CLONOPIN HELP! I can’t figure out taper dosage. Where is everyone?

[[Buddie]]

I copied this from general support. I don’t know how to move. Apologies.

Desperate for advice on % of clonopin to cut down for each period. I can’t switch to another benzo with smaller doses. I have 0.5 tablets and need to order scale, file, pill cutter. I am horrendous at math. I’m too visual. It seems that trimming off 0.001 per day from 0.875 (weight of 0.5 mg pill is 0.200) will take approx 200 days. Is that correct? You see my dilemma. Or do I shave off 10% (0.7875) and hold for a few weeks then shave another 10% off of that, etc.

Starting at 0.875mg/ once per day (0.5 tablets) see signature for how I’ve broken pills for 0.875 dose.
Like this?
Weeks 1 - 2 = 0.875 (globally hold for more weeks if symptoms get bad)
Weeks 3 - 4 = 0.7875
Weeks 5 - 6 = 0.70875
Weeks 7 - 9 = 0.6378
Weeks 10 - 12 = 0.57402

I will go slower if I start to develop worsening symptoms, of course. I just can’t figure out the math and I don’t fit the Ashton Manual suggestion.

Thank you! ❤️

[[Buddie]]

It looks like the taper schedule that you have laid out is a reasonable one.  It looks like you understand well the importance of letting your symptoms dictate the amount of the cut and the rate.

You can look at my signature for an example of how someone else does the shave and hold.  We're each different and you may find a better pace for yourself.

Sometimes we change our plans, and instead of cut and hold, we switch to the DMT method (Daily Micro Tapering).  Oftentimes hold periods are done during this kind of taper, too.

As you know, a gram scale like the GEM20 is a good way to make precision cuts.  A nail file is not required, but I use one and it seems to work well.

Any other questions, please ask..

[[Buddie]]

Hi [...]

As you get lower you will probably be wanting to use a scale, so below is a link to the one I use, however the GEM20 that [...] mentions is quite popular on here, so you may choose to go with that.

https://www.amazon.com.au/Precision-Milligram-Tweezers-Calibration-Weighing/dp/B011J88S8M/ref=asc_df_B011J88S8M/?tag=googleshopdsk-22&linkCode=df0&hvadid=341774158480&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=15326910344609212524&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9071742&hvtargid=pla-310643494494&psc=1


Math - weigh your tablet or normal dose that you’re measuring by eye and taking at the moment , and lets say that your particular tablet/dose weighs 0.172mg on the scale (this is just an example of what 1 of my Valium tablets weighs), you would then get your calculator and punch in 0.172 and the multiply that by 0.95 (for a 5% reduction) or 0.90 (for a 10%) reduction. This will give you the remaining weight of your dose… less the 5 or 10%.

It will be more difficult to do an accurate daily micro taper because of both the potency of clonazepam and the possible fluctuations or inconsistencies associated with weighing such small reductions from such a small potent benzodiazepine, so you could just try the cut and hold method at say 5% reductions every two weeks, or however long you feel it takes to feel recovered to your baseline symptoms. Remember, (as [...] pointed out) in most cases, doing a daily micro taper doesn’t avoid the necessity of holding for a period, as reductions do still catch up to you, and I think this is a common misconception among many who choose the DMT. You do need to hold on a dose at times to avoid the reductions piling up on top of one another.

There are other options for micro tapering, including compounded liquid suspensions, but that’s more [...]’ area of expertise, so if any of what we’ve discussed here becomes problematic, and you’d prefer to try a liquid option (if your prescriber was on board), then just let us know and I’ll see if [...] can lay out some information in regard to your liquid method options. However, I would just get you to post to the Titration board to carry on that conversation.

Let me know if the way I have explained the math makes sense.

Just in regard to the math… big thanks to [...]!

[[Buddie]]

Thank you, both! For now, I feel the slow taper and hold is best, but time will tell. I’m going to let the severity of any symptoms dictate the schedule. I don’t really trust any custom pharmacies around here for liquids. Hopefully, I’ll be able to manage the cut and hold down to the smaller dose. Perhaps then I could switch to a med with smaller dose options (smaller dose per tablet). I’m grateful to have found this group and thankful for your kind words and encouragement.

❤️

[[Buddie]]

Do you have Solco clonazepam? I believe those weigh .200 g. Teva and Accord weigh about .170 g. Just don't go too fast, but don't be afraid to try going faster if you seem to be doing okay at a certain rate. You don't want to go slower than you need to, but you definitely don't want to go faster than you can handle.

[[Buddie]]

Dear [...],

I have the generic ClonazePam tablets. I’m not sure who makes them. Round, orange, scored. I’ve yet to purchase scale, but I do know pill weights tend to vary. I’ll be aware of that. I plan to cut 10% every 3rd week, and hopefully, that isn’t too fast or too slow. It’s frustrating not knowing what to expect. I do tend to think the cut and hold might be safer (for me) than the micro tapering (shaving off minuscule amts daily), but I could be wrong. BTW, I checked out the scale you use. Quite fancy. I can barely afford heat! I guess I’ll go for the basic version and calibrate a lot.

Thank you for responding. It means a lot.
❤️

[[Buddie]]

Dear [...],

I have the generic ClonazePam tablets. I’m not sure who makes them. Round, orange, scored. I’ve yet to purchase scale, but I do know pill weights tend to vary. I’ll be aware of that. I plan to cut 10% every 3rd week, and hopefully, that isn’t too fast or too slow. It’s frustrating not knowing what to expect. I do tend to think the cut and hold might be safer (for me) than the micro tapering (shaving off minuscule amts daily), but I could be wrong. BTW, I checked out the scale you use. Quite fancy. I can barely afford heat! I guess I’ll go for the basic version and calibrate a lot.

Thank you for responding. It means a lot.
❤️

Hi [...]

I understand the issue with excessive energy prices. It the same in Australia, which brings me to the point… the link to those scales is in AU$. It’s probably about half that if you’re in the UK or US.

However, I just checked the GEM20, and they were cheaper at about half the price again.

[[Buddie]]

[...],

Yes, the scale [...] mentioned is still over $1000 in the US. I’ll stick to the Gemini or the other more affordable ones. Just trying to afford basic living is insane all over the world. Ironically, benzos are cheap or free with insurance. Pathetic how our HC is in the US.

[[Buddie]]

[...],

Yes, the scale [...] mentioned is still over $1000 in the US. I’ll stick to the Gemini or the other more affordable ones. Just trying to afford basic living is insane all over the world. Ironically, benzos are cheap or free with insurance. Pathetic how our HC is in the US.

Benzos are very cheap. Yeah, you don't have to have a scale like mine. I decided to use the money I was saving for a laptop to get a scale I could count on because my anxiety was so bad, and I had had a bad experience with a kitchen scale I got on Amazon way back. I didn't want a repeat of that. But lots of people use the GEM20.

It sounds like you have Accord tablets, which should average about .170 g. That's what I have been taking from the beginning. They're crap.

[[Buddie]]

[...],

Well, that sucks. I’m guessing the scale was off. Not good. I’ll be needing a new Mac soon, so I’m going to go with the lesser priced scale for now with fingers crossed. I just placed the order. Yes, the tablets I have are crap. They don’t cut down very well. I just spoke to my prescriber about my tapering and she said “You don’t need a scale. Just do 1/4 cuts a week” because, of course she did. Are they all so misinformed? Maybe. I’m not at all anti-med, but I had no idea what I was getting myself into. We are on our own in this. Best of luck to you. I need to look at your sig to see if you’re off everything.

BTW, love Eugene Levy! The Best!