Jump to content

Back on the benzos and scared


[Ma...]

Recommended Posts

Hello,

 

I am joining because I really need some support. I was on clonazepam many years ago (on it for probably 15 years at 2mg/day at the max) and managed to get off of it. Now three to four years later, after suffering some panic attacks and sleepless nights, I used an old supply of cloanzepam 0.25mg twice a day for a few days to try to get by. After going to the emergency room with more panic, I was prescribed clonazepam again for a short course (0.5mg twice a day for 5 days). After that, I needed to go back to the emergency room after more panic attacks and there I was prescribed lorazepam (0.5mg three times a day for 4 days).

 

When the lorazepam script ran out, I could instantly tell that I was again dependent on them again for I felt terrible and the withdrawals were pretty intense. I was forced to use that old supply of clonazepam 0.25mg a few times in a day to get by until I could get another script for the lorazepam.

 

My pdoc was willing to prescribe lorazepam 0.5mg twice a day, but I can tell it is not enough to take care of the withdrawals and I am starting to suffer.

 

I now fear I am fighting the half live of the clonazepam wearing off and tapering down on the lorazepam too fast and am really scared.

 

I am looking for any advice to keep from going into dangerous territory here. Thanks.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Helo Marantz90, welcome to BenzoBuddies,

 

It looks as if your body is already dependent and a taper will be necessary, do you have a doctor who would be willing to work with you to keep you suppled so you can taper?

 

We’ll be happy to support you as you do this, was your last taper difficult or was it fairly mild?  Can you pinpoint what has caused you to experience this anxiety and panic?  Do you feel the benzodiazepines may be contributing to your current anxiety?

 

I’l provide some links to help you find your way around the forum, we look forward to knowing more of your story.

 

Pamster

Colorado Consortium Benzodiazepine Deprescribing Guidance

 

Planning Your Withdrawal (Taper)

 

Ashton Manual symptom list

 

The Ashton Manual

 

Withdrawal Support (during your taper)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks for the quick reply,

 

I do have a doctor that will help me taper, so that is a blessing.

 

I think the benzos are helping the anxiety probably only now because I am dependent on them unfortunately.

 

I had some trauma from the past come up recently which triggered the sleepless nights and the anxiety. I really wished I would have stayed away from the benzos, but I was so desperate that I caved in.

 

My last taper was pretty difficult and took some time, so that is why I am so scared and disappointed in my self this time around.

 

My main concern now is that I have been mixing the clonazepam and the lorazepam since the lorazepam script ran out at one point. Last night after trying to go 12 hours between lorazepam doses in an attempt to go from 3x/day to 2x/day, I had my scheduled dose at 7pm but was still withdrawing pretty bad, so I had to have another at 1am. That didn't really fix much, so I gave in and had 0.25mg clonazepam at 3:30am and that finally calmed me some. It seems the half life of clonazepam is catching up with me, so I am curious if people think I should just try to stick with the lorazepam 0.5mg 3x/day and try to stabilize there or if I am going to have to incorporate clonazepam to now that it is in my system.

 

I am kind of lost at this point and would be happy just getting on a program that keeps me out of uncomfortable w/d to start and then start the taper at some point. Any advice would be so very appreciated. Thanks!

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

My advice would be to get stable and taper from the Clonazepam, its longer half-life will mean less interdose, do you have that option, is that the benzo your doctor will most likely prescribe?

 

I wouldn’t suggest trying to go from 3 doses to 2 of the Ativan, most members will dose 3 times a day so if you decide to stay on that, I’d stick to 3. 

 

Whatever you do, I hope you’ll work at taking your doses consistently to keep your blood serum levels constant.  It’s also important to find the dose that will help you get stable, we define stable as able to carry out your daily tasks, not feeling great.

 

I’m sorry to hear your last taper was difficult, I’m sure you’re worried about facing this again.  I’m glad you can pinpoint the trauma that caused this, hopefully its passed and you can focus on getting free from the drug again.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks for the response. Right now my doctor is only prescribing the lorazepam. The clonazepam I have is from a previous script that they wrote (which I took for a week or so) before I stopped early and they switched me over to lorazepam due to severe acute anxiety.

 

So you think I should find a stable dose of lorazepam taken 3x/day and then work on tapering off the clonazepam since it is still in my system?

 

My dosing has been all over the place and now I understand the importance of keeping it consistent. Thanks for the pointer there.

 

This is all so frustrating to be on two different ones and not being sure which is doing what if you know what I mean. Thanks again for the support.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think she is willing to do 3x per day at 0.5mg. She have me the option of 2 or 3, and I thought 2 would be better to get off of it quicker, but I was wrong about that :)
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, speed is not something we recommend around here, we can rush the taper and suffer for it but there’s no rushing recovery, that takes what it takes. 

 

Can you do me a favor, can you use this calculator to estimate what your daily dose of your combined benzodiazepines has been, we need to find out if .5  Ativan 3 times a day is going to be enough to cover what you’ve been taking the last little while. https://clincalc.com/Benzodiazepine/

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I believe I have been roughly taking 0.5mg x 3 everyday this last little stretch. My doc wants to stick to 0.5mg x 2 script now with the addition of mirtazipine at night for sleep, which I am not a huge fan of trying right now, but I am desperate for sleep. I don't think the 0.5mg x 2 will cut it right now as that is too big of a drop right? Thanks again.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

What we need to figure out is your Clonazepam use, how much have you taken and do we need to figure that in when we look at the total dose of Ativan your doctor is willing to prescribe.  If you’re only going to get 1 mg a day I’m not sure you’re going to be able to function. 

 

I don’t have experience with Mirtazipine, I’ve read it can help some but just as it is with adding any other medication while going through this, it can be risky because we don’t always react the way we normally would because our central nervous system is so sensitive.  We have a support group thread for those attempting to taper from it. http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=80102.0

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yep, so the days that I had to substitute clonazepam, I did with 3 x 0.25mg, so equivalent to 3 x 0.5 lorazepam. So I guess I answered my own question there. 2 x 0.5mg lorazepam will be too big of a taper down at this time.

 

What I read about mirtazapine is exactly what you are saying, it could go either way. Then you have another drug you have to worry about tapering off in the future too. I just don't know that I want to do that.

 

Thanks again for your help.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I’m glad you worked out the Clonazepam doses, that was my fear too.  I hope you can convince your doctor to meet your individual needs, a patient led, symptom based taper is in the best interest of the patient and isn’t that what doctors should be focusing on?

 

I think its a good idea you’re doing your homework on the adjunct medications, I’ve seen it go both ways. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I like your idea of tapering with clonazepam. The short half life of lorazepam is going to be difficult to deal with I think. I think I just need to get a on stable dose at this point and level out before I can plan a taper. There are lots of "ups and downs" with the withdrawal symptoms at this point. Do you typically need to do a "crossover" if you are switching from one benzo to another?

 

Since I was taking 3 x 0.5mg lorazepam and 0.5mg lorazepam = 0.25mg clonazepam, would you would suggest trying for 3 x 0.25mg clonazepam to see if that could work?

 

Thanks again for all of the help. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Equivalencies aren’t an exact science, a lot depends on how you react to it so while it’s good to have a proposed dose in mind, I think you’ll need to do this slowly so you can arrive at a stable dose but not over-medicated. 

 

Crossovers are the most successful when they’re done slowly, when crossing to Valium this is particularly important because it takes so long to properly build up.  Going from Ativan to Clonazepam shouldn’t take as long but you could use this period to gently introduce the drug and aim for your desired dose.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ok, that is good to know, thanks for the information. I am just all over the place with what I should be trying to do. Not sleeping well is making my decision making process tougher too if you know what I mean.

 

The 0.5mg lorazepam 2x/day is leaving me with w/d symptoms like muscle jitters and some lightheadedness in between doses, so I wonder if I should just try to get my provider to just prescribe 3x/day for now and get stable until I figure out what to do. No sense in toughing it out at a lower dose if it is going to be miserable right? Big thanks for your advice!!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think asking for .5 mg/3 times a day is a good idea and if you can tough it out, your body should acclimate to the loss of the Clonazepam.  We have many members who are successfully tapering from Ativan, a few have to cross over but I believe most taper directly from it.

 

I like the idea of taking the path of least resistance right now, hopefully your doctor will agree to the 3x daily because you need some time to come to terms with what’s happened, I’m sure its a shock find yourself in this situation again. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think you are right, I am still processing all that has happened leading up to this point, so changing things up too drastically right now is probably not a good idea.

 

Thanks for your opinion on the the dosing. I will see if she can keep me at the 3 x 0.5mg for now to see how things stabilize out.

 

It seems that most people are dosing lorazepam from 3-5x a day right?

 

Thanks!!

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well, I couldn't get in touch with her since Thursday and have been trying to make the 2x/day work for the last couple of days. Needless to say, I don't feel great.

 

I get a new script on Monday for the 2x/day but will have her try to switch to 3x/day if I can. My question now is this: If I am going into really bad w/d symptoms tonight or tomorrow on the 2x/day, does it make any sense to use any of the leftover clonazepam I have to quiet things down, or will I just be introducing more chaos into the equation? I just fear having to go to the ER if things get bad and want to have some kind of plan in place if things get intolerable. Thanks again for all of the help!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I reinstated .06 Clonazepam twice/day late December just to somewhat stabilize. And I do not regret it. But I was not going to go over .25/day and risk w/d.

IMO-you just have to do YOU. Find something, anything to get you through the day of immense suffering.

Magnesium at night? Me: yes! Hydroxyzine only in a tiny sliver (affects my already difficult breathing), yes! AND: Propranolol. Just discovered it last week. My internal tremors, my every nerve ending on fire? I almost threw myself out of a window (not really, but…), it alleviates all of that-in 30 minutes.

Also, Methocarbonal. I take a tiny slive at night. It’s a muscle relaxant. My shoulders are boulders due to this unrelenting stress. It helps-a lot.

Many here completely disagree with ANY medication. Good for them.

Do YOU. Find something, within reason, to alleviate your suffering is merely my personal experience and advice. 🙏

Link to comment
Share on other sites

To add: I have wanted to go to the ER every day for 4 months. That’s my lizard brain saying: ALERT! ALERT!! And I KNOW would have to wait for hours (with this distorted anxiety?? Humpf), possibly be exposed to Covid and be sent home with maybe 4 prescriptions for the ZNEXT day, that I wouldn’t take anyway 🤦‍♀️.

So, I hear you-loud and clear. But, in the long run do you think it would help? Do you?

Sending you magic dust 🙏

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awe, thanks for the advice, suggestions and kind words Mary, really appreciate it! I totally agree with you about what will come from going to the ER, a whole lot of nothing! And you are right, the ER stuff is all a part of our fear mind saying something like "well, what if you have a seizure, then what?" Just a whole lot of fear based thinking going on there.

 

And I agree about everyone having to do them, whatever that happens to mean. What works for someone, might not work for another.

 

I just really want to get a consistent schedule going so that I can fully stabilize. I was given 5 days worth of 0.5mg, 2x/day clonazepam by one doc and then 5 days worth of 0.5mg, 3x/day clonazepam by another and after that I was told to only take the clonazepam 0.5mg 2x/day and taper off, so I think my brain is just fully confused at this point. It is also clear that I won't be able to just taper off either as I can tell I am dependent already. What a mess.

 

Thanks again for your guidance/advice. 

 

 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

My body can only handle.06 at a time-and I was on 3 mg/day for years!!! 🤦‍♀️

Maybe just take .06 at a time, see if that helps-NOW. Not prior, NOW!

And remember, they may be trained as doctors, but you and only you have a PhD on your body. Your mind. Your self!!

We’ll both be okay-spring is upon us-SOON! Sunshine and brighter days ahead!! 🤗🙏

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If you’re reasonably confident your doctor will work with you on dosing .5 3 times a day I’d start with that now and avoid the Clonazepam but if not and you need something to keep from going to the ER then I using the Clonazepam makes sense. 
Link to comment
Share on other sites

×
×
  • Create New...