I start the ashton crossover plan soon from k need some thoughts

i am going to do the ashton taper with valium and crosover from klonopin soon, it will takes five weeks to crossover, then I will taper from 30 mg. of valium using her schedule, or whatever I can tolerate. few questions, I know valijm cn make you depressed, also I hear all kinds of horrer stores how it was the hardest thign they ever did, and they werre having problems during the valium taper etc.. I am scared, I thought the ashton protocol was written to make it easier on the body not harder for months on end? If anyone has good stores about it please help me and let meknow I am terrified now!!

Thanks,

carriemax

i am going to do the ashton taper with valium and crosover from klonopin soon, it will takes five weeks to crossover, then I will taper from 30 mg. of valium using her schedule, or whatever I can tolerate. few questions, I know valijm cn make you depressed, also I hear all kinds of horrer stores how it was the hardest thign they ever did, and they werre having problems during the valium taper etc.. I am scared, I thought the ashton protocol was written to make it easier on the body not harder for months on end? If anyone has good stores about it please help me and let meknow I am terrified now!!

Thanks,

carriemax

All benzo's can cause depression, however I understand that Valium get's blamed more frequently then other benzo's for causing depression. What type of horror stories are you talking about? Switching to the valium? Or switching and then getting off the valium?

Keep in mind that a taper from any benzo is going to cause problems. From what I understand, valium is easier to get off because it's half life is so long and thus you achieve smoother declines in blood concentration. I have heard many people who do not take benzo's regularly say that valium "calms them down" but benzo's like xanax and klonopin "knocks them on their a$$" (valium has a milder profile of action is what they're indicating). Please share the stories that you have read because I want to look into them.

The horrer stories I heard were as you go lower sleeping maybe two hours anight fo rmonths and even after the last dose, and th4e anxiety. I thought it was supposed to get your brain used to slowly making gaba agian that is why they do it this way so the withdrawals and all the stuff that comes with it will be less?

Anyway just scared

carriemax

The horrer stories I heard were as you go lower sleeping maybe two hours anight fo rmonths and even after the last dose, and th4e anxiety. I thought it was supposed to get your brain used to slowly making gaba agian that is why they do it this way so the withdrawals and all the stuff that comes with it will be less?

Anyway just scared

carriemax

carriemax-

This process is not the same for everyone. Some have an easier time, some harder; this is a non linear process. I will say, fear will definitely get in your way...let it go, I did, you can too. The sleep issues that you read about may happen, they may not also. If they do, as with any other symptom, they are not permanent....remember that, okay. You can do this, you will do this....just take it step by step and stay in the moment. If you live in the past, it creates guilt, if you live in the future, it creates anxiety & fear. Stay present....you are not going through this alone. Many have come before you and many will come after. Keep your chin up OK?

Just Breathe

Well said JB. 

Except I might add that the only looking into the future that you should do is knowing that the symptoms of our tapers and withdrawals will eventually go away at a point in the future. ALWAYS tell yourself that there will be a day in the future when you look back on this ordeal and say "thank god I made the right decision for my greater health and happiness".

As JB has said, let go of the fear carrie. I know it may be easier said then done, but think of it this way: we're all humans on this board, and there have been TONS of people in your shoes (sometimes in much worse shoes), who sucessfully completed a taper, lived through withdrawal, and are back to their old, perfect selves (by perfect I mean they experience life as we should..with all of our emotions, stresses, pleasures, pain, happiness, ect...not a life dulled by benzos). That means YOU can do this. I can do it, so can JB, so can everyone else. As FDR so eloquently said: "The only thing we have to fear is fear itself"

That statement has come to define my mindset. I too was distraught, depressed, angry, mortified, and downright SCARED that I was in the position and was going to have to muster up the strength to get through it. After being here, thinking things out, reading some amazing posts (like JB's), I too have learned to let go of the fear. I am no longer scared. I am content with whats occuring, and to be honest with you, my mood and outlook has litterally gone from the dumpster to the stars over night. I even cut out my 5-htp (which was my antidepressant). I'm embracing this situation. When I get muscle aches, I think to myself "I cant wait until I can feel my normal arms again" or I say "wow, this is awesome! I'm healing!". I do not start to get down and think "when will this end!?!"...I embrace it in a positive manner. In some ways, we are so fortunate. Benzodiazepine withdrawal syndrome, though horrible to deal with, is not a health condition that will kill us, or that will be with us for the rest of our lives. I equate benzo withdrawal to a bad fever that instead of clearing in a few days, clears in a few months.

Anyways, I am POSITIVE you can do this carrie. So is JB and everyone else here on this forum. Though I love my best friends, the people on this board are the only best friends that I have when it comes to going through this ordeal, because we are the only ones who understand whats going on because we are actually living it. We will be here for you every step of the way, as we heal together and learn to live without these horrible drugs. Keep posting, keep pushing, and you will make it carrie!

Thank you thank you guys!!! Inspiring and positive, hotel yorba!! I needed to hear that!!! I am down to 1.5 of klonopin form 2.5 over a few eeks, now I am supposed to start the crossover to valium, however i am wonder if I should try to go lower on the klonopin forst, as valium is vey depressing and sedatign for me? The Dr. I am going to , detox Dr. who does the ashton manual seems to think not. Wants me to start the crossover soon. oh well, not sure whats best.

cariemax

Well said JB. 

 

Except I might add that the only looking into the future that you should do is knowing that the symptoms of our tapers and withdrawals will eventually go away at a point in the future. ALWAYS tell yourself that there will be a day in the future when you look back on this ordeal and say "thank god I made the right decision for my greater health and happiness".

 

As JB has said, let go of the fear carrie. I know it may be easier said then done, but think of it this way: we're all humans on this board, and there have been TONS of people in your shoes (sometimes in much worse shoes), who sucessfully completed a taper, lived through withdrawal, and are back to their old, perfect selves (by perfect I mean they experience life as we should..with all of our emotions, stresses, pleasures, pain, happiness, ect...not a life dulled by benzos). That means YOU can do this. I can do it, so can JB, so can everyone else. As FDR so eloquently said: "The only thing we have to fear is fear itself"

That statement has come to define my mindset. I too was distraught, depressed, angry, mortified, and downright SCARED that I was in the position and was going to have to muster up the strength to get through it. After being here, thinking things out, reading some amazing posts (like JB's), I too have learned to let go of the fear. I am no longer scared. I am content with whats occuring, and to be honest with you, my mood and outlook has litterally gone from the dumpster to the stars over night. I even cut out my 5-htp (which was my antidepressant). I'm embracing this situation. When I get muscle aches, I think to myself "I cant wait until I can feel my normal arms again" or I say "wow, this is awesome! I'm healing!". I do not start to get down and think "when will this end!?!"...I embrace it in a positive manner. In some ways, we are so fortunate. Benzodiazepine withdrawal syndrome, though horrible to deal with, is not a health condition that will kill us, or that will be with us for the rest of our lives. I equate benzo withdrawal to a bad fever that instead of clearing in a few days, clears in a few months.

 

Anyways, I am POSITIVE you can do this carrie. So is JB and everyone else here on this forum. Though I love my best friends, the people on this board are the only best friends that I have when it comes to going through this ordeal, because we are the only ones who understand whats going on because we are actually living it. We will be here for you every step of the way, as we heal together and learn to live without these horrible drugs. Keep posting, keep pushing, and you will make it carrie!

Hotel, how are you doing with your taper thus far. did you make a switch from Klonopin to Valium?  Richie.

Hi everyone!

I couldn't help but notice this posting. Torrio, I saw your reply to Job about switching to Valium. I am one of the members who suggested this method to them because of their sleep issues. You see, way back in Jan 2009, before I had ever known about this site, I discovered the Ashton Method for substitution/ tapering. I was at my wits end with the meds I was on, which included Clonazepam. I knew something was seriously wrong with my CNS. The doctors I saw were of little or no help. They simply kept telling me I had an anxiety problem. I told them that I was the first to admit I had an anxiety problem (otherwise, why would they have prescribed to me these drugs in the first place?). Anyway, I discovered the Ashton method at www.benzo.org.uk. This website has a link to Ashton's manual. If you are considering using this method, I highly recomend reading the manual first. I will include a quote from the manual: "For people w/d from potent, short-acting drugs it is advisable to switch to a long-acting, slowly metabolized benzo such as Diazepam (Valium).... The slow elimination of Diazepam allows a smooth, gradual fall in blood level, allowing the body to adjust slowly to a decreasing concentration of the Benzos. The switch over process needs to be carried out gradually, usually in stepwise fashion, substituting one dose at a time...etc."

Carriemax and HotelYorba, I am a success story now. I was able to use this method and I am happy to say that it has been over a month since taking my last dose. Did I experience difficulties? Sure. Did I need to adjust the schedule for my taper to slow it down if I felt I needed to? Yes. Was it worth it for me? Every 13 months of it!!! Do I still have w/d? Sometimes. Have I learned to deal with it? I have learned to respect whatever my body is trying to tell me, even if it feels like 'shouting' sometimes. Do I have more self-confidence? I can't remember I time recently when I've felt better!!

Keep in mind that the Ashton method is not for everyone. There are some people who experience depression, or who simply don't do as well using it. At first, I experienced lethargy after I had substitued all the dosages over and was taking straight Valuim. To correct this problem, I siply reduced the dosage down until I felt more comfortable. I know of some people on this site who prefer water titration. This is a method I was not familiar with/or didn't feel comfortable using at the time. To each his own way!!!

HotelYorba, I salute your bravery and words of encouragement. If anyone has any other questions, I would be happy to answer these.

pangelingua

Thanks pangal, sorry I have been off for a while have haert issues and I was in th hsiopital, but thanks for you words that are so positive!!

carriemax

Your welcome carriemax. I had to review the post because I hadn't seen it for awhile. Sorry to hear about your heart condition.

How is your taper going? Any difficulties? I know it must be difficult going through benzos and having other health issues. Let us know how things are going when you can. OK? Always remember to be gentle with yourself!

By the way, I love the pic you chose with the kitty! Very cute!!

take care,

pangelingua

Hi Pangel,

I just saw this. Actually I am having a hard time. The valium itself for some reason was nt helping with the sleep. They put me on baclofen, tyhen it stopped woking so well, so I cut it in half and took a small dose of doxiapn,I wish my sleep was okay with just the valium, at one time when I tried a crossover a long time ago I do rmember being able to sleep. I am starting to sworry as I can't function this way and don't want to be takign other meds. I have to get rest especially now and really have no home support. I am a little down today, barely slept last night. Anyway, maybe tonight I will sleep. I don't know. Seems to be the pattern. I just wish I could sleep with just the valium. It scares me a little.

carriemax

Hi carriemax!

Sorry it's taken me so long to respond. How are things going with the valium and with your sleep? Let me know as soon as you can.

Hoping things are going well for you!!

I'm doing okay, I am down to 18 mg of valium and sometimes baclofen for sleep and sometimes remeron, 7.5 for sleep. However the place I am going to is starting to try and rip me off as I had to be in the hospital for a couple of days, (have a heart condition). I have insurance it is just hard to find a Dr. who will do the Ashton Method. Anyway the woman whom I work with is great. For some reason I really fel like I can trust her, but the owner, is an ex addict, (I am not, just maybe an accidental addict, never took more than what the Dr. prescribed), anyway it seems he still has that addict mentality although he is clean, he is a shark. It feels lik ehe will use any excuse to sqeeze more money out of people. I don't like going to a place where I can't trust the people to have my best interest at heart. After I got out of the hospital I went in and adjusted my medication so I am stable again, and then I had to ask for a phone appt. instead of going there because work is completely insane right now. That is when he became a real jerk, he doubled my cost. I am not using my insurance there as they don't take it. They have n reason to do this, it is insane and it is really stressing me out that these are supposed to be people that help but they are thieves and liars, and Iam really angry. I wish I could find a Dr. that knows what he is doing!

Anyway, sorry to sound so negative, I feel like calling the better business bureu. I was doing very well until all this!! ;-)

carriemax