feel the drops? I had my 1st proper window ever on day 3 of 10mg.  I woke up several times through the night but with no panic attack - have not woken without panic in 5 months.  then during the day I could go to a shop, walk, and go online and could basically breathe. I had conversations and was almost normal. this can sometimes happen in the evening but have never had a day like this in over 5 months since horrific 30mg updose.

 

2 days later (yesterday), I had one of my worst days, on floor, stomach and chest heaving upwards violent shakes like a scene from exorcist.  called ambulance twice (they didn't come).  only positive was that I could stay still - other days I've been constantly crawling from room to room, writhing, screaming - I think it's called psychomotor agitation...

 

today is more bearable so far, managed a walk and did not shake in shower.  can type this with 1 finger after 1 hour breathing exercises.

 

I have logged symptoms/ratings since 20mg and can't see any pattern.

 

if I take my 10mg on empty stomach it hits me and I feel drugged for an hour, then all anxiety returns.  taken with food I don't feel it. 

 

so yes, just wondering what Ashton says signs of toxicity are.

 

I am going to taper faster.  I'm under a psychiatrist now who wanted me to go super slow, but now seems to accept trying super fast.  once I got what I wanted (endorsement) I'm now worried what will happen.  am going to go to 8mg after just 1 week.  go up again if seems too fast.  but how would I know it's too fast, as my worst days are random?

 

anyway, thanks so much, and baddove will reply soon...

Hi Simonaabranches

 

So when you say you’re going to taper faster, I imagine you mean larger reductions, rather than shorter recovery periods between reductions?

 

I think I may have even done your intro, and I do remember the updoses to 30mg where you felt worse. I know you say that it’s basically taken a year to taper from 10mg to 10mg because of those updoses, but at least you are now at that 10mg dose again. Can’t change what’s happened, but you are more aware of what works and what doesn’t work for you. You know there’s no point updosing at any point again. Been there, done that, didn’t work. So know you don’t have to agonise over whether updosing will serve to ease your taper process.

 

I’m tapering Valium and I generally experience increased symptoms on day 4 after reducing, and then a gradual stabilisation from day 9 or 10, depending on what’s going on in my daily life at the time. Most of my symptoms remain on a consistent basis throughout my taper, but I know when I’m feeling the reduction because everything becomes more bleak and my drive to carry out any basic daily chores becomes more challenged in terms of taking action. It also becomes more difficult to summon the energy to reply to threads here on BB and even if I can summon the energy, I struggle to comprehend incoming information, find words, and put sentences together.

 

In answer to your question - I would pay close attention to your symptom severity in the days before you reduce, and then watch for changes in the intensity of your symptoms from day 3 onwards after you reduce.

 

I hope this helps a little.

 

WS