Measuring Cylinders, Spreadsheet for Water Titration tracking

updating:  I've found all I need to get started including a spreadsheet download in this next link to keep track of my Water Titration, check it out if you want to go that route on weaning-style Link further down for my choice of a little kit I'd like to use. I'm a bit OCD, ok, a lot  and from past experience in trying to get rid of a 30 some year addiction, and did most of the wrong things because I didn't even bother to look up benzos/clonazapam.  Live and learn

 

http://www.benzosupport.org/the_spreadsheet.htm

 

 

I'm so sorry, thought I could find the info on the boards but I am not finding exactly what I need and that is just how to pick out a Measuring Cylinder Kit?  I like the one's on Amazon, the kits, with cleaning brushes and droppers included and I believe I can go as low as 100th of a pill like Colin says in his Water Titration instructions.

 

I will be dissolving just a 1 mg tablet, and thinking to maybe stick with my .25 cut I've been on but a little nervous since last time I tried tapering I went too fast and had my left-side go numb for 3 days, 2 Summers ago.  People are going to get tired of hearing about that but I always want to explain how delicate this operation has to be    I think when I write my story, and that day is coming, I'm going to mention "never lose your sense of humor" atleast I hope I never do.

 

So I digressed there but I think starting at a smaller cut will be best since I'll be cutting each day like the personal story I read lastnight. 

 

Can someone tell me what they think of this kit and will it work fine with the Water Titration method of weaning?

 

https://www.amazon.com/s?k=100+ml+cylinders+for+titration&crid=1K0RE0TDHT4D3&sprefix=100+ml+cylinders+for+titration%2Caps%2C169&ref=nb_sb_noss

Ok, things/ideas have changed.  I just wasn't ready to commit to a plan I guess, that's partly due to my brain shorting out but I can't blame everything on that.  I am suffering from a definite lack of patience, especially for myself 

 

Water Titration is definitely the way I'm going.  I have my jars and syringes in about 3 days from Amazon.  I will be following this video below that Bob7 showed me, and I downloaded the Excel Sheet to fill in with my "plan numbers/cuts".

 

 

The only thing I am contemplating is I had already been doing .75 mg of my main dosage of 1 mg per day but realized it was more of a "add in as needed" because I was still taking all my pills, 30 of the 1 mg by the time my refill was due after the 30 days. So bottom line is I need a much more regimented "plan", so glad I'm here and learning.  The other part is that I haven't gone a whole month yet on .75 mg.  I really wasn't thinking, not to make an excuse for lying because I was, especially to myself. 

 

I'm so glad I have a chance to be healed from the damage done because my brain just is not working and I know that it is not just age but probably how long I've taken the drug.  I am having reservations about sticking with the .75, and starting fresh with cutting much less than .25 mg.  Some here won't know that my biggest fear is that I'll cut too fast and have another numbness event, my whole left-side went numb, but came back over the next 3 days.  I still have some spots on my left arm that are still numb.

 

If anyone wants to chime in, I would love to hear from you, I am still teachable and very open to hearing any feedback   I just hope this all makes some sense.  I re-read it and I felt like deleting it, but maybe someone will get what I'm saying.

I do not like you to pay for the same real estate twice.

 

You already reduced to 0.75mg.  If you can hold that for several weeks, it would be good.  I have seen many times when people updose, they find it harder to go back down again.

Ok Bob, it was bothering me to do that but I didn't know why, seemed "not a big deal" but yes, I can see where my w/d symptoms could end up worse, or just have these "wonderful" drugs mess with my mind telling me I need them.

 

My symptoms over especially the last 7 years have been extreme tinnitus which came on in 2011, my tremors have become worse, and the hot-sweats , insomnia, anxiety and depression, just everything worse even though all I do for good health nutrition/exercise I cannot believe can overcome those things any longer w/o getting rid of the drug.  Just too much good and what I believe to be reliable info, no matter all the push for us all to take a pill for everything

 

I'm having a bit of trouble deciding what to start cutting after the 25th when I get my full 1 mg tabs. I think the smallest, .1 or .2. I don't care how long it takes, I just want to be careful.  I don't want to cut and hold either, I am wondering if for me, length of time on the drug?  I don't think I "double" it each day, I think I just add another like:

 

Day 1  .1

Day 2  .2

Day 3  .3

 

Is that right?  I'm driving you crazy aren't I

You had already decided to do a liquid taper using this video

 

So now why are you asking about

Day 1  .1

Day 2  .2

Day 3  .3

 

Just follow the video exactly. 

I do not understand after the part where she takes out the first millimeter I can see she's doing that but after that like on the second day how much does she take out two milliliters and on the third day 3 ml that's what I'm asking I don't see anywhere it says and I'm sorry about that but if I don't know something I'm going to ask or if I'm not getting it I'm going to ask no one has to answer me

Your are correct. 

On day 1 she puts 1mL in the garbage and drinks the rest.

On day 2 she puts 2mL in the garbage and drinks the rest.

On day 3 she puts 3mL in the garbage and drinks the rest.

 

 

 

Your are correct. 

On day 1 she puts 1mL in the garbage and drinks the rest.

On day 2 she puts 2mL in the garbage and drinks the rest.

On day 3 she puts 3mL in the garbage and drinks the rest.

 

Ok, thanks so much for that.  I was doubling the number instead of just adding one to previous day, I mean in figuring out my "plan". I apologize for getting so abrupt. 

I watched the titration video and decided to chime in. 300ml of water - got it.  Then: 'just drop the pill in'. Hmmm, what size pill was that? 

 

Also - the waste factor.  I am not sure of the ever increasing amount of disposed product going down the drain.  1ml is pulled out and tossed, the rest is used, up until 299ml of water/pill (size?) is tossed out.  Seems to be a lot of waste involved.

 

On the other hand, if one reads the BENZO BOOK, there is a stated titration method in which no observable waste is noted.  He is somewhat vague in his instructions, or I am just benzo-brained out.

 

He takes 2 jars of liquid. (suspension or water, whatever)  Fills one jar to a determined milliliter and adds the benzo (not stated, but perhaps a 1mg tablet?)

 

He takes a syringe and removes 1mL and drinks it. His dose. Nothing is tossed out.  He goes to his second jar of liquid and replaces that 1mL he just used into the first - thereby diluting the entire solution in the process. 

 

He retains the first jar for 60 days (why 60 days - not specified) during his final taper, and by the time he reaches the 60th day, the solution in the first jar is diluted from replenishment from the second jar of liquid to thee point of something like 0.03%.

 

He does not mention refrigeration. (again - vague)

 

I think he started that liquid taper when he got to the 1mg/day point. 

 

But how much liquid did he put into the first jar?  Logic (what amount I have left) dictates that he only used a 1mg pill for the entire jar.  But why the 60 days instead of 30.  The 1mL dilution and inert replacement is easy enough for even me to understand.

 

The video with the other method uses too many pills and is wasteful, especially towards the end.  The Dupont method wastes nothing. 

 

Thoughts, suggestions, clarifications? 

 

How much liquid is supposed to be in Dupont's first jar, and is the pill a simple 1mg? 

 

 

I feel your pain, I mean, I think I do, but I've read so many things trying to figure it all out.  Some good things I've found is this link.  Just a ways down in the Q&A there's a video you might like looking at where the question is about accuracy. I'm sorry that I can't answer more of your questions because I'm just too new to this myself:

 

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=231363.0

 

 

..using a 3 percent discard each day?  I know it will take a year but I feel safer doing it this way.  Actually 2 months short of a year.

 

thanks for any feedback 

 

This is just the first few days of course.

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/0rooxi672n1s3c5/reduction%20plan%20for%20goldengirl.jpg?dl=0

I didn't notice I had shared a link to my dropbox, so here is one from my Amazon Photos account which you don't have to have an account to view.  I hope I can now get some input on whether or not I did this right for a "planned" 3 % reduction each day:

 

https://www.amazon.com/photos/shared/ijAV5RZ2TSK1J_wAnw9rfg.bXjVwmh9C0vf2xr2AFbAPL

..using a 3 percent discard each day?  I know it will take a year but I feel safer doing it this way.  Actually 2 months short of a year.

 

thanks for any feedback 

 

This is just the first few days of course.

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/0rooxi672n1s3c5/reduction%20plan%20for%20goldengirl.jpg?dl=0

As long as you follow columns 3 and 4, you are doing it correctly.

..using a 3 percent discard each day?  I know it will take a year but I feel safer doing it this way.  Actually 2 months short of a year.

 

thanks for any feedback 

 

This is just the first few days of course.

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/0rooxi672n1s3c5/reduction%20plan%20for%20goldengirl.jpg?dl=0

As long as you follow columns 3 and 4, you are doing it correctly.

wonderful thank you so much I am ready to start I can hardly wait 😁👍

I've been using valium for 20+ years.  Has no effect anymore, unless I stop using it.  Then I feel effects!

 

Decided time to get off the ride so to speak.  Almost 70, don't want to remain on these pills for life.  They tend to accumulate to toxic levels in older people because of our age.

 

Taking 20mg tablets per day using the 5mg size.  My plan of action is to try to get the doctor to change those 5mg pills to the 2mg size, staying at the same 20mg/day dose. Reason for this is that the 2mg pill cuts into a 1mg with somewhat more degree of precision.

 

When I am between 5% or 10% per week or 2 weeks near the 5mg/day dose I plan on thinking of asking the doctor (who is ready to retire - oh boy) to change over to an oral liquid solution which my medicare HMO covers. 

 

From reading - it is very important to be very precise in the low dose amounts.  Only liquid tapers can really do that.

 

I like the Dupont idea where he filled 2 jars,  1 had the benzo drug in it and the other was just regular water or suspension.

Each week he took out an exact amount with his syringe from the benzo jar and too that dose, the went to the water jar an replaced that amount he took out, thereby keeping the level constant - but also diluting it in the process. that is the genius behind that method, and there is no waste to toss out.

 

My HMO offers liquid valium as covered in the 5mg/5ml size.  I can only ask for a 30 day refill at a time due to laws and insurance rules.  I haven;t figured out the exact specifics as of yet, but I am going to switch to a liquid taper near the 5mg/day mark.

 

Then I hope for the best that my GABA things rebound back and let me sleep without anxiety and panic attacks.

 

I'll be hoping Bob7 or anyone more experienced chimes in as I am too new to all this.  But I can relate to doctors, and good nurses, leaving our tiny town for whatever reason   Also, I had thought about trying to get a liquid form of Clonazepam but never looked into it.  It's still a possibility for me I suppose, it would be a bit easier but I think I'll do fine with this home-made method of water-titration.

 

I also only notice the effects of the drug when I stop using it, even 2 days, I feel sick and when I take my dose I feel good again, except with the ailments I've developed since I started the drug in 88.

 

I also relate so much to the hope of GABA and Glutamate issue to be improved eventually, more quality of life.  I'm 70 but these days I'm thinking I could live to be 100 and I don't want to be sick and broken, who does right

Key,

 

If you really are going to get the doc to give you new script so you can take 10 pills a day, then you should just break the pills into 1/4 or 1/2 and taper that way.

 

Just keep a journal of your symptoms and after each reduction, hold for 10 days or until your symptoms are tolerable, whichever longer.

 

B

Bob:

 

I am taking the 5mg and splitting them into 1/4 little chunks using a pill splitter. I know - the precision is not worth mentioning, but I am up at a 20mg dose where a little doesn't matter too much.  It's when the dose gets down to 5mg and lower that everything needs to be spot on.  (reason for the liquid taper inquiry well ahead of time).

 

20 years of taking Valium: 1st @ 40mg/day, then reduced to 20mg/day.

Just started a 2mg taper this past Easter Sunday to 18mg. 

I am on Day-4 of a long long long journey.

 

I am looking at weekly reductions of 10% or less.  I will revert to 2weeks in necessary.

Asking for a replacement which in effect is an equal dose, but on paper screams a large number of pills might not be a good ides here in Florida, even though it is designed to make pill splitting easier for me.

 

If I am stuck with the 5mg's, then I will have to come up with a liquid taper plan using those in an emulsion of ever decreasing dose levels per milliliter.  There is no allowance for dropping pills on the floor ans asking for more, or having a small buffer around for contingencies.  My pharmacy refill valium every 30 days for 30 pills on the spot.  I ask for a refill a single day earlier - day 29, the world explodes.  Pharmacies close on federal holidays, hurricanes come through Florida, etc.  I am dealing with puckered up irrational people at the pharmacy every 30 days for this script.  It's almost a battle.

 

 

 

 

 

Be at peace.

 

Once you start tapering, you will build up a stash of bits because your taper dose is smaller than your script dose.

If anyone knows someone, or some material to read on folks that have completed a Daily Micro-taper successfully, I would be so grateful to read about it.

 

Under the DLMT group I'm only seeing folks do a taper and hold for days, months or weeks. 

 

Doesn't Daily mean cut daily or am I missing something?  I'm planning (see my signature if interested) a 3% cut only and see if I can handle that, if not I'll go less, and I'm starting with .75 of a Milligram.  I know I can change my strategy, but I'm just curious if anyone was able to stick to daily amounts, if they were small enough to not cause horrific withdrawals?

I bought jars off online, glass with plastic lids (just 2 jars) and metal, Ball brand and with plastic lids they leak   I tried my regular dose without a cut just to see how water titration worked for me and these jars are hard to drink out of for me.  I'm very concerned about doing it this way because there is water, and residue you can't get out just by rinsing, or I doubt I should say.

 

Maybe I am being too OCD, but this damn drug is nothing to be messing with that's for sure.  I hope some people see this as I just feel it's important for folks to know what happened today when testing out the titration.  Maybe someone can chime in and help me here because I'm supposed to start my taper on 25th and very nervous about it now.

 

The good news is, my clonazepam .75 mil dissolved very fast. I had broken the 1 mg's back on 25th of March so I had 2 pieces to put in slightly warm water, just a tad over room temp is all.  Thanks in advance for any feedback, Denise

Yes, Daily mean cut daily.  It is different from cut and hold.

 

Here is an example.

 

Cut and Hold:  Reduce X amount, hold for 14 days, reduce X amount, hold for 14 days, and so on.

 

Daily:  Cut (X divided by 14) every day.

 

 

Yes, Daily mean cut daily.  It is different from cut and hold.

 

Here is an example.

 

Cut and Hold:  Reduce X amount, hold for 14 days, reduce X amount, hold for 14 days, and so on.

 

Daily:  Cut (X divided by 14) every day.

 

Is this to me Bob7? Are you telling me how to do it dry cut taper?  I'm having a bit of panic, struggling with my decision to liquid taper.

Someone asked to explain the difference between daily and cut and hold.

Ok, got it.  Thanks Bob7