Wanted to update everyone

I’ve come a long way with recovery the past few years and especially the last six months. I finally put kratom, the drug Subutex and other stuff behind me. I learned that I shouldn’t be drinking at all right now. Currently I am on 3g of matcha green tea and I take about a 20mg THC edible daily. I take supplements too.

 

Supplements:

Calcium alpha-ketoglutarate (morning)

Citicoline (mornings occasionally)

Night supplements:

((Vitamin D3

Vitamin K2

Vitamin C

magnesium l-threonate

Melatonin (300ug)

Quercetin

Fisetin

Phosphatidylserine

Niacin (nicotinic acid, immediate release)

5-MTHF))

 

Before my heaviest meal of the day I take Berberine and a small dose of milk thistle extract to increase bioavailability.

 

I use NMN on days I microdose psilocybin which isn’t often right now. I also don’t want to use NMN daily because there isn’t enough safety data on this.

 

There are other supplements I take too like lions mane and other mushroom extracts but it’s not regularly due to the cost.

 

Benzo jump date was 10/8/2017

Kratom jump was 4/19/2021

Gabapentin and phenibut was stopped in summer of 2019 but there were a few relapses. I last used gabapentin once after an alcohol hangover on 11/20/2021. I took one 600mg capsule. This is my latest setback b “‘I feel like I’m healing from. I took my last Subutex dose on 6/30/2021. I used small amounts to get off kratom. I used small amounts of tianeptine sulfate as well and jumped off that 8/7/2021. So I have 6 months clean off any opioids.

 

I used kratom to deal with coming off gabapentin and phenibut in summer 2019 for a few years and it ended up to be a pretty severe situation. My dose was 10g a day for the majority of the time, then 15g a day. Then I had something happen with options trading and got screwed over during a market halt and lost $3000 then I started taking more kratom. My dosage would go up to 50-60g a day towards the final 6 months of my use. I kept trying to taper but it was harder than I thought it be because I’d just end up taking more kratom. I’d take a nap or something and wake up needing extra kratom for the day and it was off to the races and weeks of taper progress destroyed.

 

I needed a small amount of Subutex to deal with the kratom chaos. It just would not keep me well while tapering. I was just used to dealing with Suboxone from my past use as a detox tool and I only had to dose once a day instead of 12-16 times a day with kratom. I’d use like 4g every hour or something. Kratom becomes problematic at heavy doses. One of the most difficult addictions as far as cravings I ever had if not the worst. I also feel like I purposefully sabotaged my relationship with kratom because I was not able to take breaks from kratom use at 10g a day. I could not for the life of me quit the green sludge at 10g because it was too cute and adorable and had this novelty to it that would not go away. So I started abusing it so I can quit indefinitely or forever, because if I kept it at 10g I probably would still be stuck on it in permanent misery the rest of my life.

 

Now I’m doing much better. I play guitar and work. My health situation is still good with the fibroma I removed from my jaw. I feel like I’m finally healing more.

 

As far as benzos I’d say I’m mostly healed. I used crazy amounts of other drugs and supplements to help taper off benzos to avoid as much damage as possible and took some risky nootropics and research peptides. I had extreme, severe SI during benzo WD when my injury got re injured. The pain itself coupled to being in benzo interdose WD is what caused it I think, so it seemed okay to take some risk.  Gabapentin and phenibut did it’s own damage coming off but I feel it was a strategy that paid off for me overall. I tapered as slow as I could handle, the same with benzos and used supplements and whatever I could to cushion the fall. I’m not sure if the trade off was worth it but I suspect it was because I really struggled with benzos it seemed and I feel fine now. No headaches, I’m becoming smarter and happier and just don’t notice anything related to benzos. I think there is some gabapentinoid related stuff I’m trying to get over. I’m sure there is probably benzo stuff too but it’s just hard to telI. I think I’m healing from kratom damage now. I feel like I’ll have a better answer about how much benzo protracted stuff I have after I can fully heal from kratom.

 

Getting good at guitar helped me heal a lot. I played when I was younger but quit after selling my guitar to buy opioids when I was 18. So I had 4 years of trying to play Metallica songs. But now I learned alot of new stuff like funk, blues and lots of technical stuff. I’ve also been practicing Nichiren Buddhism. My guitar teacher introduced me to it. I try to avoid any extremes with it but I find it helpful to chant and pray. Other than that, I study stoic methods and Taoism. I still use the meditation app Waking Up to meditate and research ideas. That app is the best. I also silently meditate for 20 minutes a day. I use mindfulness as often as possible though and it’s something I try to integrate into everything now because this is what the app teaches. I’m reaching a state over time where I’m constantly meditating basically. My baseline reactivity to negative emotions is much lower now, so that initial jolt of anger that suddenly can come on, like while driving seems lower. I still get angry though so I’m not all the way there.

 

I’d like to just revaluate my healing progress in the summer. I’m planning a camping trip to some national parks this summer so hopefully I am more ready

Its good to hear from your Mamoot, you sound so healthy, I'm glad you're still practicing Nichiren Buddhism, I noticed a huge change in you when you began that.  I love that you're playing guitar again and challenging yourself to play more technical music. 

 

You've been through a lot, some of it self imposed but your determination to free yourself from these drugs shows your strength, congratulations. 

Thanks Pamster.

thanks for sharing, seems that you had a hard time,

 

if you may let me know,which nootropics do you think were your best choices and why? Does NMN over stimulate you? Did you have any benefit with 157 bpc?and did you use any other? thanks for sharing

Thank you for sharing Mamoot, Its so good to hear, that your doing better, playing guitar how wonderful.  Its been quite a journey, you have been through a lot!.    I think practicing Nichiren Buddhismstay has helped you.  Keep on doing what you're doing and carry on playing that guitar!!  life is going to get better and you deserve it!

 

Magrita

Thanks Magrita. A lot of things can help but becoming more spiritual has helped as far as giving me more hope. I rely on other things to cope though. I use emotional framing all the time and mindfulness and try to not overreact to anything. Also, accepting suffering and joy being part of life is what the Buddhist practice teaches. But it’s about growing from the suffering in a positive way. A lot of it is emotional framing but I use a stoic approach for that combined with the Taoist idea of Wu Wei. Wu Wei is about effortless action that results in forward momentum. You basically don’t go against the grain and use situations and your environment to your favor in order to make strategic moves that don’t squander your energy.

 

I don’t use bpc-157 anymore and it’s been a while but I remember some benefit from it while tapering benzos. P21, semax, selank, DSIP, and bpc-157 are things I’ve used. I want to be done with it though. But I’ve taken P21 last summer and a few months ago to deal with an alcoholic setback. P21 last summer was very effective and I was walking a lot. Like 5 miles a day. I was using NMN and psilocybin often. I respond very well to stimulants, so NMN made me feel better after taking it. But I wasn’t using a lot. 125-250mg of NMN is what I used. I’m in the process of lowering  caffeine but I can handle 200mg at a time and have worked my way up to 500mg a day in the recent past. I find coffee habit forming. My CNS is still frazzled to an extent though. I don’t use amphetamines  or cocaine anymore and would not want to.

I wanted to add that I’m no longer using Berberine or the milk thistle at this time. It is similar to metformin in its mechanism of action. Recent studies came out that metformin really can negatively affect exercise by lowering VO2 max, so, since Berberine is similar I don’t want to use it every day. It was a useful tool though for temporary use. It has other benefits too and lowers cholesterol levels. Berberine and metformin work by deactivating AMPK. So it may help prevent some types of cancer but at the expense of overall healthspan. I’m interested in increasing healthspan and lifespan.

 

Recently I switched my eating window to around 12pm-6pm. I don’t eat anything at least 4 hours before bedtime to increase autophagy and get deeper sleep. I also don’t use any THC in the evening or caffeine because they negatively effect deep sleep. Getting high quality sleep is really important.

 

I eventually want to stop using THC. It’s just difficult to quit right now.

hey  thanks for replying,  im a yerba mate drinker, a lot of cups everyday, 2 litters more or less dont know about the percentage of caffeine,  it is high somehow from soluble yerba mate  powder,  i react well to stimulants aswell, while you want to stop i look forward to oneday be able to smoke my weed, this was tsken for me due to this mrds.. i ended up on worst drugs

The problem with caffeine, especially too much is it destroys the more deeper restorative stages of sleep, that you desperately need to heal as quick as possible. I only use one caffeine dose, first thing in the morning. Currently it’s 3g or 1.5 servings of this aiya matcha green tea. I just toss and wash the powder down with water. It’s about 85-100mg of caffeine I think. I want to lower the green tea to 2g soon which at that point I will probably make the actual beverage with. For the longest time I would mega dose this product. It’s the ceremonial grade organic version.

 

THC is also a deep sleep destroyer which is why I try to limit it as much as possible. I don’t use it as n the evening at all now.

 

Side note: the next compound I’m looking into is called oroxylin a. It may help healing from benzo paws or damage because it acts as a negative allosteric modulator at the benzo receptor site on the gabaa complex. It also acts as a dopamine reuptake inhibitor and increases BDNF.

 

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oroxylin_A

about oroxylin I've been laying my eyes on this nootropic for a while and I was about to order it, do you have the study that points its mechanism of action on gaba a receptors?

 

i can't think of discontinuing caffeine and about the deep sleep phases, i have lately been sleeping well after 8 months of broken sleep because of cymbalta(terrible drug) after a week of use in a desperate attempt while i was suffering in the acute phase,

 

 

have you dealt / deal with any sensitivity in the nervous system to substances?  thanks for replying

The supplement I bought is called Sabroxy, and is a standardized extract of Oroxylum indicum. It contains Oroxylin A at around 10%, but it also contains baicalein, and chrysin to a certain extent. I know that baicalein is a positive allosteric modulator of the benzo receptor, but I never had any apparent issues in the past that I noticed. I realized baicalein was in it after the fact so I'm not really sure about this supplement anymore. I think it is worth experimenting with though. Baicalein has a pretty low bioavailability so maybe it won't be an issue and the oxocylin a. will be able to have an overall positive effect on the benzo receptor complex return to normalcy. Maybe baicalein will help the benzo receptor complex in some way, in a similar way to some people think reinstating helps. I really don't know. I don't know of any studies on this. This can be some type of study of an anecdotal experience.

 

After coming off benzos I was on phenibut and gabapentin. When I came off phenibut and gabapentin I took kratom. I found kratom was really good at masking my WD symptoms. At one point, I even found out that I was able to mask the negative effects of alcohol with kratom. I was able to get drunk on around 6-8 drinks while on kratom, and wake up the following morning, and take my usual dose of kratom and not really feel much negative symptoms from alcohol.

 

So, now that I'm off kratom, if I drink I feel the pain more, which is why I don't drink anymore again. Now, I'm just trying to heal. I feel like I get windows now for the first time since this all happened when I get enough days of quality sleep, in a row, and I owe this to cutting down on caffiene. I just use it once a day in the morning. I consider a window to be where you feel more like your old self than usual, but I'm not sure if I feel like my old self, because everything is new and different in so many ways. It is confusing because I still use drugs and supplements.

So I decided to try the Sabroxy supplement today and it’s having very positive effects. More energy and better mood and motivation. Other than that I’m using 100ug of huperzine A. and centrophenoxine 250mg twice a day. I’ve been lowering my edibles dose too. I’m going to try to bring it down to 10mg of THC over the next week or so from 20mg. I could probably do it faster if I wanted too but I just don’t want to rush it for mental health reasons. I do plan to lower the matcha green tea dose down soon too from 3g to 2g which will bring me at a pretty low caffeine dose.

thanks for updating bro, what doses of sabroxy? centrophenoxine is another one on my cart (on transit)i  have a thread with good info about this substance and im going to start a protocol with it, how this compound affects you? thanks for sharing

 

  http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=265632.0

I just took the suggested serving size in the container, 100mg. It says take it once daily.

 

i mean centrophenoxine,  your able to adress how it affects you? did you take a look at the topic about centrophenoxine and noopept? update how its going your trial with sabroxy if you can mate and take care

As long as you keep the huperzine A. dosage around 100ug or lower it pairs well with centrophenoxine dosages up to 500mg a day. Otherwise I feel more irritable and angry, and find that I get annoyed easier by stuff. It definitely improves intelligence and lucid dreams. The other night I had this dream where I grabbed a guitar and was floating and flying around with this guitar in my hands and thought if I held on to it in the dream would I wake up with it if I didn’t let go of it. So I opened my eyes and forced myself to wake up…turns out I didn’t wake up with anything but an urge to urinate though. The extra acetylcholine increases REM sleep. I did take a little huperzine a. before bed to induce lucid dreams though and took about 100mg oleamide to enhance the NREM stages of sleep too in case huperzine A. interfered with NREM in a negative way.

 

I noticed that after I took huperzine a. that following morning I took a larger than usual dose of 150ug and felt angry and manic. Huperzine a. has a long half life so I should have taken less that morning. Lesson learned

I’m also using around 150mg of the Sabroxy now. And I stopped using Noopept. I don’t use noopept and stuff like that for extended periods of time these days

So, I don’t plan on using the Sabroxy anymore for now. Not sure but it seems like the positive effects of it diminished. Could be other reasons but I plan to just use it once in a while from now on. I may take a break from the other stuff too and just try to isolate some variables.

The supplement I bought is called Sabroxy, and is a standardized extract of Oroxylum indicum. It contains Oroxylin A at around 10%, but it also contains baicalein, and chrysin to a certain extent. I know that baicalein is a positive allosteric modulator of the benzo receptor, but I never had any apparent issues in the past that I noticed. I realized baicalein was in it after the fact so I'm not really sure about this supplement anymore. I think it is worth experimenting with though. Baicalein has a pretty low bioavailability so maybe it won't be an issue and the oxocylin a. will be able to have an overall positive effect on the benzo receptor complex return to normalcy. Maybe baicalein will help the benzo receptor complex in some way, in a similar way to some people think reinstating helps. I really don't know. I don't know of any studies on this. This can be some type of study of an anecdotal experience.

 

After coming off benzos I was on phenibut and gabapentin. When I came off phenibut and gabapentin I took kratom. I found kratom was really good at masking my WD symptoms. At one point, I even found out that I was able to mask the negative effects of alcohol with kratom. I was able to get drunk on around 6-8 drinks while on kratom, and wake up the following morning, and take my usual dose of kratom and not really feel much negative symptoms from alcohol.

 

So, now that I'm off kratom, if I drink I feel the pain more, which is why I don't drink anymore again. Now, I'm just trying to heal. I feel like I get windows now for the first time since this all happened when I get enough days of quality sleep, in a row, and I owe this to cutting down on caffiene. I just use it once a day in the morning. I consider a window to be where you feel more like your old self than usual, but I'm not sure if I feel like my old self, because everything is new and different in so many ways. It is confusing because I still use drugs and supplements.

 

May I ask how was experience quiting kratom? My last severe symptom is muscle pain and spasms. I am ok with it, but I need something to avoid pain/spasms 1-2 days every 40 days, when I have physical work to do. TY