Xanax dosing questions

[[Buddie]]

Hi spitfiremetalart

I just want you to know you can trust the information provided here on BB. You’re also not just trusting one person, because anything we post here is clearly open to scrutinisation. If one of us makes a mistake with the information we provide, then someone else will pick up on that mistake, as innocent as the mistake may be. This is one of the reasons why we don’t provide taper advice or information via the PM.

I’ve had doctors and hospital psych doctors with self professed 30 yrs experience in benzodiazepine withdrawal whom within minutes I immediately know they have absolutely no idea how to taper patients off benzodiazepine medications. I expect this is because they have been doing the wrong thing over and over for 30yrs, and god only knows how many patients have suffered because of that. I had one psych who didn’t even know the conversions between the different benzodiazepines and tried to put me on double the equivalent dose in a crossover. I called them on it and they just denied that I had any idea what I was talking about. I just had to dismiss her advise and follow my own knowledge. If I hadn’t have known, she would have caused me to taper for another year or two longer. I’m not bashing doctors, I’m just saying we have to be extremely careful when it comes to their knowledge of benzodiazepine withdrawal, which is why it’s so important we educate ourselves.

This is interesting.And you seem very insightful.
With myself I started  with .5 X rested and then another .5 X and sleep. That was 2 year ago. Predictably that evolved into 2mg per night in the same manner, ie less rest per dose leading to more dosing per night.
1. I wonder what might have been the result had I taken the whole 1 or 2 mgs at onnce whether it would have been more effective in terms of sleep duration.
I have experimented with 1 mg recently and noticed that it is effective for only about an hour, notreally achieving sleep, just pleasant relaxation or “euphoria” as is so often bandied about in defining “addict”s
2 After arriving here not more than 2 weeks ago, upon hitting a wall, ( interdisciplinary withdrawal ?) reading a lot, it became apparent as you point out that dosing once a day, no matter the reason subjects one to withdrawal during the rest of the 24 hrs, owing to the speed of Xanax clearance.
3 can’t believe I went 2 years like this.
In the past week I’ve spaced out my dose evenly to 4 times a day.
While I do seem more stable, (no inconsolable crying jags to my friends,) the depression of waking up to this reality is considerable.

4 I do wonder if splitting the .5  in half to .25 and dosing 8 times per 24 hr would yield any benefit.
Or perhaps just during the day like that and at night .5 and then another. . 5, 6 hrs later.

Or perhaps simply updosing at night by .5 to 1.0 for the 2 spaced out 6 hr increments
and then back down to the . 5 and .5 for the daytime portion to avoid WD.

5 gone is the good feeling from attaining that little satisfaction from . 5 msg in relatively quick succession, replaced with a relatively stable but depressed state of being. Functional perhaps if not totally depressed about what lies ahead.

6 I took it to sleep.  Tapering off of it or switching to V would not address that central issue.
Some suggest that V being a longer actor may address the sleep in the short term but Benzo sleep isn’t real in the first place and as I think you have pointed out, stability and Benzos is a rather oxymoron type situ to begin with, as often the thing one is trying to eliminate with Benzoes creates that very thing.

7 I was enamoured of the idea of taking a pill and getting to sleep because of that action.
Thought I had a tiger by the tail.
Now every time I take the stuff it just seems like continuing to take a life robbing poison.
I’ve got that tigers tail but he is turned his head and looking right at me.

[[Buddie]]

Hi [...]

Sorry I was very slow to reply. Couple of difficult days with withdrawal and influenza coinciding.

I just split this topic as to not interfere with spitfiremetalarts thread.

After splitting this thread, I realised jelly baby had already offered some thoughts on your dosing, so hopefully she’s covered your questions already, but if you still feel unclear about anything, just let me know if you still need clarity around any of the above questions, and I’ll be happy to answer. 

[[Buddie]]

I saw and laud your encouragement to lady liberty about her consideration to reinstate after having a bad go with switching to K I believe.
It seems so anathema to updose  but personally my misery and non function level is peaking.
Feel like I am losing myself,or have lost myself preservation instinct by taking this crap, but as many say we want to get the good out of it to stabilise.

[[Buddie]]

Hi [...]

I have to be at the dentist in 90mins (Australia), but I’ll have a look through all your previous posts later today to gain a better overview, and then I’ll reply tonight if there’s anything that stands out. I’m 4 days from my last reduction, so insomnia got me last night, but hopefully I can get a cat nap once I’m done with the dentist.

It sounds like your having a very difficult time, but just do your best to trust that you will find some level footing to get through this.

[[Buddie]]

I am having it bad.
Thanks for your consideration

[[Buddie]]

Hi [...]

How do you feel after spreading your doses out over the past so many days? Are you still getting the same amount of sleep, or less? If you are getting less, is it much less? Is spacing your doses out through the day a worthwhile trade for a higher nightly dose? I wonder if spreading your doses out and being more stabile throughout the day may actually help minimise any loss of sleep with the lower nightly dose? Also, just wondering if your mentioning a potential Valium crossover to jelly baby had any substance to it. Is this something you’re considering? I guess it depends on how you are doing in relation to interdose withdrawals with your change in your Xanax dosing schedule. How are you feeling now that you have some time under your belt after acclimatising to spreading your doses out?

[[Buddie]]

Thanks for your interest.
I am more stable,,,, kinda. Spreading it out allows me to work.
But really I am just resistant to taking the pills.
I am looking at a Doc who wants to cross to Klonopin. And then do a long taper
He seems very knowledgable and deals with all manner of addiction dependance.
Much debate here about Klonopin.
Right now as I sit here I feel miserable, but am resisting taking my morning dose.

Sleeping,,,, well it’s a bit like Ambien. Your awake then not, then awake bam!.
Not like any kind of normal sleep slumber etc
Dire straits.

[[Buddie]]

Thanks for your interest.
I am more stable,,,, kinda. Spreading it out allows me to work.
But really I am just resistant to taking the pills.
I am looking at a Doc who wants to cross to Klonopin. And then do a long taper
He seems very knowledgable and deals with all manner of addiction dependance.
Much debate here about Klonopin.
Right now as I sit here I feel miserable, but am resisting taking my morning dose.

Sleeping,,,, well it’s a bit like Ambien. Your awake then not, then awake bam!.
Not like any kind of normal sleep slumber etc
Dire straits.

Yeah, I understand about the abnormal sleep… I express it as a kind of chemical sleep. It’s been so long now that I don’t remember what normal sleep is, but I have got used to this different kind of sleep over time, including a lack of sleep.

I’m wondering why your doctor wants to cross you to klonopin rather than Valium, not that I really see anything overly wrong with it, but I just wonder why you would choose to cross to a very potent benzodiazepine that makes tapering more difficult because of the potency of one tablet. Even with scales it’s more difficult to taper. I wonder if he thinks after crossing you over, he intends to taper you in halves or quarters of tablets, which is a very bad idea because of the potency. Even if it you got away with a few sizeable reductions to begin with, you would more than likely have to follow a 5-10% taper reduction at some stage, which would mean using scales or a suitable compounded liquid suspension. If using tablets, any inconsistencies in scales are much more forgiving when weighing and tapering diazepam than a potent benzo like klonopin. I wonder if it might be worth finding out what’s behind your doctors reasoning for crossing you to klonopin rather than an even longer half life, less potent benzo like Valium. Maybe you could (gently) draw him on divulging his road map forward with your taper to see where there may be potential problems, rather than facing them down the track when it’s too late to change. As I said, I don’t have a problem with tapering from klonopin, as many members here do, but I’m just interested why your doctor would consider it a better option than Valium, and I wonder if that reason is because he/she hasn’t thought through the difficulties associated with tapering such a powerfully potent benzo, or simply doesn’t understand how small your reductions may have to be to remain functional throughout the taper.

I understand that resistance to taking the tablets, I went through that too, but I eventually had to give in to it, knowing there was no better way through the situation than taking the tablets at exactly the same times daily to try and keep my blood serum levels as even as possible while I slowly and gradually tapered in a way that would allow me to remain functional and maintain some small level of normalcy in life. We need to accept and to learn to work with the tablets in order to finally say goodbye to them further down the track.